[xsplat]

I'm hearing a contradiction here. The pacifists are saying:
1) If the girl won't behave unless discipline is escalated all the way up to violence, then leave her.
2) If you have to escalate discipline all the way up to violence, then you don't have game.

He he. The hampsters are strong in these ones. I doubt that the contradiction here between one and two will cause any internal red flags of faulty logic to go off. Hampters ignore faulty logic. Literally can't see it.

I'm also hearing:
1) Even if the outcome is positive for both the man and the woman, if you stoop to letting yourself use violence, then you have issues that need working on and something is horribly wrong with you.
2) The use of appropriate violence that is highly effective and produces the desired outcome makes you a less capable man.

There is no talking to some guys. Really. Logic and reason and showing examples of real world patterns doesn't even make a dent on your emotional thinking.

Violence against women is BAD, Mkay! It's bad! Mkay! If you don't agree then you're bad. Mkay! Bad and no game.

Having a "discussion" with Mr. Mackey is quickly loosing entertainment value.

Some people just don't want to learn.

Cause it's bad. Mkay. Bad.

[Sargon of Akkad]

@ DArk Triad & Urban Nurd:

If a woman spat in my face or threw a drink at me, that might be the only exception I'd be willing to make, since it's practically a physical assault. Loud arguments, insults, or generic rude and inconsiderate behavior are no more an excuse than with anyone else.

[The Fantasist]

(10-18-2012 04:57 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Some people just don't want to learn.

Some people don't want to learn....How to beat women. Yup.

Laughable. Break it down big guy,how do you hit them? Come on I'll help you...you fly to SE Asia where you can get a girl who is small, and then?

sad.

[xsplat]

(10-18-2012 05:16 AM)Vorkuta Wrote:  

sad.

Sad because it's bad. Mkay? It's bad.

Emotional thinking much?

It's bad because it's bad. Mkay? If you do that then you're bad. If girls demand nothing less then those girls are bad. Regardless of if the outcome is good, it's bad.

Mkay Mr. Makey!

(10-18-2012 05:16 AM)Vorkuta Wrote:  

Some people don't want to learn....How to beat women.

So if shaming doesn't work, try snark. That's right, I'm trying to teach you how to beat women. Right. If some girl slaps you in the face, did she beat you? Never mind, I know, logical questions are only distractions from the real point. It's bad.

Don't ever let anyone change your mind about that! You'd lose your identity and become a bad person.

And that would be bad.

Hold on for dear life to those principles!

Mr. Mackey, the true believer in righteous good. Because he knows what's bad. Because he FEELS it. Defend those precious feelings Mr. Mackey!

[The Fantasist]

Do you hit your gran? She will respect you more if you do.

[Thomas the Rhymer]

I think we haven't gone into contextual issues far enough.

I've come to believe that if you're in a relationship long enough, you will experience 3 Nuclear shit tests, always in the same order:

1 - Chick will demand that you marry her

If you refuse to marry her but she decides to stay then

2 - Chick will gain weight

If you force her back to a decent weight and she decides to stay then

3 - She will escalate an irrational argument into infinity. No amount of arguing, logic, game will suffice. She will rage, spit insults, throw stuff. She will diss you constantly. Nothing you say will shut her up. Yelling at her doesn't help.

If at this point you give a careful application of force, she will either leave or be yours forever and glow with happiness. Often no further force will be necessary. If you fail any of the 3 shit tests, she will be miserable and blame you for her misery, even if she stays in the relationship.

I'm getting the impression that the guys supporting a calculated slap in this thread are all guys who have been in long term relationships, long enough to get to Nuclear Shit Test 3. I'd be happy to hear alternative ways of resolving this.

Side note: Apparently Kanye is making Kim Kardashian lose weight, so looks like they are heading to number 3 soon...

[xsplat]

In many of his posts Rollo talks about guys who have internalized the feminine imperative in order to differentiate themselves as upstanding good guys. It's very important to them - a crux of identity - that they not be "like those other guys".

If I'm reading Rollo correctly he works hard, post after post to disillusion men about the effectiveness of that strategy. On this forum we use terms like chumps and white nights to get guys to re-categorize their anti-bad-boy attitudes.

But I realize that these aren't just beliefs we are talking about. This is about core identities. "That's bad, and I'm not bad. Mkay!"

I've heard it often said that some red pill wisdom is just too bitter. People refuse it. Because their self conception and their conception of the world would have to fall apart.

[Sargon of Akkad]

If you're a fully grown adult and you can't solve your issues with other adults without slapping them in the face, then it's more than your game that needs work. That I even have to say this tells me all I need to know.

Quote:

He he. The hampsters are strong in these ones. I doubt that the contradiction here between one and two will cause any internal red flags of faulty logic to go off. Hampters ignore faulty logic. Literally can't see it.

So, in other words, the fact that...

A.) you shouldn't want to waste time with people (women, associates, relatives...) you can't deal with in a normal rational manner...
B.) as an adult, you should be expected resolve conflicts with other adults without slapping them in the face, and...
C.) hitting people who can't put up a fight against you is cowardly

... contradict eachother somehow, and are supposed to set off red flags in my head, yet you have yet to give any logical justification for this.

Quote:

I'm also hearing:
1) Even if the outcome is positive for both the man and the woman, if you stoop to letting yourself use violence, then you have issues that need working on and something is horribly wrong with you.

That slapping people in the face leads to a "positive outcome" for both parties is something you have yet to demonstrate in any reliable way. All I've heard is so far are weak testimonials about how slapping your bitch made her fall in love with you. I have no way of determining how much of that you pulled out of your ass and how much of it is true.

Quote:

2) The use of appropriate violence that is highly effective and produces the desired outcome makes you a less capable man.

No, hitting someone (not out of self defense) who couldn't put up a fight against you if they wanted is cowardly.

[Sargon of Akkad]

(10-18-2012 06:02 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

But I realize that these aren't just beliefs we are talking about. This is about core identities. "That's bad, and I'm not bad. Mkay!"

Xsplat, you're dramatizing the subject. This is about behavior, and what kind of behavior should be considered acceptable and what shouldn't

[xsplat]

(10-18-2012 06:10 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

(10-18-2012 06:02 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

But I realize that these aren't just beliefs we are talking about. This is about core identities. "That's bad, and I'm not bad. Mkay!"

Xsplat, you're dramatizing the subject. This is about behavior, and what kind of behavior should be considered acceptable and what shouldn't

Acceptable not based on the criteria of outcome, but based on the criteria of it's bad or not.

And it's just selfish to think that you would not perform a distasteful act even if it meant a better outcome for both you and the girl.

Principles over the girls benefit. I don't know if that's cowardly or not, but it seems to me to be the opposite of pragmatic, in the most selfish way possible.

"I don't wanna! I don't care how much it would improve her life. I don't wanna!"

And we aren't talking about fighting here. This isn't a matter of requiring two equal sized people pairing off in a ring with judges around to impose rules in order for the violence to be appropriate. It has nothing to do with fair.

Yes, it's an imposition of will.

If you can't get down with that, then you are miles away from understanding healthy male female dynamics. And you're probably a closet equalist.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2012 06:14 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Acceptable not based on the criteria of outcome, but based on the criteria of it's bad or not.

And it's just selfish to think that you would not perform a distasteful act even if it meant a better outcome for both you and the girl.

Principles over the girls benefit. I don't know if that's cowardly or not, but it seems to me to be the opposite of pragmatic, in the most selfish way possible.

"I don't wanna! I don't care how much it would improve her life. I don't wanna!"

And we aren't talking about fighting here. This isn't a matter of requiring two equal sized people pairing off in a ring with judges around to impose rules in order for the violence to be appropriate. It has nothing to do with fair.

Yes, it's an imposition of will.

If you can't get down with that, then you are miles away from understanding healthy male female dynamics. And you're probably a closet equalist.

I think you are taking this rationalization a little too far. It is up to you if you think you're helping out damsels in distress by slapping them around when they don't do what you want.

Personally, I don't need to deal with the drama. You can try to say I am selfish and you would be correct. I am selfish and will always be selfish. I don't need to set a chick straight with a slap to the face or a flick to the ear when I can just walk away from the bullshit and pick up another one.

When a chick knows you will walk away it can also be a deterrent to bad behavior. If she is into you where she would allow you to get away with slapping she would also correct her behavior if she knows you will walk away.

Whatever happens between you and a girl is your business. I am not here to say what you should or shouldn't be doing. But please don't push the bullshit about helping them when you're slapping them. It just makes you look silly.

You are being as selfish as anyone of us that would choose a different path. Don't try to play it any other way.

[Sargon of Akkad]

Quote:

And it's just selfish to think that you would not perform a distasteful act even if it meant a better outcome for both you and the girl.

You have yet to show me any real evidence that hitting your spouse/girlfriend (outside of a consentual, sado-masochistic context) even leads to a positive outcome for both parties in the first place. As I've already said, you have offered nothing but testimonials about how hitting your bitch made her fall in love with you. I have no way of determining how much of that is true, what other factors may have been involved, and how much you just pulled out of your ass.

Quote:

"I don't wanna! I don't care how much it would improve her life. I don't wanna!"

I don't believe I just read this. "Hitting a girl upside the head will improve her life." And I'm supposed to believe this crap.

Quote:

And we aren't talking about fighting here. This isn't a matter of requiring two equal sized people pairing off in a ring with judges around to impose rules in order for the violence to be appropriate. It has nothing to do with fair.

I know damn well if anyone just slapped me upside the head in the middle of an argument, there would be a fight. That's something you have to recon with whenever you lay your hand on someone else: that they will hit you back. I personally don't give a shit whether or not you intend to cause a fight. You're advocating hitting someone who would in all likelihood be unable to hold their own if they wanted to hit you back.

Quote:

Yes, it's an imposition of will.

I've got a dick. You better listen to what I say, or I'll fucking hit you.

Quote:

If you can't get down with that, then you are miles away from understanding healthy male female dynamics.

You have yet to demonstrate that you have any understanding of that topic yourself.

Quote:

And you're probably a closet equalist.

"Closet"? Please define what you mean by "equalism".

[xsplat]

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

You have yet to show me any real evidence that hitting your spouse/girlfriend (outside of a consentual, sado-masochistic context) even leads to a positive outcome for both parties in the first place.

What do you want, controlled scientific studies? And why do I get the feeling that even if those existed and were provided, that you would automatically dispute them?

You don't have to rely on my personal testimony. There is testimony of others on this very thread. My blog has many testimonials from the blog readers. Roissy wrote a blog post or two about it. Did you watch the youtube vid of the montage of old movie clips? This used to be common knowledge to the point of it being advocated in the mainstream.

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

Quote:

"I don't wanna! I don't care how much it would improve her life. I don't wanna!"

I don't believe I just read this. "Hitting a girl upside the head will improve her life." And I'm supposed to believe this crap.

Again with the snark. That's an argument to you?

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

I know damn well if anyone just slapped me upside the head in the middle of an argument, there would be a fight. That's something you have to recon with whenever you lay your hand on someone else: that they will hit you back. I personally don't give a shit whether or not you intend to cause a fight. You're advocating hitting someone who would in all likelihood be unable to hold their own if they wanted to hit you back.

See, you are unable to see this outside of the context of men dealing with men. Women WANT to be physicially dominated! Agree, or disagree? They react favorably to it! Agree or disagree? I'm not talking about dating another man.

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

Quote:

Yes, it's an imposition of will.

I've got a dick. You better listen to what I say.

Snarkasm is not an argument.

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

Quote:

If you can't get down with that, then you are miles away from understanding healthy male female dynamics.

You have yet to demonstrate that you have any understanding of that topic yourself.

Talking knowledgably about appropriate violence is one such demonstration.

(10-18-2012 06:39 AM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  

Quote:

And you're probably a closet equalist.

"Closet"? Please define what you mean by "equalism".

Equalist - you have an aversion to imposing your will on a woman, because you view that she must decide for herself through conversation to agree to behave properly. That she has an equal right to an equal opinion, no matter how stupid and childish and harmful her actions are. That you are not to act as the authority in her life. That she is a free agent, and at most can be persuaded, but should never be coerced. Even if it's coerced into not cheating, or not being a bitch, or not being an insufferable cunt.

[Hades]

Some women want to be believe that they are bad and get punished for it. If you don't reciprocate with a little tactical violence every now and then, she's going to get disinterested or bitchy. Over the long term though this kind of shit can go codependent very fast. I roll with Sean Connery's advice on this one.

[Sargon of Akkad]

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

What do you want, controlled scientific studies? And why do I get the feeling that even if those existed and were provided, that you would automatically dispute them?

If those studies were reliable, peer-reviewed, from reputable sources, I don't think I could dispute them. I would initially be skeptical of them, though. Admittedly, it would require a LOT of convincing, before I could start taking statements like that seriously. I know this statement is overused, but it is very true: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

This used to be common knowledge to the point of it being advocated in the mainstream.

Lot's of things used to be "common knowledge" and advocated to the mainstream. Do I need to bring any of them up?

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Again with the snark. That's an argument to you?

You've engaged in the exact same thing. Absurd statements with little evidence to support them are easy to ridicule.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Women WANT to be physicially dominated! Agree, or disagree? They react favorably to it! Agree or disagree?

All women want to be slapped in the face? Again, read my words above.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Snarkasm is not an argument.

This was more than sarcasm. You are trying to argue that having a dick is should be sufficient reason for women to respect you and listen to you. This statement is absurd.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Talking knowledgably about appropriate violence is one such demonstration.

Again, you have yet to demonstrate that your comments on "appropriate violence" are in any way knowledgable.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

Equalist - you have an aversion to imposing your will on a woman, because you view that she must decide for herself through conversation to agree to behave properly. That she has an equal right to an equal opinion, no matter how stupid and childish and harmful her actions are.

Anyone has an equal right to their opinion. I don't give a shit if they're male or female.
Anyone can have stupid beliefs and childish opinions, as you have demonstrated throughout this thread. Anyone is capable of harmful actions. There is no evidence that gender affects this in any way.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

...That you are not to act as the authority in her life.

I date women. I fuck women, and if I like them enough, I might do more. If they get on my nerves for too long, I walk away. There is no reason why I should feel the need to play their father.

(10-18-2012 06:51 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

...That she is a free agent, and at most can be persuaded, but should never be coerced. Even if it's coerced into not cheating, or not being a bitch, or not being an insufferable cunt.

And men don't cheat, or act like bitches and insufferable cunts?
She cheats, I walk away and find another woman.
She acts like an insufferable cunt, I refuse to put up with her shit and do the same.

If an "equalist" is someone who thinks gender, ethnic background, nationality, and other random BS are not valid criteria for determining intelligence, value, or social status, then yes, I am an egalitarian, and so far, I see no reason to be anything else.

[Majestic]

I am not getting into an argument over the internet... We're not going to change each other's view on the subject so it's pointless to carry on.... final thought.

"You've never been bitten by a dog, I take it." A bite from a dog? Really? Really? That's weak . You are going to compare that with a women who has the ability to take revenge and have the ability to have my body end up in a ditch. NO, my dogs has NEVER bitten me, even though they have ability to do damage. It knows not to cross that line. So it respects me and knows it role....

You act like women are delicate sunflowers who float across water and shit skittles. Like they don't have the ability to take revenge if they don't like the way they are being treated.

If they don't like being disciplined, they know where I live. If they want their revenge, if they TRULY despise it, my door is open and they are welcomed to get back at me. And not once has a chick ever stabbed me, car tires slashed, shot at me or got a crew of her toughest male friends or family members on my ass for giving them a discipline slap for ACTING out of line.

[The Fantasist]

(10-18-2012 09:29 AM)Majestic Wrote:  

If they don't like being disciplined, they know where I live. If they want their revenge, if they TRULY despise it, my door is open. And not once has a chick ever stabbed me, shot at me or got a crew of her toughest male friends or family members on my ass for giving them a discipline slap for ACTING out of line.

That's an interesting conclusion you've come to there. The fact that because you've never been shot or stabbed means your women don't mind being slapped around. Ok.

An old lady was burgled on my street about a year back,and as far as I know she never hired a hit man to execute the burglar. Therefore I suppose by your logic it means she had no problem with the burglar breaking into her home and stealing her life savings.

This is turning farcical and hence I'll bow out of the thread.

[Hades]

Sargon, I think you qualify for hamster denialism. You're trying to argue for how women work internally using man-logic and expressing a need for scientific studies. Try using anger yourself while in a relationship sometime. I can assure that if you argue so strongly against all violence and anger in a relationship you'd be equally strongly converted once you see the benefits of it in action. I would not make a personal comment to another forum goer on a forum where I try to act beta if I didn't see a need for it.
The hamster brain is not supposed to make sense, it only exists to respond to how men express themselves. It responds favorably to dominance and negatively to bitch-made behavior. That's specifically why game exists.

[Majestic]

"An old lady was burgled on my street about a year back,and as far as I know she never hired a hit man to execute the burglar."

Are you serious??? How can you even compare that.... A BURGLAR!?!?!? REALLY!?!?!? wow....

ARE YOU LISTENING??? If they WANT THEIR REVENGE, THEY CAN HAVE IT.... These women know WHERE I LIVE, WHERE MY MOTHER LIVES, MY PHONE NUMBER ,MY FIRST AND LAST NAME, THE CAR I DRIVE...I'm sure the old lady had that kind of information on the burglar if she wanted to hire a hitman and get her revenge....

I'm done with this... when a reply like that comes out of a man's mouth....

[scorpion]

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2012 04:57 AM)xsplat Wrote:  

I'm hearing a contradiction here. The pacifists are saying:
1) If the girl won't behave unless discipline is escalated all the way up to violence, then leave her.
2) If you have to escalate discipline all the way up to violence, then you don't have game.

He he. The hampsters are strong in these ones. I doubt that the contradiction here between one and two will cause any internal red flags of faulty logic to go off. Hampters ignore faulty logic. Literally can't see it.

I'm also hearing:
1) Even if the outcome is positive for both the man and the woman, if you stoop to letting yourself use violence, then you have issues that need working on and something is horribly wrong with you.
2) The use of appropriate violence that is highly effective and produces the desired outcome makes you a less capable man.

There is no talking to some guys. Really. Logic and reason and showing examples of real world patterns doesn't even make a dent on your emotional thinking.

Violence against women is BAD, Mkay! It's bad! Mkay! If you don't agree then you're bad. Mkay! Bad and no game.

Having a "discussion" with Mr. Mackey is quickly loosing entertainment value.

Some people just don't want to learn.

Cause it's bad. Mkay. Bad.

There is some hamster shit going on here. Like I am doing her a favor by slapping her around. heh

Look, try practicing that behavior in the western world mate. You think a woman won't get bruised up occasionally while you help her with her problems.

You don't think she will hear it from other women how she should stand up for herself and do something. I am sure in all your wisdom when it comes to the opposite sex that you are well aware how important peers are to women.

Please let me know when you come back to the western world. I want to sit in court watching you explain to the judge how you are helping women, that you used appropriate violence and they should be thanking you for caring so much to give it to them.

I think woman like to be dominated on a certain level. I don't agree with the way you are trying to present it. It is a big lose situation for the guy if she decides her friends are right and your an abuser.

[MidniteSpecial]

Did anyone listen to hot97 this morning? There call in topic was "why do girls like assholes?" I only got to hear two girls call in. One said, "I like Assholes because they are always attractive." Funny hamster.

The other goes," because I don't like walking all over my man, I like it when he tells me to shut up and slaps me." Straight from the hamsters mouth.

The male hosts were flabbergasted. One is Paul Rosenberg who shares his beta tendencies on the daily.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2012 10:46 AM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Did anyone listen to hot97 this morning? Here call in topic was "why do girls like assholes?" I only got to hear two girls call in. One said, "I like Assholes because they are always attractive." Funny hamster.

The other goes," because I don't like walking all over my man, I like it when he tells me to shut up and slaps me." Straight from the hamsters mouth.

The male hosts were flabbergasted. One is Paul Rosenberg who shares his beta tendencies on the daily.

Is it worth going to jail over? Not for me, I will just get another chick.

I don't think any guy here is saying to let a woman walk all over you. I don't know why people think just because your not into slapping a woman means you would allow her to walk over you.

Some guys just get off on domination. You can see it in some of their posts. I am not one of them. I don't get off on the stuff and would rather not be around women that get off on the physical domination stuff like slapping.

If I meet a woman that is into it I will send her to some of the guys in this thread. heh

[scorpion]

I'm sorry, but all I'm hearing from this anti-slapping crowd is the same kind of arguments put forth by white knights, feminists and politically correct chodes.

"You can never lay your hands on a woman! It's morally wrong. And against the law. And makes you a coward. Etc..."

For all of human history, up until the past few decades and the feminist revolution, these arguments would have been laughable. Slapping your woman when she got out of line was as common sense and accepted as spanking your children when they did the same (another perfectly acceptable behavior which is rapidly becoming politically incorrect).

If you're a man, it's your responsibility to maintain the dominant frame in the relationship. If your girl steps up and challenges your dominant frame in a fit of emotion, slapping her is the time-honored and acceptable method of reminding her of her place.

Not beating her. Not punching her. Not slamming her head into a wall. Not threatening to kill her.

Slapping her.

The fact that dudes can't differentiate between slapping a girl and beating the shit out of her tells you everything you need to know. It's lazy, generalized thinking, and acquiescence to the feminist worldview that says that women are special beings and deserve only the most deferential treatment 100% of the time.

This same attitude of total deference to women will, if left unchecked, soon result in the criminalization or social stigmatization of valid and effective game tactics like approaching random girls on the street. Women can easily say they find such approaches threatening, offensive and annoying. White knights and chodes will go along, and before you know it, approaching an unknown woman on the street will net you a sexual harassment charge.

Sound ridiculous? It's not. The same kind of pedestalization thinking that allows for guys to believe that slapping a girl is equatable to beating her up allows for the belief that approaching a girl on the street is "harassment".

Some dudes in this thread need to check themselves and make sure the red pill didn't get caught in their throat on the way down.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2012 10:59 AM)scorpion Wrote:  

blah blah and more bullshit blah...

Some dudes in this thread need to check themselves and make sure the red pill didn't get caught in their throat on the way down.

Sounds like shaming language to me.

Red pill bullshit again... I am not interested in going to jail so I can tell everyone in orange jumpsuits that I took a red pill. Sounds pretty stupid if you ask me but knock yourself out.

Maybe you should start slapping the white knights. Slapping a girl and approaching them are the same now, eh?

Look, if want to bring in more drama into your life then go at it keyboard warrior. I prefer as little drama as can be when talking about women.

I don't want them to have any upper hand on me like calling the cops and putting me in jail for slapping her. I also don't murder people that piss me off. I know, pussy for following laws like that.