[jariel]

I like to talk about a lot of issues that are directed towards guys who have women in their lives. I understand the struggles of truly single men who are trying to navigate the muddy waters with women who are more venomous than pufferfish. However, I'm not a truly single man, so sometimes the topics of discussion that I'm feeling in a particular moment are ones that I have been through and/or currently going through.

In the course of every meaningful relationship, men and women make mistakes. There's no such thing as a perfect relationship. However, sometimes there comes a time when you realize she's made too many mistakes, and you don't want to deal with them anymore. You'd rather move forward without the other person than go backwards hoping to recreate the past when all was well.

The decision to leave a woman behind is never easy.

In the course of doing so, more often than not, we actually try to spare the woman's feelings. We don't always tell her that she's not good enough, we realized that we can do better, and we just don't want her anymore.

Regardless of how it all unfolds, women will play the victim. They'll forget all of the positive things that you done for their lives and focus on the few bad moments that make you seem like a bad guy. They'll find refuge from friends who'll tell them "You can do better" and "He wasn't shit anyway". They'll have rebound sex with some beta orbiter who was running convenience game, some guy from school, work, etc. to try to feel better about themselves.

But you didn't just wake up one morning and for no reason say "I'm done". She motivated you to do so. It was her actions and inactions that led to your decision.

The one thing that she fails to realize and that you have to remember so you don't go back to her, is that she was given an opportunity to show and prove that she was your chick, that she was worth going through life with, and that you didn't need to a "better" chick.

Some guys have been dating girls on a real level and some have been engaging in fuck-buddy relationships with girls for years, and the relationships aren't going anywhere, why is that?

A chick has been in your life for two years, and she hasn't proven to you that she's worth any more than getting fucked from time to time?

A chick has been your girlfriend for three years, but you know you don't want to marry her or establish in any way that to you she is family?

When you have given a woman an extended period of time to be in your life that means she has been given ample opportunity to prove her worth to you. The fact that you're leaving her solidifies that she has failed to do that.

Rather than accept their responsibility for that failure, women direct their anger towards you and tell themselves they were wronged.

No.

Ultimately, you decided that the risk of going back out into the world alone and choosing to navigate those muddy waters, going through a number of women in the process to find someone better who you could possibly move forward with was more appealing than the risk of the continued misery of staying with someone who wasn't worth being with on a path to nowhere.

[kaotic]

Now more than a ever a man needs to realize his self worth and evaluate if a woman truly deserves to be in his life.

I agree that a woman should be told the reasons you're dumping her, you should be transparent, and honest.

It just might be a reality check on how to act as a woman and as a girlfriend/wife.

Problem is, typically a woman won't accept responsibility and hamster it away, because of course she can do no wrong.

[rudebwoy]

Some excellent information here.
Most guys stay with women because they want companionship. I have always moved on from women after two years because it becomes stale and they expect relationships to advance.

[FANATICAL]

Great post OP... I recently let a long term best friend/FB fade away. She could have had potential to date if she had improved in the areas I always commented on but she didn't. I was just thinking about it all and your post really clarified how I should view it. Cheers.

[SouthernCasanova]

Signed for truth. If the girl can't prove worth, it must not be present.

[Akula]

Another good one Jariel.

These girls get their shot at the champ but they should only get one title fight after then it's over. The very nature of relationships means almost all of them will miss their chance.

Relationships are always tricky and often it's tough to go cold and move on. I still have a hard time dropping girls, and tend to try to fade away or go beta on many of them or just outright lie that "I'm moving" or "leaving the country" for a new job so I guess I'm not always giving them the full truth. So be it. We had our good times and I don't owe them anything, and I know I need to press onward and there are other women out there.

It's funny but many of the girls I've moved on from somehow manage to frame it up as they being the ones who broke it off. Women can rationalize almost anything, especially when they can't figure out why something went wrong.

For me and many guys who were taught to pedastalize women by their single moms it's tough to turn it on its head and look at it as if "she needs to prove herself to me" and actively monitor their behavior (and if need be drop them) but once you do it makes a big difference. It also gives you a much better sense of self-worth and confidence in knowing that you are the one doing the choosing & dumping at least much of the time.

As you get older and see how all these girls behave you realize that many (most?) women just aren't good candidates for LTRs or motherhood, so you will need to know when to move on.

[Jungle]

This is gospel Jariel. I'm living through this at the very moment.

She forgot the years and years of investment together, and now talks about the whole relationship in a bitter way simply because I was the one who ended it with her, when in reality we were the best thing to ever happen to each other.

I have no doubt that she was hurt, and I empathised and genuinely listened to her through the whole break-up, I mean, to love is to hurt... but she was convinced this is a one-way street and that she was the one on the receiving end, as though both parties weren't hurt. It was dripping in self-righteousness to rationalise away the lack of introspection and self-critique.

Now I know we all have these coping mechanisms and hamsters in our head to help us deal with pain, but there's no need for women to cry foul that they have been the victim when the truth is humans are simply a self-interested species, and we do things for as long as they bring us growth.

Her affinity for "playing victim" was so heavily ingrained into her behaviour that I must say it was not only something that came after the break up but actually one of the reasons that we broke up because it plagued our whole day-to-day LTR.

Anyways, thanks OP this post really helped me crystalise this phenomenon and was very timely.

[262]

This one was a little repetitive for me, though reminders are always helpful.

I'll definitely echo what others have said about these sessions though - they'd be golden on Return of Kings, where you'll probably enlighten more newbies.

[RawGod]

One thing to remember when you dump a woman:

She'll have sex with another guy within 48 hours. If you change your mind a few days later and want her back (stupid of course, but we're only human) you better accept that she's probably done that already.

[getdownonit]

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Some excellent information here.
Most guys stay with women because they want companionship. I have always moved on from women after two years because it becomes stale and they expect relationships to advance.

Two years, give or take, is the limit before making the serious decision one way or another.

[RawGod]

(03-27-2018 05:42 PM)getdownonit Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Some excellent information here.
Most guys stay with women because they want companionship. I have always moved on from women after two years because it becomes stale and they expect relationships to advance.

Two years, give or take, is the limit before making the serious decision one way or another.

I think that's a decent upper limit. But a year should be enough to decide if you want to wife a woman up. Especially if a woman is over 25, cut her loose sooner as her eggs are declining faster than your sperm.

[getdownonit]

(03-27-2018 07:00 PM)RawGod Wrote:  

(03-27-2018 05:42 PM)getdownonit Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Some excellent information here.
Most guys stay with women because they want companionship. I have always moved on from women after two years because it becomes stale and they expect relationships to advance.

Two years, give or take, is the limit before making the serious decision one way or another.

I think that's a decent upper limit. But a year should be enough to decide if you want to wife a woman up. Especially if a woman is over 25, cut her loose sooner as her eggs are declining faster than your sperm.

No doubt.

(06-10-2015 10:26 PM)jariel Wrote:  

The 1st Quarter
The first quarter begins after a man and a woman have sex. Most men make the mistake of believing that after they've had sex with a woman that they've conquered her pussy. Some men are shocked when after that first encounter there isn't another one. That's because sex was just something that took place in that moment, but it was just a moment, not the beginning of a relationship. Men can't assume that every girl who comes across their path is going to be their next girlfriend. Some of these women are just moments; they happen, and then they're over. Women we meet in clubs, like Jenna, should be assumed to be moments.

I'm not saying to prejudge situations and say that a girl you meet at a club and bang can't become your girlfriend, I'm just saying, I'd expect nothing more than that particular fuck, and then I'd allow her to communicate to me that she is looking for more out of the relationship.

The first quarter is pivotal because a thought process has to be formed, either the girl was a moment or you're going to play the game with her, and if it's the latter, we're headed into the second quarter of action.

The 2nd Quarter
The time period between the first two quarters is brief. You'll be in the second quarter for anywhere from three to six months. Once you're in the second quarter, there's a relationship that has been established. The girl you're dealing with is either your girlfriend, which means that your relationship is being constructed on more than just casual sex or she's your jump-off, which means that the relationship is only about casual sex and shouldn't make it past the second quarter.

If it's the former, then after a set amount of time in which you've had a chance to become a part of each others lives and a chance to get to know each other better, then it's likely she'll make it back to the locker room with you for Halftime before the third quarter begins. If it's the latter, then you need to use Halftime to drop her off. Too many men are engaging in long-term relationships with jump-offs, those are DOA relationships in which men are breaking fundamental rules that will only lead to more drama than what is absolutely necessary when shit eventually goes left, and it always does.

Halftime
Halftime is a necessity when you've come to the realization that the girl you're with is in fact what you would consider to be your girlfriend or that it is time to end a relationship with a jump-off. Please feel free to run through the Jump-Off Rulebook; if you are breaking rules on that list, then you are treating her like your girlfriend even if that is not your intention.

When you reach this point, it is imperative that you take a week off from her, what we will call Halftime. The break can be easily accomplished by letting her know that you have to go out of town for business or for family reasons. If you're ending the relationship, use this separation to go no-contact and never speak to her again. If you care for the girl, and view her as your girlfriend, then don't disappear entirely, keep in touch via text and/or short phone calls, but do not communicate with her on a regular basis. With this break, the point is to take some necessary time off from the relationship so that you can get your mind right about your real feelings about this girl -- at this point, you may start to realize you're beginning to love her, or you may even come across some other pussy that makes you realize that your feelings are overstated and you need to take a break, it also allows her to get in check with how she feels, they say "absence makes the heart grow fonder."

If you emerge from Halftime with a readiness to continue the game, then let the third quarter begin.

The 3rd Quarter
In the third quarter you'll be comfortable enough to expose your relationship to your outside world, one that in the beginning you should keep sort of distanced from her.

Men make mistakes by introducing their girls too quickly to people who they actually give a shit about, furthermore, they tend to expose them to parts of their world that mean something to them -- they take them to their favorite restaurant, club, etc. then when the relationship goes left, those places are ruined because they don't want to go back to them and potentially run into her.

At this stage of the game, it's likely that you're ready to make her a deeper part of your world. Remember, your girl is a reflection of you, you should want the people whose opinions you care for to give you props for the woman you've allowed to become a part of your life, if she's not that type of woman, then she should have already been taken out of the game.

It's highly likely you'll be in this quarter of the game for at least another six months to a year before you can be reasonably ready to proceed.

In John T. Molloy's book, Why Men Marry Some Women And Not Others, he found that most men are ready to propose after 18 months.

When you get to that stage of the game, you're in the fourth quarter.

The 4th Quarter
If you've made it to the fourth quarter, this is a serious relationship territory in which you've played the game with her, you've made her a part of your daily life, you've exposed her to the most intimate parts and people in your life, and you're moving towards making your life about her and taking her wants, needs, and expectations into account as it pertains to everything.

Furthermore, it's likely you're well out of the infatuation stage, and you've gone through some ups and downs with her in the relationship, yet you two are still standing tall.

In this quarter, men will think about co-habitation -- which I'm FIRMLY against -- marriage, and starting a family with the woman. At the two-year mark if you're still not interested in pursuing any of those avenues with the woman you're with, then it should be clear to you that she's not the right woman -- having this conversation assumes you're at an appropriate age where it actually makes sense to think about these kind of life-changing decisions, which for me doesn't really begin until you're somewhere between 26-30, anything below that, don't even put your uniform on.

[456]

@getdownonit -- the jariel threads, despite his occasional detractors, always warm my heart when bumped.

Crucial fundamentals, many latecomers would do well to review.

Being real about the above "Quarters" is key. By the time you realize you're stretching something too far or being less than honest with her, you've already been deluding yourself for several rounds.

Girls can tell when a guy is too puss to end things or ramp things down, regardless of how infatuated she still is.

The subtle time off is important -- make sure you aren't conflating "fuck this relationship" thoughts with your own stresses and neglect of solo meditation time. Take action to restore that kind of unstructured personal time; use frame to check her expectations of how frequently you have to hang or text/call.

Always good to remind a girl how your strengths, accomplishments, that helped her fall for you only came about because you took full advantage and control of your own time, growth, self-love and attention. (Frame is important here, you aren't trying to ditch her to have more beer nights with soyfriends).

It's a great opportunity to test a girl's character -- she'll react emotionally, but if she's Real, she'll understand and respect and snap back into "oh wow I have been a little clingy -- yes let's be more balanced" if that was what you were going for.

I often have to do this, once girls get too deep, and we get to that "planning to NOT hang out" phase, I have to be honest about needing space or else needing to be Out. Often a little space can help re-spark things. I don't mean a break, but just reducing hang / check-in frequency.

This has been a bit of a ramble, but there's a lot to getting the meta-LTR-game down, as far as just making sure YOU get what YOU NEED. That's the fairest way to be -- why break a girl's heart if you haven't simply asked/demanded what you need out of her first?

Common theme with jariel and others on here.