Quote: (05-19-2013 11:51 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:
Quote: (05-19-2013 10:30 PM)Samseau Wrote:
I'm not sure the Europeans will come out on top. Although Islam isn't much of a threat, Progressive Liberals are.
The fight will come down between Nationalist and Progressive Europeans killing each other for control. The Progressives will have a huge advantage in that they will have a large Islamic population willing to fight for them.
This is an alarming scenario, but isn't your argument a little internally inconsistent?
First you say "Islam isn't much of a threat" but then you say there'll be a "large Islamic population willing to fight".
Correct. Islam by itself is nothing, but Islam combined with Progressives, who are already entrenched in Government power, will be extremely deadly.
Let's say in country like Norway, in 30 years from now, is 50% Islamic and 50% Norwegian.
Then, of the native Norwegians, you have 20% Progressive, 30% Nationalists, and 50% just followers. Of the Muslims, you have 30% who are violent and want to kill infidels, and then the other 70% who are just followers. Furthermore, the government will be run by Progressives since they are the ones who will buy the Islamic vote. You will also have Muslims in positions of power as well.
When shit starts to hit the fan, it will start because of the 30% Muslims who are violent, rape women, assault and rob men, etc. This group will spur Nationalists to not only lash out against Muslims, but also against Progressives who will have control of the government. The progressives will have most Muslims on their side, since those 70% followers, who aren't really violent by nature, will see that they are being threatened by Nationalists and then join the Progressive cause. They will most likely be armed with guns and sent to attack Nationalists.
Meanwhile, the Nationalists will mainly appeal to Muslims who become Atheists (small minority) and those 50% of Norwegians who are on the fence. If the Nationalists cannot convince this middle group, they will be exterminated by the Progressives and their superior numbers.
So while Muslims by themselves are no threat, Muslims + Progressives are a serious challenge and cannot be taken lightly. Part of me thinks they will win in the long run due to superior birthrates of Muslims.
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Also I disagree progressive liberals are a threat to Western Civilization/Democracy. Democracy came from liberal thinking, accepting others may think differently and people have natural rights they can exercise as long as they don't interfere with the rights of others. As a liberal, I strongly believe political violence like what happened is Boston is exactly the most poisonous type of violation of human rights. To me it's bizarre to think of condoning this as liberal-- what about the natural rights of the dead and wounded?
Thomas Jefferson and the doctrine of natural rights:
http://www.crf-usa.org/foundations-of-ou...ights.html
Not true at all, Liberal thinking is pretty much the antithesis of a democratic
state and really has nothing to do with a democratic
state.
A
state is not about letting in enemies of the state just so they can sell out their native population. Accepting that people are different does not mean they belong with you.
America and Modern Europe are the only examples of a democracy, in all of history, that have embraced such suicidal values. Ancient Athens had incredibly strict limits to citizenship as did Britian for most of its history.
The problem with modern Progressives is that they fail to understand the importance of a
state being representative of it's culture. Progressives think the state is something that just materializes out of thin air, whereas Culturalists understand a country is a product of it's traditions and history.
There is more to a democracy than merely having a vote.
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The reason I ask is that although I am unfamiliar with Muslim immigrants into Europe, I imagine they may not be as monolithic a block as you're seeing.
Wouldn't many/at least some of them be economic immigrants, modern thinkers that just aren't religious and want the better environment of Britain as opposed to, say, Paikstan? Don't some of them realize Isn't the most likely explanation for why Pakistan is a shithole is some type of negative behavior of the Pakistanis themselves?
And thus not want to support whatever dim-witted, chronically violent culture they came from? If Pakistan was so great, why do they go to England?
What you say is quite true, that not all Muslims are violent - in fact, only a minority of them are.
But then again, it was the same with the Nazis or Communists; just a small minority of them were truly violent but that's all it took to make things hell.
Islam is an ideology. While I have nothing against Pakistani's I believe Islam needs to be stamped out. It's not like other religions because Islam is explicitly political in nature (whereas Christianity and Judaism are not necessarily so).
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Also I disagree progressive liberals are a threat: I'm one -- pinko to the core-- and I'd side with an Ayn Rand redneck gun nut who'll leave me alone to worship Satan in a second over some 8th century thinker peabrain who believes infidels should be shot. The Ayn Rand Gun Nut only believes you should shoot if the person's attacking you.
The Peabrain Jihadi has Special Transcendental Knowledge from God/Allah/Flying Spaghetti Monster which has always made for great murder justification.
Then you're more level-headed compared to most Progressives I know - they won't admit that Islam is a dangerous religion plus they fail to address any contingencies involving an Islamic threat.
My guess is that it is because you're American - hating on Islam is not considered a hate-crime here. 9/11 has created such a permanent anti-Islamic fervor in the USA that I doubt American progressives will ever truly support Islam like European progressives do. No one will get elected by supporting Islam when terrorism remains a high threat. The Boston Bombers have only exacerbated the issue.
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