[RedPillUK]

Mass unskilled immigration decreases wages, amount of free jobs, amount of houses while increasing costs of housing, places in schools, places in hospitals.

In small numbers its manageable but in huge numbers will cause all these problems plus the problems that arrive from importing foreign communities into an existing community.

How you got this far without understanding these simple facts of supply and demand is beyond me. That's why I don't want to explain it to you further, I'm too lazy to check your posting history, but you're probably a woman or simply a millenial male too emotional and unintelligent to understand.

[LEMONed IScream]

http://www.jesushuertadesoto.com/article...migration/

Last bit of time I waste with you. Maybe you'll learn something though.

[Big Nilla]

(09-01-2015 05:20 PM)LEMONed IScream Wrote:  

I don't care simply because they do not affect me.

Logically, then, if we stick to your thought process above, you wouldn't care if someone raped your mom (immigrant or not) since it doesn't affect you directly?!

Since I don't want to assume (you hate assumptions), state whether you care if your mom is raped or not even though it doesn't affect you directly.

No relevance, you say (you demand relevance)?

Very simple, we need to know what we're dealing with here in regards to your mentality. If you don't care about your mom being raped or you think it doesn't affect you, you're an idiot... and your views can't be taken seriously.

And, if you do care, then it shows you're a rhetorical fraud (since it doesn't affect you directly... you stated you don't care about things that don't affect you), who doesn't stick to his statements in which case logic is pointless with you... and, again, you and your views can't be taken seriously.

[storm]

You two are behaving like children.

[LEMONed IScream]

This is about immigrants. Not about my mother being raped. Fallacious and irrelevant commentary. False analogy. Next.

(09-01-2015 07:19 PM)Big Nilla Wrote:  

(09-01-2015 05:20 PM)LEMONed IScream Wrote:  

I don't care simply because they do not affect me.

Logically, then, if we stick to your thought process above, you wouldn't care if someone raped your mom (immigrant or not) since it doesn't affect you directly?!

Since I don't want to assume (you hate assumptions), state whether you care if your mom is raped or not even though it doesn't affect you directly.

No relevance, you say (you demand relevance)?

Very simple, we need to know what we're dealing with here in regards to your mentality. If you don't care about your mom being raped or you think it doesn't affect you, you're an idiot... and your views can't be taken seriously.

And, if you do care, then it shows you're a rhetorical fraud (since it doesn't affect you directly... you stated you don't care about things that don't affect you), who doesn't stick to his statements in which case logic is pointless with you... and, again, you and your views can't be taken seriously.

[LEMONed IScream]

Either way, this is turning into a pointless shit fest.

If anyone wants to have a serious argument about this you are free to send me a PM.

[Dusty]

(09-01-2015 05:20 PM)LEMONed IScream Wrote:  

I don't care simply because they do not affect me.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[LEMONed IScream]

Good one, Brecht. Though not related with the situation. And you assume they're "coming for us".

(09-01-2015 07:30 PM)Dusty Wrote:  

(09-01-2015 05:20 PM)LEMONed IScream Wrote:  

I don't care simply because they do not affect me.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[RedPillUK]

Yeah I probably shouldn't have gone in with the personal shit, sorry everyone. I think I just got trolled.

I actually read most of that link.You should have just said you don't care about these problems as the article itself also accepts those problems.

t suggests you're going to try and deal with it while hoping the world goes to some libertarian utopia. You should have just said that at the beginning instead of all this.

I've pasted the conclusion of that article here.

Conclusion

The measures mentioned will not eliminate all the problems posed by migratory flows at present. They will, however, tend to diminish them and lead in the direction that should be defended by all freedom lovers. In any event, the final solution of the problems will not take place until the present-day states are dismembered into increasingly smaller political units and all their publicly owned goods become fully privatized.

Anyway.. back to updates of the EU migrants crisis everyone!

[TheWastelander]

I'm not a Stefan Molyneux fan but he has a great video on the migrant crisis.

[UncleSam]

(09-02-2015 12:03 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

I'm not a Stefan Molyneux fan but he has a great video on the migrant crisis.

Good video, I agree.

Although he gets a significant fact wrong. He thinks almost all of the estimated 800000 people come from the middle east to germany.

But official numbers give away that between 40-50% of these asylum seekers are coming from balkan states like albania, kosovo, serbia, macedonia etc. These people are merely welfare tourists because they get housing, money, free schooling for the children etc. Their chance to get political asylum or refugee status is basically zero. They are just exploiting the fact that german bureaucrats need a painful long time to process asylum applications. Sometimes it takes them up to a year or even longer.

German efficiency is turning into a complete failure these days when it comes to sending illegal immigrants back. We desperately need a Trump here!

[TheWastelander]

The usual suspects are pushing the open borders narrative especially hard today.

https://twitter.com/astroehlein/status/6...6281592832

Quote:

Andrew Stroehlein
‏@astroehlein
Czech police pull 200 #refugees off trains & mark them with numbers on their forearms http://bit.ly/1Q7xUvD

http://blisty.cz/art/78732.html



https://archive.is/tyFFD

Quote:

World Jewish Congress: OPINION - Closing Europe's borders is not the right answer to the refugee crisis

Wed, 02 Sep 2015

This summer’s TV images have been disturbing: Crying children, desperate women and men somewhere in Macedonia as they try to cross the border but are prevented from doing so by police and military forces wielding batons and spraying tear gas. In Austria, more than 70 refugees, including children, are found dead in a truck. In Germany, xenophobes torch yet unfinished new homes meant to house asylum seekers in an effort to prevent the refugees from coming to their town. And in Calais, every day refugees risk their life to somehow get to Britain.

Although in recent years we saw regular updates about the atrocious wars in Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan, and the conflicts in Northern and Central Africa, watching TV in our living rooms, these appeared to be far-away conflicts. But now, the maltreated people come in their hundreds of thousands to Europe. Oftentimes, they walk here. Now, Europe can’t just turn away from the misery any more.
Of course, some here are tempted to just bolt the door of the living room to prevent any more people from entering. Some EU countries are under the illusion that stepping up border controls is the best response to the crisis. It isn’t.
Europe needs to act now. It needs to act as one, and not each country separately and differently. It’s high time for a united march towards more responsibility.
Our answer can’t be to close the doors. Not only would it not work, it would be immoral. The often heard statement that it’s better to fight the causes of migration in the refugees’ countries of origin instead of letting them all come here sounds a bit cynical in light of the current situation in Syria and Iraq where each year tens of thousands are being slaughtered.

In our collective Jewish memory, this refugee crisis may be reminiscent of the situation in Germany 80 years ago. When Hitler took power in 1933, there were 500,000 Jews in the German Reich. About half of them managed to escape the Nazis through flight and emigration. Most German Jews who left their homeland did so with a heavy heart. Yet doing so was a life-saving decision.

Let’s not forget that back then, most countries also tried to keep their borders closed. At the infamous Evian Conference of 32 states in 1938, there was only one country that declared its readiness to accept a higher number of Jewish refugees: the Dominican Republic. The catastrophe - the Shoah - came shortly after Evian, and some Jewish refugees were still sent back to Nazi Germany although it was already clear what awaited them there.

Not only governments, but also many citizens have learnt the lessons from the Holocaust era, and through television and social media, we are today not just better informed about what’s going on in some regions, we can also create pressure on the politicians to act in the right way.

Clearly, there is readiness among many Germans to help the refugees. It manifests itself not just through donations, but also through a number of private initiatives aimed at providing support to people when they arrive in Germany in a direct and down-to-earth manner. Jewish communities and groups are also very active in this field.

This sends an important message, especially in light of the disturbing pictures coming from places such as Heidenau. Decent Germany is rising, and it is not just talking, but taking action.

Recent opinion polls which show that a majority of people in Germany want to help these refugees are a signal to the politicians: We will overcome this problem, we will help these people, we will welcome them with open arms, we will be able to shoulder this.

These people are setting an example. One is inclined to tell the German president: Award them the Federal Cross of Merit, and please do so quickly!

And to the German federal and regional governments, one wants to say: Provide support to these volunteers!

The importance of learning the lessons of History is highlighted in many speeches. But it also needs to translate into action. The president of the Central Council of Jews in Germany, Josef Schuster, recently put it very succinctly: “Germany has brought the world so much disaster and is indebted to so many countries that ours is the last country that can afford to reject refugees and people who are persecuted.”

Of course, to a lesser extent that also rings true for other European countries. Therefore, Europe must not just resort to reinforcing its border controls, it must create adequate capacities for humanitarian aid.

Solidarity cannot be decreed by politicians, it needs to be implemented by the citizens. In Germany, to the surprise of many, that is happening right now. It was the best possible response to the negative events in Heidenau and elsewhere in the country.

And in this regard, Germans can and should be proud of themselves.

This opinion article by the WJC's Deputy CEO for Diplomacy Maram Stern was first published in the German Jewish weekly 'Jüdische Allgemeine'.

Why is it that Israel gets to have hard borders and limit immigration, but America and Europe wanting to just tighten their immigration is compared to Nazism and the Holocaust?

[RexImperator]

I've got it. The solution to both the European refugee problem and the Israel-Palestine problem... Send all these refugees to Israel.

[Lizard King]

(09-02-2015 02:12 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

Why is it that Israel gets to have hard borders and limit immigration, but America and Europe wanting to just tighten their immigration is compared to Nazism and the Holocaust?

Because disliking immigration is bad. We should all be helping these economic migrants, I mean refugees.

Iceland said they would accept 50 Syrian refugees. They have a population of 300,000, so 50 is not unreasonable.

But an SJW thought Iceland was being mean and started a campaign to accept more.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...-call.html



It blows my mind how readily liberals accept what they are told. Not for one moment do they stop to think about the strain it will put on their nation. It doesn't matter about shortages of housing and widespread low wages, as long as they get to feel good about themselves and/or have their bullshit ideology amplified.


Also, it should not be called the EU Migrants Crisis, it should be called the EU Population Increase Program. That's what it really is. All the rhetoric coming from European governments is ignoring the most obvious option: stop them coming here.

[Belgrano]

Quote:

World Jewish Congress: OPINION - Closing Europe's borders is not the right answer to the refugee crisis.
(...)
Why is it that Israel gets to have hard borders and limit immigration, but America and Europe wanting to just tighten their immigration is compared to Nazism and the Holocaust?

Fascinating.
I´m curious, does the World Jewish Congress also have an opinion on that:

Israeli government to refugees: Go back to Africa or go to prison

Israel to deport Eritrean and Sudanese asylum seekers to third countries

Israel opens 'de facto jail' for migrants

African Refugees Hired to Build Fence to Keep Migrants Out of Israel

ISIS executes three asylum seekers deported by Israel



Here´s a reminder:

Quote:

Of course, some here are tempted to just bolt the door of the living room to prevent any more people from entering. Some EU countries are under the illusion that stepping up border controls is the best response to the crisis. It isn’t.
Europe needs to act now. It needs to act as one, and not each country separately and differently. It’s high time for a united march towards more responsibility.

Our answer can’t be to close the doors. Not only would it not work, it would be immoral. The often heard statement that it’s better to fight the causes of migration in the refugees’ countries of origin instead of letting them all come here sounds a bit cynical in light of the current situation in Syria and Iraq where each year tens of thousands are being slaughtered.
(...)
Let’s not forget that back then, most countries also tried to keep their borders closed. At the infamous Evian Conference of 32 states in 1938, there was only one country that declared its readiness to accept a higher number of Jewish refugees: the Dominican Republic. The catastrophe - the Shoah - came shortly after Evian, and some Jewish refugees were still sent back to Nazi Germany although it was already clear what awaited them there.
(...)
Therefore, Europe must not just resort to reinforcing its border controls, it must create adequate capacities for humanitarian aid.

[Libertas]

Call them out for their hypocrisy on their twitter. A lot of people are doing so.

This holocaust thing is really starting to wear thin.

[Constitution45]

I've noticed the media has amped up a lot of things, by showing images of dead children and attributing this to britain not allowing asylum seekers into the country. They really are pushing the emotional appeal by showing lots of images of young children crying, rather than presenting the true image, that its in fact mostly young men coming from the Middle East and Africa.

Most of this can be attributed back to the Arab spring, which essentially dismantled the boundary dictatorships which in a sense created a seal between Europe and the Middle East. This goes back to Huntington's clash of the civilisations, history is repeating itself.

[Akula]

^^^ yeah everyone in the mainstream media (even the financial news outlets like Bloomberg and CNBC) are trying to play on the common man's feelings here. No logic involved - kinda pathetic were still at this point with our terrible journalists and news outlets.

How anyone in Europe can say "sure bring in more" when unemployment is above 25% in the PIIGS and even higher in some age brackets is beyond me. The EU with all it's unelected and feckless bureaucrats is a sinking ship right now.

[lskdfjldsf]

Does anyone honestly believe that photo of the kid on the beach was taken recently? Theres likely an entire archive of heartbreaking photos stored from over the years. The more Hungary and others speak out, the more emotional troll propaganda you'll see released by the media. It's highly effective and dangerous all the same.

Typical German imperialism. They're incapable of letting their European neighbors live in peace. If they aren't invading with tanks and Stukas, they'll flood your country with foreigners to decrease nationalism, which strengthens the EU (make no mistake, its Germany's empire). To hell with Merkel, to hell with the moral imperialism.

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

I suppose some will sympathise with authentic refugees but I find it impossible to sympathise with the women depicted in the BBC article below. I sincerely hope this migrant crisis results in a new convention on refugees but I that's unlikely.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34118978

BBC Wrote:

The BBC's James Reynolds follows the progress of a young Syrian migrant, as she makes a perilous journey from Turkey to Sweden to claim asylum.

"I don't want to be Syrian anymore," says 20-year-old Nour Ammar. "Everything is hard for Syrian people. That's why I decided I needed to go. I'm supposed to go. I don't have any choice."

Nour and her mother, Islam, fled Deir al-Zour in Syria three years ago. Her father, who stayed behind, was killed shortly afterwards. She and her mother eventually moved to exile in Turkey.

For two years in Istanbul, she enjoyed a comfortable life. Nour found work in a hair transplant salon, and later with Turkish state TV. She learnt Turkish, went horse-riding and dyed her hair blonde for the summer.

But she wanted to start a new life away from the region. She aimed to make it to the Swedish city of Gothenburg where her brother lives with his young family. There, she would apply for political asylum.

How can she be considered a refugee when she has effectively settled in Turkey? This is idiotic.

[amity]

(09-03-2015 07:13 AM)Blick Mang Wrote:  

Does anyone honestly believe that photo of the kid on the beach was taken recently? Theres likely an entire archive of heartbreaking photos stored from over the years. The more Hungary and others speak out, the more emotional troll propaganda you'll see released by the media. It's highly effective and dangerous all the same.

Typical German imperialism. They're incapable of letting their European neighbors live in peace. If they aren't invading with tanks and Stukas, they'll flood your country with foreigners to decrease nationalism, which strengthens the EU (make no mistake, its Germany's empire). To hell with Merkel, to hell with the moral imperialism.

A few days ago, I posted an article on Facebook (not David Frum's one for 'The Atlantic') but something similar except a bit more forthright and hard hitting in it's language.
What I thought might open a few people's minds on the topic, instead backfired dramatically.
Nobody, not one person rowed in to support me, (even though I know some people share similar views to me), and I got several negative comments, mostly from European mainlanders and one person in particular was outright hostile.
I had no choice really but to pull the whole thing down, there could have been implications in terms of my job, etc
As much as I want to speak my mind on this to people, we're sadly at a place in time now where you can get yourself in hot water, by simply stating the facts, by looking at an issue objectively and questioning the mainstream view we're fed by the mainstream media.

[Cr33pin]

There are a bunch here camping out near the train station in Belgrade, It looks like a wild music festival just finished and people are still camping out afterwards.

[Constitution45]

(09-03-2015 06:58 AM)Akula Wrote:  

^^^ yeah everyone in the mainstream media (even the financial news outlets like Bloomberg and CNBC) are trying to play on the common man's feelings here. No logic involved - kinda pathetic were still at this point with our terrible journalists and news outlets.

How anyone in Europe can say "sure bring in more" when unemployment is above 25% in the PIIGS and even higher in some age brackets is beyond me. The EU with all it's unelected and feckless bureaucrats is a sinking ship right now.

Well our culture is built on emotionalism. In schools they no longer teach logic or reason, instead they focus on relativism and different theories, which you are to open study and revise to eventually repeat like parrots.
Its kind of expected.

Its very curious to see where all the voices who used to oppose immigration have gone to. It seems that they have all shut up now and disappeared. Western Europe seems to push heavily towards social engineering and globalisation, yet the rest of the world including Eastern Europe is taking a step back. Practically because they don't have the capacity to manage such waves of migrant but nevertheless its fascinating to watch.

[Constitution45]

(09-03-2015 09:14 AM)Cr33pin Wrote:  

There are a bunch here camping out near the train station in Belgrade, It looks like a wild music festival just finished and people are still camping out afterwards.

Out of interest, what are the local serbs saying about the matter ?

[Guitarman]

Slovakia has the right idea, shame the UK won't do the same!