[Samseau]

Pretty badass... shows how it's done. Few notes:

1.) Was smart enough to FILM EVERYTHING... smartphones are as powerful a weapon as guns in today's internet age.

2.) Remains calm and holds his ground even when cop reaches for his phone. Unbelievable the cop tried to do that.

3.) I would have been a bit more polite, but the finish was exactly how any man should be. "Get a warrant."

4.) Man knew many Supreme court cases about what rights a citizen has.

[Ziltoid]

Winning hearts and minds, as usual.
Not for one second did these officers believe this guy was harboring said wanted felon, their egos were bruised that the guy dared to hold a cellphone (and *gasp*, not turn it off when they said so). So enraging was the idea of being held accountable for what they say/do during an exchange that they wasted two and a half minutes of antagonistic banter with this guy instead of searching for the guy who was supposedly a dangerous criminal.

In before jimukr104.

[Foolsgo1d]

And all it'll take is the cop to be an asshole and laugh at him. Then mush his face into the ground and report whatever he wants.

Citing cases doesn't prevent you getting a truncheon up your ass with US cops from what I gather over the years.

[runsonmagic]

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

[YossariansRight]

Good for this guy.

Although shit like this can be prevented by simply not answering the door. Years back, I had 911 knocking on my door; I didn't answer and they went away. I never did find out why they were at my door (I live solo, so it's not like I called 911 on myself). Most likely they had the wrong address, but I wasn't about to deal with a situation, especially at ~Midnight. Fuck that.

It's amazing the headaches and problems that can be avoided by not answering the door or the phone or even emails.

Folks need to stop being sheep and think. Again, good for this guy for thinking.

[YossariansRight]

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

[Malekhit]

He was lucky this didn't happen http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2aa_1409611588

TL;DW: couple guys film at the beach. Then police come, slams them into the ground for filming in public space, then they remove videos from cameras and videos from the store clerk. Destroy their equipment and not filing any reports.

[runsonmagic]

(09-04-2014 06:20 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

I've watched a few. I knew cops have to identify themselves as cops and show ID if requested, can't enter, or search without warrent, etc. but I didn't know the ID thing. You're only required to show ID if driving, correct?

[YossariansRight]

(09-04-2014 06:48 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:20 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

I've watched a few. I knew cops have to identify themselves as cops and show ID if requested, can't enter, or search without warrent, etc. but I didn't know the ID thing. You're only required to show ID if driving, correct?

Nope. Fresh off the press: If you're riding a bike they can get you too:

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massach...headline_3

[jamaicabound]

Like others have said don't answer the door in the first place. Props to the guy for standing his ground and stuff but cops can be vindictive and have a lot of power, better off just avoiding them and not making them walk away with their tail between their legs in the first place. Let them kick in the door if they wanna come in so bad, which they won't, but if they do you got a big lawsuit there. Just got finished watching this new show called nowhere to hide about this PI and some of his cases and one particular case was a cop that had an issue with some family over the daughter beating a ticket. Proceeded to stalk the family for the next 5 years before framing the son for assault with a knife. Cops have all the power and oftentimes not a lot of oversight so better off not pissing them off if possible. If it relaly comes down to it though definately stand your ground.

[YossariansRight]

(09-04-2014 07:46 AM)jamaicabound Wrote:  

Like others have said don't answer the door in the first place. Props to the guy for standing his ground and stuff but cops can be vindictive and have a lot of power, better off just avoiding them and not making them walk away with their tail between their legs in the first place. Let them kick in the door if they wanna come in so bad, which they won't, but if they do you got a big lawsuit there. Just got finished watching this new show called nowhere to hide about this PI and some of his cases and one particular case was a cop that had an issue with some family over the daughter beating a ticket. Proceeded to stalk the family for the next 5 years before framing the son for assault with a knife. Cops have all the power and oftentimes not a lot of oversight so better off not pissing them off if possible. If it relaly comes down to it though definately stand your ground.

Damn right. If confronted with a prick cop (or 2), t's a very fine line between "standing your ground" and "assault, battery and resisting arrest".

Use common sense: Don't answer the door. Don't drive at 4 AM on holiday weekends. Make sure you check your brake lights, signals, etc. at least once a month. And ALWAYS stay calm, no matter how hard it may be - let the cops be the aggressors.

Understand that there's shit lurking out there and avoiding it can be very, very easy to do in many cases.

[Sp5]

(09-04-2014 06:52 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:48 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:20 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

I've watched a few. I knew cops have to identify themselves as cops and show ID if requested, can't enter, or search without warrent, etc. but I didn't know the ID thing. You're only required to show ID if driving, correct?

Nope. Fresh off the press: If you're riding a bike they can get you too:

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massach...headline_3

There's law to say that nobody, in the absence of real facts creating probable cause or a reasonable suspicion of crime, has to identify themselves to the police.

The case was Kolender v. Lawson 461 U.S. 352 (1983). Lawson was an eccentric black guy with dreadlocks who used to take long walks, often through white neighborhoods around San Diego. He was constantly stopped and asked for ID by the police. He had no ID, so he was repeatedly arrested.



Finally, his case went to the Supreme Court, which ruled that nobody had to provide ID or even their name unless the police knew facts that amounted to a reasonable suspicion that the person had committed or was going to commit a crime.

I remember that Lawson had his 15 minutes of fame, I saw him on David Letterman's show back then.

The question is, do the police have facts amounting to reasonable suspicion of you and you don't know it? For example, they could have the description of a criminal which closely matched your appearance. Not "white guy" but "white guy aged around 20-30 dressed in jeans and a white shirt in the vicinity of . . . "

[YossariansRight]

(09-04-2014 08:55 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:52 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:48 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:20 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

I've watched a few. I knew cops have to identify themselves as cops and show ID if requested, can't enter, or search without warrent, etc. but I didn't know the ID thing. You're only required to show ID if driving, correct?

Nope. Fresh off the press: If you're riding a bike they can get you too:

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massach...headline_3

There's law to say that nobody, in the absence of real facts creating probable cause or a reasonable suspicion of crime, has to identify themselves to the police.

The case was Kolender v. Lawson 461 U.S. 352 (1983). Lawson was an eccentric black guy with dreadlocks who used to take long walks, often through white neighborhoods around San Diego. He was constantly stopped and asked for ID by the police. He had no ID, so he was repeatedly arrested.



Finally, his case went to the Supreme Court, which ruled that nobody had to provide ID or even their name unless the police knew facts that amounted to a reasonable suspicion that the person had committed or was going to commit a crime.

I remember that Lawson had his 15 minutes of fame, I saw him on David Letterman's show back then.

The question is, do the police have facts amounting to reasonable suspicion of you and you don't know it? For example, they could have the description of a criminal which closely matched your appearance. Not "white guy" but "white guy aged around 20-30 dressed in jeans and a white shirt in the vicinity of . . . "

You're right! But the bottom line is, does anyone really want to get into a pissing contest with the police? Better to avoid them as much as possible, IMHO.

[Double Salad]

I wish I could find the exact video explaining generally explaining this type of encounter, but you can distill it all down to legality questions, which the man did.

Am I under arrest?
Am I being detained?
Am I free to go?
Do you have a warrant?

Never let them in your house, search your car, or access to your property, etc. Its my understanding, that the above type questions force the law into a situation with police. The man at the door was correct in using the phrase 'color of law', which is how a lot of police operate nowadays.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

"Would you allow us to come into your house?" (So that we can plant some drugs on you.)

Something tells me that the conversation would have gone very differently in New York, but at least he managed to hold his ground this time.

[DJ-Matt]

I believe the TLDR on showing ID is this, public property, Yes. Private property, No.

[The Beast1]

(09-04-2014 08:55 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:52 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 06:48 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

[quote] (09-04-2014 06:20 AM)YossariansRight Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

There were many videos put out by the ALCU on YouTube dealing with all types of stuff like this. They were quite educational.

I've watched a few. I knew cops have to identify themselves as cops and show ID if requested, can't enter, or search without warrent, etc. but I didn't know the ID thing. You're only required to show ID if driving, correct?

Nope. Fresh off the press: If you're riding a bike they can get you too:

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massach...headline_3

In the eyes of the law, a bicycle is considered a "motor vehicle". The woman ran the red light which is a constant problem here in Boston. I almost t-boned a bicyclist here in town when driving because the dip shit ran a red light. The woman who got arrested on the bike deserved the ticket she got.

They need to follow the rules of the road and understand where they fall in the transportation food train:

Pedestrian > bike/ motorcycle > motor vehicle > bus/truck > tank

As for the OP, he was 100% in his right and I support what he did. Never let cops in without a warrant.

[Double Salad]

Following the youtube link posted in the description provides a decent looking informational site.

Free Thought Project

[Cattle Rustler]

Man, I'm starting to see some beta-ism on this thread.

Some of alphas are having trouble keeping their frame straight.......they can maintain frame with broads but not with the popo.

[Samseau]

(09-04-2014 10:30 AM)Double Salad Wrote:  

Following the youtube link posted in the description provides a decent looking informational site.

Free Thought Project

That is a cool site... look at one of the apps advirtised on it:

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/revolut...nt-police/

Quote:

Before the creation of this app, there were two big problems with security in the United States.

1) Security —police, firefighters, ambulances— is bureaucratic, slow, and ineffective. The average wait time for an emergency is just over 10 minutes; but that number goes up fast if you’re in a poor or minority neighborhood. Many people wait over an hour after calling 911 before police or firefighters even show up. Last year in Detroit, one woman waited an entire day after calling 911 to report an in-progress burglary.

Even when police respond quickly, it’s rarely fast enough. The average interaction between a criminal and his victim is 90 seconds, but the average wait time for police to show up is 10 minutes. Police can’t do much good when they don’t even arrive until 8.5 minutes after the crime’s happened and the criminal has fled.

2) People increasingly rely on the state for protection, rather than on each other. Community bonds have steadily eroded as Americans are told to put their faith in bureaucracy instead of their neighbors.

At Peacekeeper, we think both of these are big problems. People are increasingly reliant on a failed system of state-centered security. We’ve set out to change that.

Peacekeeper aims to put you and your friends and neighbors back in charge of your own security. With our app, you can create your own ‘Tribe’ of family, friends, and neighbors who look out for each other and respond to cries for help. If your elderly neighbor falls and breaks her hip, she can use Peacekeeper to let everyone in her Tribe know; and one of you can take her to the hospital. If your friend’s being robbed, he can alert you on Peacekeeper so both of you can take action together to help.

It’s not only faster and more efficient than calling 9/11—it’s also more human.

Right now, people are domesticated by a big government that promises to take care of their every need. This promise is, unfortunately, hollow—government rarely cares for citizens, and even well-intentioned policemen and firefighters are hamstrung by bureaucracy and distance. When your house is being robbed, the police car streaking towards you across town is going to get there about 8 minutes after you need them. And that’s on a good day.

And yet, people continue to trust themselves to government services. They turn away from neighbors and people they’re close to, preferring to trust themselves to 9/11 dispatchers. Their first instinct in a crisis is not to ask their friends for help, but to ask the government.

This is ineffective, but worse than that it’s inhumane. Reliance on government erodes self-reliance and the bonds of community.

Peacekeeper aims to reverse this.

Our app saves lives. When you fall and break a hip, or when you’re being robbed, neighbors can get there fast enough to help you. Cops and firefighters, good intentions aside, generally cannot. In a crisis situation, minutes —even seconds— can mean the difference between life and death. Peacekeeper is decentralized and bureaucracy-free. It empowers you to create your own Tribe of connections, as close as next door or across the street, to help you out. Because of this, Peacekeeper is lightening fast and effective.

[TheWastelander]

(09-04-2014 10:31 AM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  

Man, I'm starting to see some beta-ism on this thread.

Some of alphas are having trouble keeping their frame straight.......they can maintain frame with broads but not with the popo.

[TravelerKai]

I wonder what state this was in. In Texas, this would have gone rougher for sure, but usually they are trained here to tell you their names first and some even offer you a look at their badge.

The biggest gotcha was that the fat cop kept begging him to step outside his door to talk to them. I'm glad he did not, because if he had, they would have gotten him then. They cannot slam you while you stand inside your house, only outside. He definitely passed that shit test with flying colors.

I would not have opened the door to begin with if it were me. I have done that 2 times before in the past with no shame.

[TheSlayer]

(09-04-2014 10:31 AM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  

Some of alphas are having trouble keeping their frame straight.......they can maintain frame with broads but not with the popo.

Better to be an alive beta than a dead alpha who got killed by some asshole cop.

[Borealis]

(09-04-2014 06:06 AM)runsonmagic Wrote:  

If a cop comes to your door, you don't have to show ID?

That's good to know. Hadn't heard that before.

If someone has a link on when you do and don't have to show ID, let us know.

http://www.flexyourrights.org/ has some good info.

[Quintus Curtius]

Be careful, guys. Be very careful.

Before everybody starts high-fiving everyone else, it's important to realize that there are many exceptions to the warrant requirement, and that knowing how these apply can be very complicated. These are decisions for judges to make.

I don't think this guy acted wisely. The fact that it appears to have worked out all right for him does not change my opinion. It could just have easily gone the other way.

It's better to keep your mouth shut, be polite, and get an attorney. Nothing I have seen in the past 15 years has made me alter this fundamental opinion in any way.

Wise asses, jailhouse lawyers, and other know-it-alls find this out the hard way.

Being combative with law enforcement? Expect trouble. Big trouble.