[porscheguy]

(11-26-2018 02:06 AM)Sasquatch Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 11:01 PM)corsega Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 09:02 PM)Sasquatch Wrote:  

“He didn’t execute game properly or approach enough women” is usually the catch cry.

Most likely isn’t physically attractive enough in a modern world where women are absolutely spoiled for choice and options.

I recently tried to help a friend on tinder who had 0 hits after two months. He is not an attractive man but not hideously ugly either. Healthy, tall, all up I’d say a 4.
I selected some better photos for him, deleted his beta cringe profile and still a week later no hits. Not even the abundance of ugly disgustingly fat girls that I used to swipe past when I had the app. He assures me he isn’t being picky and tries pretty much everyone desperate to get a hit.

That highlights to me what a depressing shit show it must be for men <5 out there. It’s not easy for the <8’s either as the Chads 8+ are devouring up our markets as well.

I agree it's hard for naturally ugly guys, but pretty much any guy can become at least a 5 in half a year, no matter where they start from.

Tan
Haircut
Shave
Skincare
6 months of heavy compound lifting/dieting
Better clothes
Posture work/smirking/smile/eyecontact
Elevator shoes (for guys under 5'7")

Meh, No offence dude but besides the lifting/dieting this is such basic bitch advice that may have helped men in the 90's but its just minimum expected shit now, like wiping your own ass.

The games changed Female 5's don't want male 5's especially for some shallow promiscuous hook ups when they can easily secure men of higher SMV pumping down.

A female's hypergamy used to be isolated to her local communities but now she is inundated with thirsty attention and cock from around the globe and the competition is fierce.

Go walk through walmart. Plenty of 5s fucking 5s and reproducing.

Lifting/dieting ain't basic bitch advice by any stretch. You know why? Because in the big picture, so few do it. There are plenty of thin guys out there. But they got no muscle at all.

Here's a little hint. If you can put on a large, well made t shirt and have it pulled snug across your shoulders, and you're chest sticks out farther than your gut, you've pulled yourself into the top 10% of guys out there in terms of looks that really matter to women. And upon seeing this, it sets off something at a primal level in women. It doesn't negate the need for game, but it definitely can offset many deficiencies.

[subterfuge]

(11-26-2018 03:06 PM)Jefferson Wrote:  

Rather than be patient with him I really want to kick him up his ass and tell him to do it right, but it would probably be useless.

What would you tell him out of interest? imagine he's reading this thread. He wants advice for his next approach.
Let's assume he already has a job and hobbies (since everyone says that when giving 'game' advice )

Personally, i'd change the opener firstly. Even though i've heard it used a few times by PUA 'goodlookingloser', I don't think it's great. I guess it 'works' for GLL because he's a big, tall, muscley, decently handsome dude so most girls will be instantly receptive/attracted, plus his delivery of the line is better. Not sure if it's the accent, but the dude in the recordings sounds like he lacks charisma when saying the line

I'd have him maybe use the classic ''I was just walking by bla bla bla and you caught my eye'' (London day game model basically) and then maybe go into some sort of cold read based on her being bored/daydreaming at work waiting for the weekend or something, and then ask her what her name is and how her shift is going and try to relate with some sort of short story or something and then maybe another statement of intent and then go for a number close?

I dunno. I only ever do nightgame to be honest, but I guess this dude needs some sort of a 'script'. An improved one!

He probably knows he needs 'better game' but It sounds like he's out of ideas of waht to actually 'say' (but then 'what you say doesn't matter' is very common advice on PUA forums that I read now so maybe there's that lol)

[Jefferson]

He's got no game at all, here's why: He hates women. If you read that incel thread, he actually says 'Women are not actually human in my honest opinion'.

He truly despises women, hates them, and not just women, the way he talks about men he is just as hateful.

He admits himself he is 'constantly angry', and man does it show.

His opener is weak, he is basically steam-rolling women with nothing, not making an effort. He's not making an effort to game women, because he actually hates women. His ploy of doing a thousand approaches is purely designed to show how awful women are to reject him a thousand times. So he puts no real effort into gaming them.

But before you can talk about gaming, using a better opener he has to lose the anger. He's socially awkward, but more than that he is actually viciously angry at women, and men. So he may need to figure out why he is so incredibly angry, there is usually a reason for this. He needs to address this.

It looks like he has health issues, he alludes to his broken knees and tendons, he gave up online dating because it did not work at all.

If he were serious about wanting to be with women, he should get rid of his anger, which shines through in the way he interacts with women. He needs to put some joy in his life, address the source of his anger, and garner some accomplishments in life, so that he has a totally different vibe and outlook on life.

He already lifts, dressess well, he's a six, not stupid, I think his issue is not physical, it's a mental issue. He hates women, he hates the people he approaches. Of course people can sense that. Would you want to be with someone who hates you? I wouldn't.

It's not even the opener. Yes, it's weak and he steamrolls women with 'Hello, How are you, My name's x', and it would be better if he put something more subtle in there, but it's not the opener. I could use that opener and still get a girl to have a nice conversation with me, because I don't hate the person I'm talking to. He has a mental problem, he actually hates women. So of course that's a bit of a problem.

[pancakemouse]

(11-26-2018 02:18 PM)Sasquatch Wrote:  

Look, you're not wrong but what happens if every man on earth raises his SMV by 2 points and the women in our societies continue to degrade without any responsibility to maintain any standards.

We will see a sexual market so bad that men putting in extreme efforts of improvement will be fighting for scraps. They will be eating shit and told by guys like you to suck it up and keep on eating.

I believe we need to fix our society instead of short term thinking of exploiting the decline in a nihilistic orgy gonna get me mine mindset.

This is a ridiculous hypothetical scenario that is so far-fetched it's not even worth considering. Men aren't raising their sexual market value.

The market is a constant.

You and the other complainers in here are just failing to adapt to market demands.

[BlastbeatCasanova]

Man it was rough reading that thread. I noticed how they have their own lingo and forum culture just like this place, v interesting.. But holy aspergers Batman...will definitely go back and read that shit next time I’m feeling down, those guys make me feel like I’m Leonardo DiCaprio.

[zatara]

I'd love to know how many hours of his life this guy wasted on coming up with this plan, doing the 1000 approaches, and writing all his bitter autistic posts about the approach failures.

Imagine if he'd invested the hours into a good gym workout routine and his career instead. And maybe just asked a friend, an uncle, a father or brother, or even strangers on a game forum for some basic social calibration advice.

It really isn't that hard to bang 5s or 6s almost anywhere in the developed world: spend a year or two working out properly, spend $1000 on a decent wardrobe of clothes, have a reasonable career and don't be socially retarded. Nothing particularly hard. It boggles my mind how this 'incel' thing continues to grow. Like many of the other posters in this thread I got absolutely no love from girls as a teenager, so I put work into myself and changed things to fix that. It was hard work, but it wasn't rocket science, and it definitely paid off. I went from a male '4' to a male '8', and that +4point transformation is possible for any man.

A large part of the incel phenomenon seems to be how so many 18-25 year olds these days were raised to think "everyone is a winner" and "you're perfect just the way you are". So when they enter the Darwinian world of dating their minds just can't handle rejection/losing/criticism, so they give up. That or they're just too lazy to put the work in to engage in self improvement.

[Anchor Man]

@ Zatara ,

What did you do to go from 4 to 8?
Just highlight the major stuff .

[zatara]

I went years without even kissing a girl as a teenager, despite being at parties/in bars every weekend, and trying. And then years more trying to get laid. So I can very confidently say I wasn't blessed with natural looks or game. I was definitely one of the worst looking guys in any given room. The exact weighting is a bit subjective depending on the region (some girls prefer muscle, some girls prefer style, some money). But the overall transformation was:

I put on 30lbs of weight in my first 2 years of working out (+2pts)
I completely changed how I dress. I got advice from girls and a couple of gay guys in my extended social circle in college, and started wearing clothes that were both fashionable and suited my body type and eye/hair colouring. (+1pt)
I worked on my other smaller aesthetics - I started going to an expensive barber and getting stylish haircuts that suited my face. And I got a tan and whitened my teeth (+.5pt)
I got a couple of good college degrees, and then have been working fairly well paid jobs since. This isn't a huge help for one night stands, more-so girlfriends, but there are still some subtle tell tale things that girls will notice in a bar or at a party - an expensive watch and an expensive pair of shoes being the most common (+.5pt)

Literally any man can do all of the above. The weightlifting and clothes/other aesthetic improvement stuff in particular is not hard at all. 4 hours a week in the gym, and roughly $1500 a year investment into clothes/haircuts etc.

I've yet to meet a man who dresses well, is in great shape physically, and who has a well paying job who doesn't get laid regularly. I strongly suspect they don't exist. Which why I think incels are just lazy and/or entitled snowflakes, because its possible to achieve all 3 of those things for almost any man with a even a small work ethic.

[eradicator]

Is it the dude who wanted to get chin surgery? Maybe five years ago a guy came onto the forum posting about making a lot of approaches and getting zero bangs. He wasn't bad looking and got a lot of help from forum vets and he proceeded to ignore all of the awesome advice he was given and just keep doing what he was doing and not getting bangs. And he insisted it was because he wasn't getting chin surgery. It's been a few years but that's the nutshell.

[Anchor Man]

(11-28-2018 07:31 PM)zatara Wrote:  

I went years without even kissing a girl as a teenager, despite being at parties/in bars every weekend, and trying. And then years more trying to get laid. So I can very confidently say I wasn't blessed with natural looks or game. I was definitely one of the worst looking guys in any given room. The exact weighting is a bit subjective depending on the region (some girls prefer muscle, some girls prefer style, some money). But the overall transformation was:

I put on 30lbs of weight in my first 2 years of working out (+2pts)
I completely changed how I dress. I got advice from girls and a couple of gay guys in my extended social circle in college, and started wearing clothes that were both fashionable and suited my body type and eye/hair colouring. (+1pt)
I worked on my other smaller aesthetics - I started going to an expensive barber and getting stylish haircuts that suited my face. And I got a tan and whitened my teeth (+.5pt)
I got a couple of good college degrees, and then have been working fairly well paid jobs since. This isn't a huge help for one night stands, more-so girlfriends, but there are still some subtle tell tale things that girls will notice in a bar or at a party - an expensive watch and an expensive pair of shoes being the most common (+.5pt)

Literally any man can do all of the above. The weightlifting and clothes/other aesthetic improvement stuff in particular is not hard at all. 4 hours a week in the gym, and roughly $1500 a year investment into clothes/haircuts etc.

I've yet to meet a man who dresses well, is in great shape physically, and who has a well paying job who doesn't get laid regularly. I strongly suspect they don't exist. Which why I think incels are just lazy and/or entitled snowflakes, because its possible to achieve all 3 of those things for almost any man with a even a small work ethic.

Thanks man for sharing. I was just curious so I can follow the path.

On Incels, there was so much have been said on this thread. Away from game or looks, a drug-addict, with good determination, can recover from addiction so incels can make , if they have the determination .

No one in this universe will give you anything, you have to earn everything .



Since the dawn of civilization, pussies have never been easy. You have to be of high status . Yes, the definition of high status changes with time, but you still need to be of high status. This status could mean resources, power, or money .

[Anchor Man]

(11-28-2018 07:36 PM)eradicator Wrote:  

Is it the dude who wanted to get chin surgery? Maybe five years ago a guy came onto the forum posting about making a lot of approaches and getting zero bangs. He wasn't bad looking and got a lot of help from forum vets and he proceeded to ignore all of the awesome advice he was given and just keep doing what he was doing and not getting bangs. And he insisted it was because he wasn't getting chin surgery. It's been a few years but that's the nutshell.

Are you talking about the jewish guy who traveled to Asia ?

thread-36769.html

[StrikeBack]

(11-26-2018 03:52 PM)Jefferson Wrote:  

He's got no game at all, here's why: He hates women. If you read that incel thread, he actually says 'Women are not actually human in my honest opinion'.

He truly despises women, hates them, and not just women, the way he talks about men he is just as hateful.

He admits himself he is 'constantly angry', and man does it show.

I've always noticed that the guys who are terrible socially with women tend to be just as bad with men as well.

There are a lot of young guys (and girls too, they're the weirdo new-aged feminists) these days who have this "I hate people" mindset, yet they still yearn to be social. Their problem is not Game or "looksmax" (if you use that word, you're not gonna get laid). It's that they were poorly socialised as children. Their social skills were never given the chance to develop healthily since they were toddlers. They need professional help to unravel all those years of unhealthy upbringing. Forums like RVF can't help them, we can only help the guys who are mostly socially normal but can't quite figure out where all the puzzle pieces are when it comes to having a decent dating life.

[pancakemouse]

(11-28-2018 08:16 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  

(11-26-2018 03:52 PM)Jefferson Wrote:  

He's got no game at all, here's why: He hates women. If you read that incel thread, he actually says 'Women are not actually human in my honest opinion'.

He truly despises women, hates them, and not just women, the way he talks about men he is just as hateful.

He admits himself he is 'constantly angry', and man does it show.

I've always noticed that the guys who are terrible socially with women tend to be just as bad with men as well.

There are a lot of young guys (and girls too, they're the weirdo new-aged feminists) these days who have this "I hate people" mindset, yet they still yearn to be social. Their problem is not Game or "looksmax" (if you use that word, you're not gonna get laid). It's that they were poorly socialised as children. Their social skills were never given the chance to develop healthily since they were toddlers. They need professional help to unravel all those years of unhealthy upbringing. Forums like RVF can't help them, we can only help the guys who are mostly socially normal but can't quite figure out where all the puzzle pieces are when it comes to having a decent dating life.

"Law 1: Master people before you master women"

From one of my favorite articles about Game of all time: https://strengthbysonny.com/2014/02/12/h...ls-part-i/

[eradicator]

(11-28-2018 07:47 PM)Anchor Man Wrote:  

(11-28-2018 07:36 PM)eradicator Wrote:  

Is it the dude who wanted to get chin surgery? Maybe five years ago a guy came onto the forum posting about making a lot of approaches and getting zero bangs. He wasn't bad looking and got a lot of help from forum vets and he proceeded to ignore all of the awesome advice he was given and just keep doing what he was doing and not getting bangs. And he insisted it was because he wasn't getting chin surgery. It's been a few years but that's the nutshell.

Are you talking about the jewish guy who traveled to Asia ?

thread-36769.html

No. It was this dude. thread-28282.html

500 approaches and zero lays. He only approached 19 year old super hotties. He got banned for trolling, came back and made another account talking about how he would be getting laid constantly if he only had chin surgery. It wasn't that hard to find the first thread, and it's a good read because there is some awesome advice in there from WIA and others. But for the life of me I can't find his second thread about needing chin surgery and not really into spending more than 2 minutes looking up old threads.

[subterfuge]

(11-29-2018 04:47 AM)eradicator Wrote:  

500 approaches and zero lays. He only approached 19 year old super hotties

That's a bit different I think. That kind of sounds 'normal' to me, to be honest!! lol (expected if you are going for teenage stunners)
I very much believe in 'game', but No matter how much game you have (social skills/confiendence etc), depending on your looks and age and lots of other factors, banging some super hot 19 year old just isn't gonna happen. I think lots of people could approach 1 million stunning 18 year olds and none of them would be interested even if you had 'good game' tbh

[Kether]

The most common issues in those cases.....low smv or poor grooming. Coming off ass creepy or boring or a pussy.....extreme lack of social calibration or failure to read social cues etc. Best bet: Hire a personal trainer/fashion consultant or atleast do all you can in that area. Hire a mentor to coach you or find guys who are better than you and offer them some sort of value or financial incentive.

[firat113]

The 80/20 rule i don't think means the top 20% of guys are fucking the top 80% of women. I think it simply means the top 20% have ACCESS to the top 80%. And let's be real for a moment, how many of us would consider anything below the top 50%? I keep reading posts here about the average American girl, how you rarely see much higher than 7's walking around. That's a problem. Suddenly you get the same top percentage of guys fucking the few sacred 8's and 9's while the 6's and 7's girls chase the same guys that are chasing the 8's and 9's. So what does that leave the guys outside of the top 20% with? Scraps and below average girls. No wonder a lot of guys go MGTOW or get a toxic mindset and switch over to incel ideology when this happens.

I think it has something to do with the market being more favoured towards the top 20% and further down the line in a few years towards the top 10%. It will only get harder from now, so if you don't work for it and get a spot in the top now, you'll be left behind to possibly join forces with the frustrated betas, MGTOW and incels forced to swallow the black pill, accepting that "you've tried everything to max yourself out, but the market is forever against you", which is why a lot of guys give up before even trying. Or give up after X amount of approaches when in reality it's not about the quantity of approaches but the quality of approaches. A prime example is this guy in the recordings that clearly has other issues than looks going for him. What a trash personality for one.

Anyone can bang 5s and 6s but the difference is seeing how much effort guys put into improving their SMV hell of a lot more than any woman is willing to and it doesn't pay off with anything high up the ladder, that's where it goes wrong for most of us. If you're ok with fucking 6s for the rest of your life then, by all means, go for it, anyone with the slightest personality/looks can do so. But you want to see further results up the SMP as your SMV raises and you improve yourself on all aspects possible. It's only natural. You'd want to reap the benefits of your hard work. A fair and square ROI. Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that.

You need to show your SMV, if you claim to have the best product out there, but you don't advertise for it, how will they ever see it. Like the overnight sensations, things going viral, ordinary people suddenly getting attention and blow up with their talent because they've been seen/scouted. If your face+body SMV is a 5/10 but you believe you have a funny/charismatic character and personality better than most guys out there or if you have game better than the average joe out there, you have confidence, then its only about approaching and showing it. Present your value. A girl walks past 100's of men on a daily basis and do you think she ever stops to think "i think this guys personality is great". No, they only see the visual side of you, so you will be seen as the "5" on the SMV, not the "7" you actually are/you think you are.

The 8 and 9s are fighting for the top 5% of men in the world while the rest of the 15% are scraping for the 7's. That's why they are abundant to us "average" guys even with game. It requires SMV out of your reach, like movie star/celebrity status or millionaire in some cases. How many 9s have you fucked in your whole life if you have to be blunt honest? Think about it. It was either on holiday where girls lower their guards for adventure sex or a coincidence which is still preparation meeting opportunity, but it's just so rare.

I think i finally understand why a lot of people travel to foreign countries in South America/Eastern Europe in pursuit of those 8 and 9's that are in abundance, and which you don't need crazy status or money to acquire. You can just be a genuine guy with your life in order and some game.

Even the pussy paradises Roosh is talking so much about in his books and articles for the past 10 years are slowly turning more and more Westernized, and are being trashed with a combination of rising of social media, feminism and PUA boot camps tearing the places apart (take a look at the Poland thread and read about Warsaw/Krakow where it's getting infinitely much harder to approach girls, because of foreign guys coming here to spam approach and fuck things up, looking for EE girls who are easy but still cute and feminine. Now the girls know what's up, after being bombarded for the past 10-15 years they are starting to understand the game being run). So, now what's next?

By maximizing looks, status, etc doesn't automatically qualify you for a spot in the top 20%. You still have to apply for it and you do that by “advertising your product” in this case getting out there in the field. That’s a fact most people can’t seem to grasp. Guys are getting more muscular, dressing better, richer, more game aware etc. Just because you have a spot reserved doesn’t mean it’s yours. If someone is out in the field working harder than you to achieve it while you’re on forums crying about X and Y, who really deserves the spot?

You can vent all you want but then there will always be competition and the competition is rising for the “few” spots in the top in my opinion (we're talking the TOP which most of us crave so much to get a taste of). The market is constantly changing, and if you don't adapt to the market demands, you'll lose your top spot. Most guys think that just because they are in the top 20% then they can fuck 80% of the girls, that's not correct. You start by fucking the lower top of the 80% then work your way up the ladder. You don't have access to the top 5% unless you have something serious going on for you. So at one point maxing your SMV has a limit, accept it and move on.

[chicane]

And please refer to the thread " Young men in today's society don't get enough mentoring from Silverbacks". The dating scene is a bad place for clueless men and it's tough to get some help finding a clue these days.

[tugofpeace]

Lol @ needing to be a millionaire to fuck a 9. You guys need to step off the internet once in a while.

[pancakemouse]

(11-29-2018 07:30 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

Lol @ needing to be a millionaire to fuck a 9. You guys need to step off the internet once in a while.

Read his post. He said in some cases.

Let's not strawman here.

[tugofpeace]

(11-29-2018 07:58 PM)corsega Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 07:30 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

Lol @ needing to be a millionaire to fuck a 9. You guys need to step off the internet once in a while.

Read his post. He said in some cases.

Let's not strawman here.

I see his type of thinking all over the forum. Saying you need to have brad pitt looks or christiano ronaldo fame or fuck you money in order to get with 9s.

9s are people just like anyone else, all it takes is the right game at the right time, I hate reading this defeatist mentality everywhere but it is what it is..

No girl, even a 9, instantly runs off a checklist in her mind whenever a guy approaches her to decide if she wants to fuck him. there are so many nuances that can't be articulated that work in someones' favor.. but whatever. more for me!

[pancakemouse]

(11-29-2018 08:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 07:58 PM)corsega Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 07:30 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

Lol @ needing to be a millionaire to fuck a 9. You guys need to step off the internet once in a while.

Read his post. He said in some cases.

Let's not strawman here.

I see his type of thinking all over the forum. Saying you need to have brad pitt looks or christiano ronaldo fame or fuck you money in order to get with 9s.

9s are people just like anyone else, all it takes is the right game at the right time, I hate reading this defeatist mentality everywhere but it is what it is..

No girl, even a 9, instantly runs off a checklist in her mind whenever a guy approaches her to decide if she wants to fuck him. there are so many nuances that can't be articulated that work in someones' favor.. but whatever. more for me!

Feel free to post your own SMV and the last 9 you banged. PM me if needed.

[scrambled]

I never even see 9s in the USA

[tugofpeace]

(11-29-2018 09:01 PM)corsega Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 08:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 07:58 PM)corsega Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 07:30 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

Lol @ needing to be a millionaire to fuck a 9. You guys need to step off the internet once in a while.

Read his post. He said in some cases.

Let's not strawman here.

I see his type of thinking all over the forum. Saying you need to have brad pitt looks or christiano ronaldo fame or fuck you money in order to get with 9s.

9s are people just like anyone else, all it takes is the right game at the right time, I hate reading this defeatist mentality everywhere but it is what it is..

No girl, even a 9, instantly runs off a checklist in her mind whenever a guy approaches her to decide if she wants to fuck him. there are so many nuances that can't be articulated that work in someones' favor.. but whatever. more for me!

Feel free to post your own SMV and the last 9 you banged. PM me if needed.

What's the point? Anyone could pick a guy off their facebook who's good looking, pick a hot girl, and say they banged her.

[lancelot555]

Hi Guys - first post.

I have been following incel uninstall's 1000 approaches.

I even signed up to give the guy some advice as it was obvious to me from the beginning he was not going to get a g/f.

If you're going to do 1000 approaches and after 100 you dont have any interest, clearly you need to take advice and try different things.

It is clear that his approach is far too direct, negative and hostile to bear any fruit. In the recording published he accuses the girl of lying about saying she has a boyfriend - he also asks if he is too beautiful for her - utter arrogance - I can only assume he is doing a bitter joke on himself because he has no looks - though she doesnt get his masochistic humour.

From what I recall he started off approaching girls on the platform at a metro station! So noisy and people are trying to get places - maybe not the best place to do this? And underground - how many girls did he creep out - hundreds. His parting blow to girls who blanked him was "good luck in the fight against autism"

I tried to tell him - be a nice guy and not so direct - drop the negativity, insults etc. I was accused of being a cucktears faggot by other board members. They evidently think the less respect you show women the better.

Miraculously he did get 2 or 3 dates for his trouble. And he always said pre-date - "I'm going to try and kiss her first date". Stupid - the guy has no sense with women at all. He freaked out the girls he did date and they blocked him. I said he should have focused on the girl as a person - she's your guest - be hospitable and make her feel comfortable. If she wants you to do anything at all - you will see signals - but take it slowly. If nothing happens that's ok - just stay positive and ask if you can see her again.

But no - he blew his only chances and he was blocked. Nobody wanted to see him again.

I lost sympathy with him to be honest. He deserves the dry lonely life he endures as he thinks the fault is with the world and not him. Sadly - he has too much support among his incel peers where his has become a hero which will no doubt re-inforce his attitude.