[mistakemaker]

Hello, this is my first post here so please be lenient.

WARNING: War and peace length, with some cringey moments.

While this wasn't my first rodeo with a woman, what I saw on her FB two weeks ago has been leaving me feeling lifeless, not being able to sleep and in a zombie like state, where I feel like in literal pain, like your actual freaking soul is cut up.

CONTEXT: This is about a girl that I met from work with whom I got closer and closer without knowing it and now she seems forever seared in my mind, making my life very shitty as a result.

YEAR 1: In the spring of this year I was healing after testicular cancer surgery and I somehow got closer to a bombshell from work, whom I was training, though we are on the same hierarchical level so it's not like I was her superior or anything. We laughed in the hallways, talked for hours, had amazing chemistry but I was too much of a puss to do anything, this girl was way out of my league, easily a 8-9 out of 10, a former teen model who was 30 (2 years older than me) but didn't look a day over 25. Out of the blue, she asks if I want to go the the pool with her. This was in summer. While I wasn't much of a pool guy, I was into her. HARD. When we are there I'm going all Pepe le Pew on her but she is dodging my advances. It was then I found that she has a fuckbuddy whom she has feelings for, but he treated her like a fucktoy.

Needless to say I was feeling bummed, hanging at the edge of the pool and from basically nowhere she gets out of the pool, puts her head on my lap and says we should hang out at my place. I could have cum right there and then. Back at my place we eat and she is grinding into me and we kiss, I go down to her breasts, when she gets a call. It's the fuckbuddy. She berates him about this and that but she leaves to be with him. I am DEVASTATED but I figure that oh well, maybe she loves him and I am not the kind of guy to force myself on anyone.

Maybe 2 weeks later, I push to see if she would come over to my place for a movie and to my surprise, she agrees. And apparently, the fuckbuddy is out of the picture. Up to a point, it was the perfect night, a stunningly beautiful girl with whom I have great chemistry, whom I not only want to fuck, but be around, is in my arms, I am massaging her, kissing her, fingering her. After said fingering, I go and get a glass of water, I come back, we talk like 10 minutes about our families and shit and I move on to the main course but she says it's late and she has to go, she makes a remark about the condoms by the TV as if coming over all by yourself to some guy's place isn't basically consenting to sexual relations. I am CONFUSED, what is up with this girl, is she into me or not?

In then next period she says that she just doesn't see herself with me, feelings are not there but I am not sure about this and I keep inviting her for movie night. She came over about 3-4 more times and each time got progressively colder, rejecting my affections. In the end, she said that if she wanted to mess with my head, she could, but that she doesn't want to give me false hope and she won't be coming to my place anymore.

YEAR 2: I kept sporadic contact with her since I changed jobs but she contacted me around spring. One more thing, in most of our relationship SHE was the one contacting me. I was posting stuff on her FB to make her laugh but as far as phone calls go, she was the one calling 90% of the time. We would talk for hours about us, jobs, human nature but I would always see that she kept pushing me into a little brother/friend type of role and I kept flirting with her, making sexual innuendos and literally saying that I was NOT her friend. I also supported her emotionally when her parents/friends would act shitty to her. She came over to my place as I was fixing her PC and she kept getting phone calls who she tried to ignore but the other end was very pushy. As it turns out, it's her new boyfriend, a guy couple of years younger than me (after she told me how much she wants a mature guy after some of the immature men she was with), whom she didn't tell she was going to my place and who was very jealous. They had a sort of fight and I found out that they split ways soon after. I found that she met this guy at the end of the year , around New's year Eve, in my hometown. I was there as well in that period but she found excuses as to why we couldn't hang out. Now I know why.

The rest of YEAR2 was very confusing. I kept trying to stay in this girl's orbit and kept hitting on her, thinking she was confused about her attraction to me (and she was in her early 30's, a confusing period in a woman's life) and would wise up. We literally shot some pool, went to the beach (with others), went to the park, movies and we even went out ALONE on her freaking birthday. Yet, whenever I would push physically, she would back off. In her circle of friends, she was introduced to a guy who would be crucial to this very long story. A bald, droopy faced looking guy in his mid 40's, who drove her and her friends (male and female) around, who insisted that he only saw her as a friend. I laughed and told her that any straight man would want her but she said that I was thinking with my dick. After a couple of months of this guy pretending, he made a move on her, she rejected him and he didn't take it too well. For my sanity, I decided in the end of year, that I would limit contact with this girl, still being dejected about her refusal and not knowing what I did wrong.

YEAR 3: Other than maybe posting funny stuff to her on FB and the occasional phone call from her, I didn't really interact with her much. I had a lot on my plate with work, hitting the weights at home and trying my hand at online dating, without much success. As far as I know, she wasn't with anyone for this year. I was mostly over her from the beginning of the year anyway, in my mind, I even wished her all the best, that she would find a great guy as time was running out on her biological clock and she would always talk about having babies. Since I truly loved this girl, I wanted to know that she would be well off in the future, even if it wasn't with me.

YEAR 4: Again, not much contact other than FB interaction till spring. She had a personal tragedy and a friend of hers reached out to me. I called her and said that things would be fine and that time heals all things. Maybe a month after, I kept seeing #afterhatecomeslove hashtags from her posts and posting pictures in which she seems very cheerful and smiling. Thinking that she found a new guy (she is pushing 34 by this point), I was actually a bit happy for her until I found out who it was: the fucking bald guy she rejected nearly 2 years earlier. Her letting him touch her literally makes me want to heave, my chests start to hurt thinking about this. It's like imagining Eva Green getting railed by a hobo. This literally enraged me and that's not a easy thing to do. I accused her of having major cognitive dissonance on FB, as she says that she wants one thing and does another. Wants commited relationship, has fuckbuddy. Wants mature guy, dates a jealous youngster. Says she wants a new job for 2 years now, hasn't sent out a single resume. Has a serious guy that loves and supports her in me, claims she doesn't feel that way anymore and can't explain why. Wants honest guys, goes out with a guy who lied to her for months on end about his intentions. She was very stand off'ish, saying that she didn't give me false hope, that it was my fault (even though she was the one encouraging me in YEAR 1 and YEAR 2) for getting my hopes up and that she should have broken of all contact since YEAR 1. Didn't address the disonance part as she probably knew I was right about her hypocrisy. She merely said that she fell in love with him and that she can see herself being with him.

After receiving the news, I couldn't sleep right for a week and I keep getting these pains in my groin area. I am very afraid as my doctor said that cancer usually comes back in very stressful situations and I feel like a zombie right now. I finally matched a Tinder date soon after and I thought the casual sex would maybe take my mind off her. Nope. The memory of kissing this girl who plagued me for 4 years is 10 times more erotic than the girl I just fucked a couple of days ago. Not to mention that I have this standard in my head now, how in the hell am I gonna find a beautiful girl on her level who is also a great conversationalist and who knows when to be a bit vulgar and when to not.

Wanting to be a gentleman about it and not wanting to leave on a sour note, I visited her at her workplace for one last time. I mellowed out a bit thinking "oh well, maybe she does love him and they will be ok together. God knows what she sees in him". When I saw her (she looked stunning, as always), I repeated the cognitive dissonance thing, she congratulated me on the Tinder date but again, she kept addressing me like a little brother/friend. She said that she simply fell in love with this guy, I told her that she fell for the guy that was most around her as she was too lazy to look, a guy what lied to her for months,that didn't sit well with her, she tried to reframe that she was basically pushing friendship on him, pure BS. I asked her how can she date a guy 12 years older than her, never married, not likely to be looking to father children and she said that while she would never envision herself dating someone so old, you never know what the future brings or how long they will be together. This basically gave me the impression that this is a transitory relationship, for fun. With her being nearly 34 and saying that she wants children, wasting precious time with this guy. DISSONANCE CENTRAL.

She said that she would unfriend me on FB as she would not want to hurt me by seeing picture of him and her, I expressed my doubts about her relationship and future but wished her the best of luck and said that if she wants a serious relationship, she can give me a call, provided I am free.

After the first 2 years, I though I was over this girl but this news hit me like a ton of bricks, physically and mentally. I could not sleep for a week and lost 3-4 kg. It boggles the mind of how someone who is so thoughtful in the rest of the aspects of her life can have such AWFUL fucking taste in men and not see how she is wasting time with losers and dumbasses and ruining her life. She came onto me and does not know why. She rejected me and said that after a point she didn't feel like we can be together. She feels for this guy even excusing his lying behavior. Not saying that logic has anything to do with love/lust but there needs to be some consistency between words and actions.

Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post, but I would like some FEEDBACK on how to fucking block the dark thoughts of her giving herself to this guy. It's been 2 weeks but it still makes me want to puke. I've been burying myself in work, going on long walks, lifting weights, fucking another girl but I still fucking think about this girl and how I give more of a fuck about her future (both work and love wise) than she does and how she won't take any responsability about leading me on in those first 2 years. Thing is, I would love to call her a ho but she only dated a few AWFUL guys in her life (6 until 30 if her words are true) and all have been fucking losers (one guy didn't even work, she was supporting him financially and he kept abusing her) and even though I should hate her for what she did, I still can't fucking do it and I hope that things work out for her and she gets the family she says she wants.

The only positive take away for me is that I must be above average looking if this girl was initiating with me, back in YEAR 1. She could have ANY guy she wanted but for some reason she picked me in that instance. Great body, outgoing personality, but unfortunately an unstable character.

[Winston Wolfe]

I have actually read your entire post and am going to highlight some things for you.

(06-09-2018 01:57 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

Hello, this is my first post here so please be lenient.

WARNING: War and peace length, with some cringey moments.

While this wasn't my first rodeo with a woman, what I saw on her FB two weeks ago has been leaving me feeling lifeless, not being able to sleep and in a zombie like state, where I feel like in literal pain, like your actual freaking soul is cut up.

Welcome to the forum. You have come to the right place.

The rest of my post is going to contain some harsh truths, but that is what the red pill is about. None of us here have had an easy time swallowing it.

Remember that we are here to help, and not trying to bash you, make fun of you or kick a man when he's down. But you do need to face reality and we can't hand that to you wrapped in soft tissues.

Quote:

CONTEXT: This is about a girl that I met from work with whom I got closer and closer without knowing it and now she seems forever seared in my mind, making my life very shitty as a result.

YEAR 1: In the spring of this year I was healing after testicular cancer surgery and I somehow got closer to a bombshell from work, whom I was training, though we are on the same hierarchical level so it's not like I was her superior or anything. We laughed in the hallways, talked for hours, had amazing chemistry but I was too much of a puss to do anything, this girl was way out of my league, easily a 8-9 out of 10, a former teen model who was 30 (2 years older than me) but didn't look a day over 25. Out of the blue, she asks if I want to go the the pool with her. This was in summer. While I wasn't much of a pool guy, I was into her. HARD. When we are there I'm going all Pepe le Pew on her but she is dodging my advances. It was then I found that she has a fuckbuddy whom she has feelings for, but he treated her like a fucktoy.

Alright, so you put her way up on the pedestal. I am going to take a wild guess here and assume that you weren't getting laid much at this time in your life, if at all. She was the only female giving you some attention and you fell for her right away. Correct? This is referred to as oneitis and you caught a severe case that ended up lasting several years.

Also, she had feelings for this guy BECAUSE he treated her like a fucktoy. It's ironic, but that's how the female brain works.

Quote:

Needless to say I was feeling bummed, hanging at the edge of the pool and from basically nowhere she gets out of the pool, puts her head on my lap and says we should hang out at my place. I could have cum right there and then. Back at my place we eat and she is grinding into me and we kiss, I go down to her breasts, when she gets a call. It's the fuckbuddy. She berates him about this and that but she leaves to be with him. I am DEVASTATED but I figure that oh well, maybe she loves him and I am not the kind of guy to force myself on anyone.

Not much to say here, just try to look at the bolded parts and realize how it sounds.

Quote:

Maybe 2 weeks later, I push to see if she would come over to my place for a movie and to my surprise, she agrees. And apparently, the fuckbuddy is out of the picture. Up to a point, it was the perfect night, a stunningly beautiful girl with whom I have great chemistry, whom I not only want to fuck, but be around, is in my arms, I am massaging her, kissing her, fingering her. After said fingering, I go and get a glass of water, I come back, we talk like 10 minutes about our families and shit and I move on to the main course but she says it's late and she has to go, she makes a remark about the condoms by the TV as if coming over all by yourself to some guy's place isn't basically consenting to sexual relations. I am CONFUSED, what is up with this girl, is she into me or not?

In then next period she says that she just doesn't see herself with me, feelings are not there but I am not sure about this and I keep inviting her for movie night. She came over about 3-4 more times and each time got progressively colder, rejecting my affections. In the end, she said that if she wanted to mess with my head, she could, but that she doesn't want to give me false hope and she won't be coming to my place anymore.

In your history with this girl, this was likely the only window of opportunity where you could've flipped the frame your way and take what's yours. The fuckbuddy was out of the picture, she let you finger her and she made a remark about the condoms. When a girl makes a remark about sex, even when that remark is "we're not going to have sex", that is a green light. The fact that she is imagining what it would be like to have sex with you is all you need.

A girl letting you finger her is pretty much the greenest light you can get to escalate things further. Around this time, she was testing you to see what you're made of (this is something all women do).

You failed to escalate things further and fell into her frame completely, which resulted in her losing whatever was left of the attraction she had for you.

Quote:

YEAR 2: I kept sporadic contact with her since I changed jobs but she contacted me around spring. One more thing, in most of our relationship SHE was the one contacting me. I was posting stuff on her FB to make her laugh but as far as phone calls go, she was the one calling 90% of the time. We would talk for hours about us, jobs, human nature but I would always see that she kept pushing me into a little brother/friend type of role and I kept flirting with her, making sexual innuendos and literally saying that I was NOT her friend. I also supported her emotionally when her parents/friends would act shitty to her. She came over to my place as I was fixing her PC and she kept getting phone calls who she tried to ignore but the other end was very pushy. As it turns out, it's her new boyfriend, a guy couple of years younger than me (after she told me how much she wants a mature guy after some of the immature men she was with), whom she didn't tell she was going to my place and who was very jealous. They had a sort of fight and I found out that they split ways soon after. I found that she met this guy at the end of the year , around New's year Eve, in my hometown. I was there as well in that period but she found excuses as to why we couldn't hang out. Now I know why.

The rest of YEAR2 was very confusing. I kept trying to stay in this girl's orbit and kept hitting on her, thinking she was confused about her attraction to me (and she was in her early 30's, a confusing period in a woman's life) and would wise up. We literally shot some pool, went to the beach (with others), went to the park, movies and we even went out ALONE on her freaking birthday. Yet, whenever I would push physically, she would back off. In her circle of friends, she was introduced to a guy who would be crucial to this very long story. A bald, droopy faced looking guy in his mid 40's, who drove her and her friends (male and female) around, who insisted that he only saw her as a friend. I laughed and told her that any straight man would want her but she said that I was thinking with my dick. After a couple of months of this guy pretending, he made a move on her, she rejected him and he didn't take it too well. For my sanity, I decided in the end of year, that I would limit contact with this girl, still being dejected about her refusal and not knowing what I did wrong.

By this time, you were in full on emotional tampon territory. Every girls has several of these, and they are usually not the guys fucking her brains out every weekend.

Just look at the bolded parts man. What did she do to deserve that treatment from you, except look good and have a nice body?

Quote:

YEAR 3: Other than maybe posting funny stuff to her on FB and the occasional phone call from her, I didn't really interact with her much. I had a lot on my plate with work, hitting the weights at home and trying my hand at online dating, without much success. As far as I know, she wasn't with anyone for this year. I was mostly over her from the beginning of the year anyway, in my mind, I even wished her all the best, that she would find a great guy as time was running out on her biological clock and she would always talk about having babies. Since I truly loved this girl, I wanted to know that she would be well off in the future, even if it wasn't with me.

Now this is where this story should have ended. You were on the right track, you were getting over her and focusing on improving yourself. This would also be my number one advice to do again ASAP.

And yes, she was with guys this year, I guarantee it. If she's as attractive as you claim she is, you can bet your ass she got fucked that year. Especially given the fact that she's in her early 30's and realizes full well that time is running out and she's approaching the wall. She needs to find a man to lock down.

What happened here is that you stopped caring, and surprise surprise, there was hardly any contact anymore. You weren't providing an emotional outlet anymore, and during this time, she found someone else to fulfill this role in her life. Remember, every woman ALWAYS has someone that fulfills this role and it's rarely the man (or men) she's fucking.

Quote:

YEAR 4: Again, not much contact other than FB interaction till spring. She had a personal tragedy and a friend of hers reached out to me. I called her and said that things would be fine and that time heals all things. Maybe a month after, I kept seeing #afterhatecomeslove hashtags from her posts and posting pictures in which she seems very cheerful and smiling. Thinking that she found a new guy (she is pushing 34 by this point), I was actually a bit happy for her until I found out who it was: the fucking bald guy she rejected nearly 2 years earlier. Her letting him touch her literally makes me want to heave, my chests start to hurt thinking about this. It's like imagining Eva Green getting railed by a hobo. This literally enraged me and that's not a easy thing to do.

You can thank that friend for sucking you right back into your personal hell. On the other hand, you let this happen. Deep down, you were still hoping for another shot with her.

Quote:

I accused her of having major cognitive dissonance on FB, as she says that she wants one thing and does another. Wants commited relationship, has fuckbuddy. Wants mature guy, dates a jealous youngster. Says she wants a new job for 2 years now, hasn't sent out a single resume. Has a serious guy that loves and supports her in me, claims she doesn't feel that way anymore and can't explain why. Wants honest guys, goes out with a guy who lied to her for months on end about his intentions. She was very stand off'ish, saying that she didn't give me false hope, that it was my fault (even though she was the one encouraging me in YEAR 1 and YEAR 2) for getting my hopes up and that she should have broken of all contact since YEAR 1. Didn't address the disonance part as she probably knew I was right about her hypocrisy. She merely said that she fell in love with him and that she can see herself being with him.

Get it firmly imprinted in your mind: what a girl says is not the same as what she does. Always, always, always look at what a girl does. Acknowledge what she says, then mentally disregard it immediately. Actions > words.

Whereas a man takes pride in staying true to his words, a woman's words have no meaning. I would even go so far as to say that cognitive dissonance is a concept that does not exist in the female brain.

When they say something, that is how they GENUINELY FEEL at THAT POINT IN TIME. Even though one hour later, she can do the complete opposite of what she just said she would do, in her mind, no incongruity exists.

For me, this has been the single hardest part about the red pill and female nature for me to digest and come to terms with. For a man, with his rational brain and rational thinking, this is almost impossible to understand on a fundamental level, and I am not claiming that I do. But it's the truth.

Quote:

After receiving the news, I couldn't sleep right for a week and I keep getting these pains in my groin area. I am very afraid as my doctor said that cancer usually comes back in very stressful situations and I feel like a zombie right now. I finally matched a Tinder date soon after and I thought the casual sex would maybe take my mind off her. Nope. The memory of kissing this girl who plagued me for 4 years is 10 times more erotic than the girl I just fucked a couple of days ago. Not to mention that I have this standard in my head now, how in the hell am I gonna find a beautiful girl on her level who is also a great conversationalist and who knows when to be a bit vulgar and when to not.

Wanting to be a gentleman about it and not wanting to leave on a sour note, I visited her at her workplace for one last time. I mellowed out a bit thinking "oh well, maybe she does love him and they will be ok together. God knows what she sees in him". When I saw her (she looked stunning, as always), I repeated the cognitive dissonance thing, she congratulated me on the Tinder date but again, she kept addressing me like a little brother/friend. She said that she simply fell in love with this guy, I told her that she fell for the guy that was most around her as she was too lazy to look, a guy what lied to her for months,that didn't sit well with her, she tried to reframe that she was basically pushing friendship on him, pure BS. I asked her how can she date a guy 12 years older than her, never married, not likely to be looking to father children and she said that while she would never envision herself dating someone so old, you never know what the future brings or how long they will be together. This basically gave me the impression that this is a transitory relationship, for fun. With her being nearly 34 and saying that she wants children, wasting precious time with this guy. DISSONANCE CENTRAL.

She congratulated you on the Tinder date. Really?

I will ask it again: during this entire affair, did you get laid often? Date often? See other girls? Anything? I'm guessing no, which is a big part of the problem.

Go out and fuck 10 other girls, then see how you feel about this one. Fuck 10 more and she'll be a distant memory. Don't know how to do that? You find yourself in the perfect community of men who can help you with that.

Also, again: disregard what she says about this guy and look at the facts. She's 34, the wall is likely coming at her at full force by this point. This guy can likely provide for her and give her one last shot at becoming a mother. She instinctively feels this is her best option.

On another note, you should be happy that you are not that guy as it sounds like he's even more oblivious to the facts, and like you he was rejected by this same woman before. I wish him the best of luck dealing with the bullshit.

Quote:

She said that she would unfriend me on FB as she would not want to hurt me by seeing picture of him and her, I expressed my doubts about her relationship and future but wished her the best of luck and said that if she wants a serious relationship, she can give me a call, provided I am free.

No. What you do now is rip the bandaid off completely and make it impossible for her to contact you. Block her number and block her on all social media and email.

I think part of you knows that you have to do this. Else you wouldn't post here on this very forum. Can you not see that this woman has completely dominated the last 4 years of your life and made you absolutely miserable? What makes you think this will ever change, if not worsen?

Quote:

After the first 2 years, I though I was over this girl but this news hit me like a ton of bricks, physically and mentally. I could not sleep for a week and lost 3-4 kg. It boggles the mind of how someone who is so thoughtful in the rest of the aspects of her life can have such AWFUL fucking taste in men and not see how she is wasting time with losers and dumbasses and ruining her life. She came onto me and does not know why. She rejected me and said that after a point she didn't feel like we can be together. She feels for this guy even excusing his lying behavior. Not saying that logic has anything to do with love/lust but there needs to be some consistency between words and actions.

Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post, but I would like some FEEDBACK on how to fucking block the dark thoughts of her giving herself to this guy. It's been 2 weeks but it still makes me want to puke. I've been burying myself in work, going on long walks, lifting weights, fucking another girl but I still fucking think about this girl and how I give more of a fuck about her future (both work and love wise) than she does and how she won't take any responsability about leading me on in those first 2 years. Thing is, I would love to call her a ho but she only dated a few AWFUL guys in her life (6 until 30 if her words are true) and all have been fucking losers (one guy didn't even work, she was supporting him financially and he kept abusing her) and even though I should hate her for what she did, I still can't fucking do it and I hope that things work out for her and she gets the family she says she wants.

The only positive take away for me is that I must be above average looking if this girl was initiating with me, back in YEAR 1. She could have ANY guy she wanted but for some reason she picked me in that instance. Great body, outgoing personality, but unfortunately an unstable character.

I feel that you are more than ready to finally close this poisonous chapter of your life.

Whatever you do, don't you fucking stop working, lifting weights and fucking girls. You are on the right track here and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Improving yourself physically and mentally has a compound effect and is the gateway to success in all areas of life. But it's a long term process without shortcuts.

Build momentum. Improve yourself. Approach girls. Keep going. Week after week. Month after month.

Have you noticed that I never once addressed your remark about this being related to your cancer? I sincerely hope all the best for you in the health department, but it is not related to your problem with this girl. Realize that.

One final note:

Do not view these 4 years as being a waste. Rather view them as a unique opportunity to learn and grow as a man. If it took 4 years for you to find this community and start becoming the new you, those 4 years were the greatest blessing of your life.

You have all the time in the world. Fortunately, a man's sexual value only improves over time. A woman's sexual value peaks in her early 20's and then goes down, ever so slowly, until she reaches her early 30's like this girl.

Then, she settles for a bald, droopy faced looking guy in his mid 40's because that's the best bet she still has.

[mistakemaker]

@WinstonWolfe, I want to thank you for your feedback, I agree with most of it. Yeah, you were right about me not getting any in that period.

Just to clarify, the reason why I created this thread was to get some feedback and soothe my feelings because it's not that I am afraid to hurt, I am afraid that hurting so bad (and stomach/groin pains are nothing to scoff at) because I can't block this girl from my mid. My biggest nightmare is having a cancer relapse (I only got one ball left) because of this woman who ultimately treated me like crap and does not recognize any fault. In fact the only fault she recognized was not cutting contact with me after the initial rejection.

As I said, this isn't my first rodeo, I am game aware, though not game proficient. I've had other women before but if I am being honest, they were mostly around the 6-7 range. The reason why I pedestalized this girl is not only because she is by far the hottest (8.5-9) I have ALMOST been with (as I said memories of kissing her get me harder than the last fully nude girl I fucked from Tinder, casual sex is not really for me, I need to get invested emotionally, I can't fuck mechanically so to speak) but I had fucking terrific conversations with her, both before and after we almost fucked. While she wasn't some world class intellectual she knew how to listen and we could talk on a broad variety of topics from our jobs, men-women, human nature. And what got to me is that she knew when to get a bit vulgar and flirty and when to dial it down. A rare trait in a woman, who are either pottymouth "emancipated" whores or dainty wallflowers. Probably another reason why I pedestalized was that, not only was she hot and decently smart, she came onto me, basically did the dirty work so to speak, all I had to do was move in.

I know I did a bitch move by letting her leave when she got a call from her fuckbuddy instead of giving an ultimatum or something like that. I actually didn't think too much of it at the time because I thought "eh she says she loves him and I'm not gonna force this girl. Fuck it." Believe it or not I was over it in about 3 days. I was thinking that that was that and I wasn't gonna ever bang her. The problem was that I was seeing her at work and she was still finding ways to talk to me and making sexual innuendos. When I found out that the fuckbuddy was out, that's when I invited her over. And to my surprise she agreed.

As I said, back at my place, I was escalating hard, I fingered the hell out of her and there is one sentence that stuck with me, not sure if it meant anything or not, but with this unstable girl, who knows. After kissing and fingering HARD, I go and get a glass of water and I wipe my sticky hand on the sheet. She looks at me with a half joking half serious tone: "you should have licked your fingers clean." And she seemed receptive when I came back but seemed to go cold after I tried to move on blowjob/sex and literally left me with my dick in my hand.

All I got from her in the days after was that she is unsure about her feeling and that she doesn't see us being together. I know about abundance mentality and all that but I was HOOKED. I am a pretty persistent and stubborn guy and I felt that, with a little more push, she would be mine. In the weeks after this episode she came to my place another 2-3 times, each times getting colder and colder even though I was pushing HARD, kissing of the neck, earlobes, she seems receptive until I try to unbutton her pants.I'm trying to shake any friend vibes she might have tried on me by kino'ing hard. The last visit she said she won't be coming over anymore as she doesn't want to give me any false hopes and that she could play with my emotions but because she cares about me, she won't do that. So why the fuck did she come over another 2-3 times after leaving me despondent? I've mad last minute resistance but nothing like this whereas it appears that she is giving you another chance only to go cold when you try and capitalize.

About the orbiter bit: Yeah, I know that I was doing it a bit in year 2. But here's the thing, I was always putting sexual innuendos into our conversations and she was going along, I literally kept saying that I was NOT her friend and that I look at her as a woman, she would smile, say that she understands and she would let me go physical up to a point. By the end of year 2, she was literally swatting my hand away. I know that she saw me as weak because I kept going along with this but why in the hell did she keep contacting me to go places if she wasn't interested? If a girl texts you to go shoot pool, I see it as a date. If we go together to a bar on her birthday, I see it as a date. The birthday bit was particularly painful to me, as I got her a rose, we talked, then walked in the park and when I tried to move in closer on the bench (not even for a kiss, though I was working up to that), she put some space between us. I still don't get why these games were played, just say that you are not interested, break contact and move on.

What gets me is that his girl is unstable but she doesn't check the HO markers for me. I've seen plenty of hoes in my time, mostly via my friends who dated quite a bit of them, they are low quality in all aspects of life. This girl seems masochistic in her choice of men (from what she told me she went out 3 years with a guy who did barely any work and left her with debts in her name, a jealous youngster who she dumped in 2 months and now this guy who lied for her months on end) but a sweet and loving girl otherwise. She had to move back home at 30 after gathering debt with the douche, both her parents are alcoholics, she drives her friends around without charging for gas, babysitting for them when they want to get out (she loves children, another plus for me) etc. She is narcissistic (posts on FB constantly) but she also does for others.

Yeah, I know it was a mistake contacting her after her mother died, but I felt I had to. As corny as it sounds, I loved this girl, I wanted to be around her, not just bury my dick in her. Our relationship didn't start of a sudden, I talked to her for months on end before she invited me to the pool (as I was too chickenshit, she was way outta my league), I could appreciate more than her brazilian looking ass and long toned legs. Yeah, she did say that she was glad for me about the Tinder date, as in she was glad that I got laid and I got the same vibe from her that I HATED, when she tried to talk to me like I was her little brother or a friend.

The major dissonance and beauty leds me to believe that she probably dated some badboy douche in her teens that treated her like shit and this is what gets her off. I know that women't aren't exactly rational beings but I've never encountered such schizofrenic behavior, so to speak. I've had women reject me but I've never had women try to ingratiate themselves with me, let me hit on them and wonder why I hit on them and say that they don't "feel" that we could be together whereas she "feels" that way with a cunt who lied for her for months on end.

I've learned the hard way that you need to know when to let go and know that some people you can't help, no matter how much you care for them. This guy will probably fuck her gorgeous body and face silly for a couple of months and he will move on (seeing as he is a bachelor at 45, never married, I'm guessing he is a player type, even though he looks like Pierluigi Collina). Then she will be 35-36 and with no serious man around with whom to start a family and biological clock winding down for good.

I have two questions:
1) How do I behave if she contacts me again in a couple of months? This girl has great look, great outgoing personality but I've changed my views on her character, which is unstable and leaves a lot to be desired. The guy in me says that I still want to finalize that evening from 4 years ago, to go further than fingering. The rational part of me says that you don't want to fuck crazy. A third part of me says that I would love nothing more than to fuck her and leave her.

2) How in the fuck do I adjust my standards? Judging myself on status and looks (I clean up pretty well), I would average around a 6.3, maybe 7 if I'm being generous with myself. Until her, I've only fucked girls around this range. Now I'm having issues being attracted to other girls as they somehow seem lesser once I've gotten an admittedly small taste of 8.5-9. The only really casual sex I had (the girl from Tinder, whom I matched after maybe 100-200 swipes, seems more efficient to got prostitutes ), was a 7-8 in the body but maybe a 5.5 in the face but she didn't really do it for me. Now I don't know if this is because I am the kind of guy who fucks better when there are some feeling for the girl I am screwing or because I had the 8.5 girl in the back of my mind. While I only have this small sample, really really hot girls seem to be cuckoo from what I'm seeing.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

[not_dead_yet]

Dude. You're not listening.

It's never going to happen with her. Block her.

Move on. Find another girl.

[mistakemaker]

(06-09-2018 02:12 PM)not_dead_yet Wrote:  

Dude. You're not listening.

It's never going to happen with her. Block her.

Move on. Find another girl.

Yeah, I know.

[jcardial]

(06-09-2018 02:49 PM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

(06-09-2018 02:12 PM)not_dead_yet Wrote:  

Dude. You're not listening.

It's never going to happen with her. Block her.

Move on. Find another girl.

Yeah, I know.

Friend zoned/point of no return:
You made a very simple and common blunder. The problem is you telegraphed the fact that you believed she is much higher value (a figment of your imagination as she's a crazy washed up 30+ year old), which permanently wrecked her attraction to you. Imagine one of your Tinder 6s had lumpy gross hairy tits and a diseased fishy vagina, this is the equivalent of where her attraction for you is, so it's time to give up. Once you made her feel like she would be dating very down to be romantic with you, there was no salvaging it. You probably leaked this belief several times over.

Breaking down all of your game blunders is pointless as there were clearly many from what you wrote. Consider it consolation that you would have probably botched it anyway even if she had put out and you'd be even more tortured that "your girl" is getting stuffed by some dad bod geezer.

Emotional tampon/Anti-Chad:
You became her emotional support lap dog after permanently wrecking the attraction. You were her safe space to go when she craved attention and to be told she's beautiful because the guy she was actually attracted to was treating her like crap. It had nothing to do with attraction for you or ambivalence. She was tolerating your flirtation so she wouldn't lose you as her feel good lackey. She hung out with you on her birthday to feel less depressed about being lonely. Stop wishing on a star that you can salvage the Hindenburg that your barrage of anti-game created.

Moving on:
You just have to quit being a big ol' bitch and move on by deleting all images and contact. It might take a while to forget about her since you fretted so much, but you only will if you're disciplined and trust that she will fade out. Again, your game wouldn't have sufficed to keep this impulsive girl in line anyway. Focus on the negatives which are trivial to find with her. She is going to be wrinkled and sterile in a few years and likely a crazy cat lady. Meanwhile you're acting like she's the only woman on the planet and making excuses for her glaring flaws. You're still young for a man so stop acting like a baby crazy cougar and like your perfectly healthy remaining testicle is somehow your last remaining egg dangling from a sickly ovary. Just get some sperm frozen if you're that paranoid. See a doctor if you think you're unhealthy or significantly increasing your risk of a relapse, which to be honest sounds like you being melodramatic (not professional medical advice).

Even if you hit reset you'd fail again:
When I was a beginner like you in game I botched it with much much hotter and younger girls than this cougar that you've built up in your mind but rather than wallowing in it for extended periods I learned from my mistakes and new opportunities came along and I capitalized. Remembering your blunders is always going to sting a tad, but harness it as motivation to improve. You'll never be able to get a girl above a 6-7 if you don't improve your game and get experience and learn how to be cool around women you actually find attractive. Anyone can act like James Bond around a slutty average looking girl.

A hot girl that is actually attracted to you could fall into your lap tomorrow and you would probably just sabotage it by instinctively going into pedestal lap dog mode again. Your game has more holes than Swiss cheese and until you fix it you won't be able to hold down a girl you consider hot. For example, the alternative you suggested to your mistake was also terrible game (e.g. thinking giving her an ultimatum would have helped).

Conclusion:
We've all been there to some degree or another and it's just part of getting better at game so cut the self pity and act like a man of your age. You will fail with more hot girls to come, it's not the end of the world. Would a hot young girl want to date the kind of guy that's emo sick for years over some crazy cougar? You have a lot of work to do and you've made the right first step seeking help.

You've built a girl up in your mind into a flawless figment of your imagination. You also completely misread the dynamic and its something only getting better at game will prevent in the future. There are much hotter and cooler single girls out there, but you certainly won't ever have a chance with them if you only spend time on low hanging fruit from tinder and pining for some lame old chick that was never legitimately attracted to you in the first place. I guarantee you would have scared her away anyway.

[mistakemaker]

(06-09-2018 07:47 PM)jcardial Wrote:  

(06-09-2018 02:49 PM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

(06-09-2018 02:12 PM)not_dead_yet Wrote:  

Dude. You're not listening.

It's never going to happen with her. Block her.

Move on. Find another girl.

Yeah, I know.

Friend zoned/point of no return:
You made a very simple and common blunder. The problem is you telegraphed the fact that you believed she is much higher value (a figment of your imagination as she's a crazy washed up 30+ year old), which permanently wrecked her attraction to you. Imagine one of your Tinder 6s had lumpy gross hairy tits and a diseased fishy vagina, this is the equivalent of where her attraction for you is, so it's time to give up. Once you made her feel like she would be dating very down to be romantic with you, there was no salvaging it. You probably leaked this belief several times over.

Breaking down all of your game blunders is pointless as there were clearly many from what you wrote. Consider it consolation that you would have probably botched it anyway even if she had put out and you'd be even more tortured that "your girl" is getting stuffed by some dad bod geezer.

Emotional tampon/Anti-Chad:
You became her emotional support lap dog after permanently wrecking the attraction. You were her safe space to go when she craved attention and to be told she's beautiful because the guy she was actually attracted to was treating her like crap. It had nothing to do with attraction for you or ambivalence. She was tolerating your flirtation so she wouldn't lose you as her feel good lackey. She hung out with you on her birthday to feel less depressed about being lonely. Stop wishing on a star that you can salvage the Hindenburg that your barrage of anti-game created.

Moving on:
You just have to quit being a big ol' bitch and move on by deleting all images and contact. It might take a while to forget about her since you fretted so much, but you only will if you're disciplined and trust that she will fade out. Again, your game wouldn't have sufficed to keep this impulsive girl in line anyway. Focus on the negatives which are trivial to find with her. She is going to be wrinkled and sterile in a few years and likely a crazy cat lady. Meanwhile you're acting like she's the only woman on the planet and making excuses for her glaring flaws. You're still young for a man so stop acting like a baby crazy cougar and like your perfectly healthy remaining testicle is somehow your last remaining egg dangling from a sickly ovary. Just get some sperm frozen if you're that paranoid. See a doctor if you think you're unhealthy or significantly increasing your risk of a relapse, which to be honest sounds like you being melodramatic (not professional medical advice).

Even if you hit reset you'd fail again:
When I was a beginner like you in game I botched it with much much hotter and younger girls than this cougar that you've built up in your mind but rather than wallowing in it for extended periods I learned from my mistakes and new opportunities came along and I capitalized. Remembering your blunders is always going to sting a tad, but harness it as motivation to improve. You'll never be able to get a girl above a 6-7 if you don't improve your game and get experience and learn how to be cool around women you actually find attractive. Anyone can act like James Bond around a slutty average looking girl.

A hot girl that is actually attracted to you could fall into your lap tomorrow and you would probably just sabotage it by instinctively going into pedestal lap dog mode again. Your game has more holes than Swiss cheese and until you fix it you won't be able to hold down a girl you consider hot. For example, the alternative you suggested to your mistake was also terrible game (e.g. thinking giving her an ultimatum would have helped).

Conclusion:
We've all been there to some degree or another and it's just part of getting better at game so cut the self pity and act like a man of your age. You will fail with more hot girls to come, it's not the end of the world. Would a hot young girl want to date the kind of guy that's emo sick for years over some crazy cougar? You have a lot of work to do and you've made the right first step seeking help.

You've built a girl up in your mind into a flawless figment of your imagination. You also completely misread the dynamic and its something only getting better at game will prevent in the future. There are much hotter and cooler single girls out there, but you certainly won't ever have a chance with them if you only spend time on low hanging fruit from tinder and pining for some lame old chick that was never legitimately attracted to you in the first place. I guarantee you would have scared her away anyway.

Harsh but mostly true words. Look, I know I fucked up with her, my beta'ish behavior was because, in this "relationship", two new things were introduced in my love life: a much hotter woman (as I said, former model who looks much younger than her age) than usual that was hitting on me initially (this is why I don't believe you when you say that she was never legitimately attracted, if so, why pick me, she could have the dozens of guys that were eyeing her at work) while giving me hot and cold messages. My usual love life dynamic involved finding a cute girl in my social circle and trying to pick her up while not trying to give any creep vibes, not trying to figure out a REALLY hot girl that kept coming onto me up to a certain point and then trying to keep me around. Since I'm fairly good looking, me trying to pickup usually worked. I've gotten brutal rejections as well but healed relatively quickly since the time span was short, not years of wallowing and having illusions of being together.

As for the cancer part, trust me when I say that I am not being melodramatic in the least. My actual doctor (a dude, so he can likely relate) said that basically all the testicular cancer relapses he saw came about with major distresses in that guys life, loss of a loved one, divorce and losing kids, being laid off and not being able to find work. That shit just wrecks your immune system and it only needs a small window for cancer to set in. Not to mention that freezing my sperm does nothing for my confidence, only for my legacy. How in the fuck am I gonna keep a woman with no actual balls, if God forbid the unthinkable happens. It's been 3 years since my surgery and usually after the 5 year window, the chances of relapse are small. Since finding out the news about my "love" and her new guy, I've been getting groin and stomach shooting pains, something I rarely experienced in these 3 years since surgery.

As for improvement, like I said, I've been hitting the weights on home to put some decent muscle, a couple of years ago I switched fields and got into IT (into a field I actually like unlike my old job where I met this woman) but now comes the game part. I was having a dry spell when I met this chick, that's true but that's cause I was focusing on my career, I simply put sex out of my mind for a long while because there were A LOT of new things to learn in order to make the switch and I latched on emotionally to this chick that was gonna bring me back to fucking and who was hotter than my previous lays.

Since I am an introverted kinda guy (no, not shy, I just feel out of my element in clubs and large gatherings), I was thinking of trying day game in parks, maybe bookshops. I only have a couple of friends left but after several failed relationships, one has basically given up from I've gathered and the other has gone full Thinder Thot slayer after several long term (2-3 years) relationships, basically fucks a new bitch every week, full casual sex mode. So I can't really rely on my social circle for marks as in the past (not to mention that we hang out far less often than we used to, due to our jobs), I need to get hunting on my own.

Any recommendations for a 32 year old day game newb?

Anyway, I appreciate the feedback from the community.

Thanks, guys.

[Winston Wolfe]

How about just seeing a doctor and getting a confirmation of whether your cancer is back or not.

I have no doubt that there's a correlation with stressful periods in a man's life, but it's completely pointless to worry about "what if". It's either there or it isn't, that's all there is to it. Get it tested.

Quote:

Any recommendations for a 32 year old day game newb?

Start by reading Roosh's Day Bang. The specific examples described in there are a bit outdated by now, but the fundamental concepts are still true.

Then, create an approach logbook here in this newbie section so we can help you.

For some inspiration: there's several approach logs currently on the first page. One I personally enjoyed a lot was Bizet's daygame log.

Good luck and we got your back.

[mistakemaker]

(06-10-2018 12:31 AM)Winston Wolfe Wrote:  

How about just seeing a doctor and getting a confirmation of whether your cancer is back or not.

I have no doubt that there's a correlation with stressful periods in a man's life, but it's completely pointless to worry about "what if". It's either there or it isn't, that's all there is to it. Get it tested.

Quote:

Any recommendations for a 32 year old day game newb?

Start by reading Roosh's Day Bang. The specific examples described in there are a bit outdated by now, but the fundamental concepts are still true.

Then, create an approach logbook here in this newbie section so we can help you.

For some inspiration: there's several approach logs currently on the first page. One I personally enjoyed a lot was Bizet's daygame log.

Good luck and we got your back.

I will. Thanks for the feedback.

[jcardial]

Quote:

Harsh but mostly true words. Look, I know I fucked up with her, my beta'ish behavior was because, in this "relationship", two new things were introduced in my love life: a much hotter woman (as I said, former model who looks much younger than her age) than usual that was hitting on me initially (this is why I don't believe you when you say that she was never legitimately attracted, if so, why pick me, she could have the dozens of guys that were eyeing her at work) while giving me hot and cold messages. My usual love life dynamic involved finding a cute girl in my social circle and trying to pick her up while not trying to give any creep vibes, not trying to figure out a REALLY hot girl that kept coming onto me up to a certain point and then trying to keep me around. Since I'm fairly good looking, me trying to pickup usually worked. I've gotten brutal rejections as well but healed relatively quickly since the time span was short, not years of wallowing and having illusions of being together.

As for the cancer part, trust me when I say that I am not being melodramatic in the least. My actual doctor (a dude, so he can likely relate) said that basically all the testicular cancer relapses he saw came about with major distresses in that guys life, loss of a loved one, divorce and losing kids, being laid off and not being able to find work. That shit just wrecks your immune system and it only needs a small window for cancer to set in. Not to mention that freezing my sperm does nothing for my confidence, only for my legacy. How in the fuck am I gonna keep a woman with no actual balls, if God forbid the unthinkable happens. It's been 3 years since my surgery and usually after the 5 year window, the chances of relapse are small. Since finding out the news about my "love" and her new guy, I've been getting groin and stomach shooting pains, something I rarely experienced in these 3 years since surgery.

As for improvement, like I said, I've been hitting the weights on home to put some decent muscle, a couple of years ago I switched fields and got into IT (into a field I actually like unlike my old job where I met this woman) but now comes the game part. I was having a dry spell when I met this chick, that's true but that's cause I was focusing on my career, I simply put sex out of my mind for a long while because there were A LOT of new things to learn in order to make the switch and I latched on emotionally to this chick that was gonna bring me back to fucking and who was hotter than my previous lays.

Since I am an introverted kinda guy (no, not shy, I just feel out of my element in clubs and large gatherings), I was thinking of trying day game in parks, maybe bookshops. I only have a couple of friends left but after several failed relationships, one has basically given up from I've gathered and the other has gone full Thinder Thot slayer after several long term (2-3 years) relationships, basically fucks a new bitch every week, full casual sex mode. So I can't really rely on my social circle for marks as in the past (not to mention that we hang out far less often than we used to, due to our jobs), I need to get hunting on my own.

Any recommendations for a 32 year old day game newb?

Anyway, I appreciate the feedback from the community.

Thanks, guys.

Notice how you keep building this old woman up in your mind even to this day. Who cares if all of the nerds in your office want to bang her. She's a washed up has been and you keep glamorizing her and it's another step back from moving on. It's irrelevant if at one point she might have been attracted to you. You put so much additional pressure on yourself by imagining that she was the answer to your prayers. It was all in your mind that she was the be all end all to "bring you back to fucking," as you say.

The lack of game gradually got you into the worst possible frame if she was saying things like "you should have licked your finger afterwards." I would have said "you're gross" in response but the ideal is never getting into this frame in the first place. You were too scared to push back against Miss Perfect in these situations and kept failing her tests. What did you say when she tested you by pointing out the condoms? I highly suspect you flinched rather than confidently holding the frame. You were way too scared to say something like: "I just wanted to be safe when you inevitably tried to jump on me." You lacked confidence and she sniffed it out pretty easily.

When you removed all sexual tension but couldn't caveman her to your bedroom she (like most women would) felt guilty and very turned off about the whole situation. It sounds like you were doing things to her mostly like a dog licking peanut butter off her vagina rather than getting her to chase. While you maybe could have progressed it by going into Rottweiler mode you instead stayed in timid Chihuahua mode hesitant to proceed. It doesn't matter that as the Chihuahua she continued to find you endearing and capable of making her feel comfortable for weeks and months to come. Once a woman views you as weak and always conforming to her frame, it's pretty much impossible to recover from it and again be viewed as a sexual beast.

None of your situation is particularly special or unique. No one with beginner game or limited experience with attractive women is going to be able to fake confidence and frame in a situation they perceive as high stakes. I reiterate, even if you had gotten laid that night you would have very likely botched the relationship at some point with bad game. There is tons of info on the forum about day game and game in general, you just have to search for it.

Very consistent exposure to social situations and particularly with strangers is key. It's a skill that has to be practiced several times a week. Even extroverts with decent game get rusty when they refrain from frequent socializing. Turn this into a regular hobby but don't just read a bunch about it and take little action. Talk to strangers everyday, attractive or not. I agree that doing a log in the newbie forum is a good start.

[RatInTheWoods]

Mate you fucked up in many ways with that one, and its over. Block, ignore and erase her from your life.

The good news is that there are millions of women, and you can have them, catch feels for them and even bang them.

It can happen as soon as tonight.

But only if you learn game and do the work on yourself.

tldnr - give yourself an uppercut and move the fuck on.

[Jetset]

(06-09-2018 01:57 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

I accused her of having major cognitive dissonance on FB, as she says that she wants one thing and does another.

I'm pulling for you, bro, but...

[scorpion]

Textbook case of oneitis. Instructive for others to read and learn from.

OP, it comes down to you or her. If you let her, she will continue to ruin your life. The obsession will cause you untold misery and may literally kill you.

Ask yourself how you would feel if you got the news that this woman was randomly run over by a bus and killed. You would certainly feel sadness, but I imagine you would also feel...relief. As if a burden had been lifted from your shoulders. There would be finality there at last. You would be able to move on with your life, simply relegating this experience to the past and looking ahead to the future.

I would just kill her in your mind. Make her dead to you. She already might as well be. The woman you built up in your head over years with your oneitis obsession doesn't actually exist. She's a product of your imagination, hope and desire. But she's not real. She never was. It's time to let go. She's dead. You're still alive. Get on with living your life.

[BadgerHut]

First, change your username - don't project that negative self-image to yourself, let alone to the world.

You seem quite self-reflective, which means you have a good baseline to improve your game quickly and considerably IF you use that reflection to take action. This forum can certainly help you with the action part.

Now go out dressed your best and approach 100 girls.

[mistakemaker]

Getting back home from by hometown, I approached a really cute girl at the train station who was studying some book intensely by using the book as a conversation starter. She was pretty receptive but alas she was taken. A shame. She wasn't really even my type (tall brunette kind of guy here), a petite'ish dirty blonde but there was something about her demeanour that was really alluring. It's weird, it's like I am slowly seeing a lot of potential around me.

In the weekend I was horny and I reinstalled tinder. I had another tinder fuck yesterday and while casual sex still isn't something I love I think fucking other girls is slowly taking my mind off her.

I think this should be even better when I will be girls I actually care about.

I have to keep my hornyness in check though. Tinder thots are nothing like women you pick up, even failed pick-ups like mine. Did a lot of fapping in those years when I was involved with her so I am trying to do a nofap reboot to get sensitivity back. I am circumcised due to phimosis and with a condom on (even really thin ones) it's nearly impossible for me to cum no matter how much I pump away in different positions. While I have no issue with the erections, sometimes my dick feels like rubber hitting something wet and warm, like I'm desensitized. it's weird to explain, like someone else's dick is fucking this woman in front of me, almost like out of body experience. From what I read up on PIED, sensitivity is also an issue with porn use. I couldn't cum with nearly 15 minutes of blowjob (and she was not bad at all), I had to finish myself off on her tits.

As scorpion advised, I will try to kill her in my mind and I will focus on myself, hitting weights, no fapping and approaches.

Thanks for the feedback.

[Winston Wolfe]

(06-12-2018 01:38 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

Getting back home from by hometown, I approached a really cute girl at the train station who was studying some book intensely by using the book as a conversation starter. She was pretty receptive but alas she was taken. A shame. She wasn't really even my type (tall brunette kind of guy here), a petite'ish dirty blonde but there was something about her demeanour that was really alluring. It's weird, it's like I am slowly seeing a lot of potential around me.

In the weekend I was horny and I reinstalled tinder. I had another tinder fuck yesterday and while casual sex still isn't something I love I think fucking other girls is slowly taking my mind off her.

I think this should be even better when I will be girls I actually care about.

I have to keep my hornyness in check though. Tinder thots are nothing like women you pick up, even failed pick-ups like mine. Did a lot of fapping in those years when I was involved with her so I am trying to do a nofap reboot to get sensitivity back. I am circumcised due to phimosis and with a condom on (even really thin ones) it's nearly impossible for me to cum no matter how much I pump away in different positions. While I have no issue with the erections, sometimes my dick feels like rubber hitting something wet and warm, like I'm desensitized. it's weird to explain, like someone else's dick is fucking this woman in front of me, almost like out of body experience. From what I read up on PIED, sensitivity is also an issue with porn use. I couldn't cum with nearly 15 minutes of blowjob (and she was not bad at all), I had to finish myself off on her tits.

As scorpion advised, I will try to kill her in my mind and I will focus on myself, hitting weights, no fapping and approaches.

Thanks for the feedback.

That's a great start! Maybe create a thread for your approach log, so you are committed to it. Or just use this thread.

I used to have similar problems with fapping, only getting off on porn, not feeling anything during sex with a condom, even not being able to get it up, etc. etc.

Believe me, all of that goes out the window once you start banging higher quality.

When you start banging girls that pass your boner test even when they look their worst. When you get rock hard for a chick every single time, a whole new world opens up and all of these issues disappear as if by magic.

Having said that though, it is not going to be easy to get there. Keep going, approach, fuck Tinder sluts, go for it. But: one day at a time.

Just be careful not to do introduce too many self improvement things at the same time. It sounds good to start no fap, lifting weights, doing daygame approaches etc. but sometimes it's better to gradually introduce new things to your life instead of starting everything at the same time. It's better to do one thing really well than to do several things and slack off at all of them.

It's up to you though, for some people it works to flip everything on its head at the same time. The important thing is that you are taking action and you are doing SOMETHING. Every day, you are building on the new you.

[Winston Wolfe]

OP do you have an update?

[mistakemaker]

(06-21-2018 08:12 PM)Winston Wolfe Wrote:  

OP do you have an update?

Yeah, though not much of a update.

Matched a couple of babes on tinder though they did not reply, even after 2 weeks. Probably fake profiles.

Made like 5 approaches in the last two weeks and half. Awkward as fuuuuuck, nothing natural about it for me, though it's true that I only approached girls that really stirred my loins. Perhaps I should approach more middle of the pack girls. I basically softly grabbed their arm and presented myself, apologized for interrupting their day, told them that they seemed interesting from afar and we should exchange numbers, hang out sometime, get to know each other better. I got either smiles or surprised faces and mostly the boyfriend excuse. No numbers though. And I was dressed nicely, smelled good,etc. And I bailed on one chick when she told me she was turning 20 (I'm in my early 30's), the age difference got in my head.

This is exceedingly new for me, feels like I am treading water. It feels ok to talk to people, I don't have any problem making eye contact and such but I feel like I am interrupting someone's day only to get blown off and it fucking sucks no matter how outcome independent you try to be. The girls I went out with in the past were mostly in my circle of friends and acquintances, we were both a bit preselected so to speak so our guards weren't up all the time. Even this girl that I am trying to keep out of my mind, I must've talked/flirted with her for weeks.

I know some of you will laugh, but I also tried speed dating. It felt good talking to girls, even though in an artificial setting where we are forced to listen to eachother for seven minutes. There were 15 girls but I maybe vibed with 3, most of them were either fat, over 30 and fattish and a couple of them were perhaps 6's. Most of them reeked of desperation as well. I made a mistake of waiting for the results, I should've just talked the couple of chicks that were stand-outs as soon as the event ended. I thought we vibed well enough and thought I would get their contact details. I'm guessing I didn't click with them since I received none of them. Another depressing thing about speed dating was the mediocrity of the people there, beauty wise, SMV is truly a brutal thing. I sort of empathized with girls who weren't into me in the past as I couldn't get myself to see these chicks as attractive no matter how good of a mental gymnast I thought myself to be.

Most of the guys reeked of desperation (I mostly came to see the quality of the women at these events and was NOT impressed), not very handsome, mostly geeks and some of them VERY shy guys, so much that I felt like a fucking Adonis in that room and I know that I am not a natural ladies man. Anyone with a bit of game would have cleaned house.

I talked with a buddy of mine over a glass of wine, a guy I've known for a long time but we don't usually gloss over women. I got to talking and this guy was basically nodding his head sideways the whole time, pointing out the mistakes I made with this girl and that he commiserrated as he knows that it's rare to have a really hot chick with which you also have shit to talk about and do but he also told me that some women simply get bored and like to play with men's heads while denying responsability. He has been burned and so have other friends of his. He explained that I should have bailed when she went to her fuckbuddy and that I should have pushed more to fuck when she came back to my place for the first time. He also said that I should have been firm with her from the start and she would have known where I sit. Once she knew that I was willing to make compromises to excuse her awful behavior towards me, I was finished...

And then he explained what is basically abundance mentality, something which is foreign to me but which I am trying to grasp mentally. While I wouldn't call myself a romantic, I've always been a monogamous type of guy, the concept of a sidechick/fuckbuddy was alien to me, I was always with a chick until I was not .
This guy I am talking about used to be a LTR type but now he is very casual about women, basically has a ton of numbers of potential fuckbuddies so, if his chick bugs out, he always has backup. The proverbial concept of plates as it were. He told me he is very upfront with women, be they fuckbuddy or girlfriend material, if he likes them he takes them on a date, if they seem non-LTR material, he simply invites them for wine and a movie at his place. If they bail, he has options. He told me that I should look at any decent looking woman, no matter what age, as fuckbuddy material but to be upfront about it and to keep their numbers for occasional scores. I know one period after he got out of a long relationship, he was basically fucking 3-4 chicks at the same time while looking out for a high quality girl. He basically told me that I should have gotten the number of the 20 year old chick and used her for sex.

I feel like I am getting a bit better with putting her out of my mind. I caved and looked at a couple of pictures of her I had on my PC and I basically felt empty, whereas I usually felt sad or angry. It really feels as she is starting to drift into the past.

[mistakemaker]

Another thing: How in the hell do you try to approach interesting girls that are in groups?

As I said before, I am NOT the type to go out to clubs or bars, but I don't mind going out in parks, for example, or just walking around. I swear to God, nearly everytime I saw a decent or highly smashable girl in the park, she was with a fugly friend and a couple of times, with girls around her looks level (which tends to make things even more intimidating). How in the hell do you separate these chicks from the pack? I like walking in parks while listening to audiobooks (staying alone in the house tends to let dark thoughts in, about my loneliness) but something like 95% of the time, hot girls are usually either with a guy (most likely boyfriend) or with a group of friends, not alone.

I already know that some of you will advice picking up chicks on the street but most of the eye catching ones are usually in no mood to talk cause they are in a hurry, whereas I would think the ones that come to the park, come to take a load off and enjoy some peace and quiet, thus being a bit more receptive to strange guys coming over to proposition them.

[jcardial]

(06-26-2018 10:48 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

Another thing: How in the hell do you try to approach interesting girls that are in groups?

As I said before, I am NOT the type to go out to clubs or bars, but I don't mind going out in parks, for example, or just walking around. I swear to God, nearly everytime I saw a decent or highly smashable girl in the park, she was with a fugly friend and a couple of times, with girls around her looks level (which tends to make things even more intimidating). How in the hell do you separate these chicks from the pack? I like walking in parks while listening to audiobooks (staying alone in the house tends to let dark thoughts in, about my loneliness) but something like 95% of the time, hot girls are usually either with a guy (most likely boyfriend) or with a group of friends, not alone.

I already know that some of you will advice picking up chicks on the street but most of the eye catching ones are usually in no mood to talk cause they are in a hurry, whereas I would think the ones that come to the park, come to take a load off and enjoy some peace and quiet, thus being a bit more receptive to strange guys coming over to proposition them.

You clearly aren't following the advice that we labored to give you. Delete every picture you have of this girl and block her on all social media (this is an order). We already told you everything you did wrong and left no stone unturned, so you're just wallowing by bringing her up to your friend. You're just prolonging this way more than you need to. She obviously only seems so special because you have limited access to new options. So fix that by continuing to meet new people.

Just get out there and do more activities where you can meet strangers and network. Stop worrying so much about the quality. Be realistic about what your value is physically and career wise and shoot for that ballpark or below it to start. One doesn't simply go from being a depressed hermit to being Rico Suave with twenty year old 8+s over night.

Approaching women in public is inherently a bit needy and is basically like cold calling. With no social proof or status it is going to be hard to do well for yourself and naturally has very low returns for most. It's fine for practice but unless you're exceptionally good looking and good with game it's going to be hard. If you can't impress the washed up cougars at speed dating it's going to be a tall order to close hot strangers in the park.

Why don't you try nightlife to get some practice and confidence? When you're trying to get back into things and build up confidence at least go after a demographic that is open to meeting new people.

[mistakemaker]

(06-26-2018 01:02 PM)jcardial Wrote:  

(06-26-2018 10:48 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

Another thing: How in the hell do you try to approach interesting girls that are in groups?

As I said before, I am NOT the type to go out to clubs or bars, but I don't mind going out in parks, for example, or just walking around. I swear to God, nearly everytime I saw a decent or highly smashable girl in the park, she was with a fugly friend and a couple of times, with girls around her looks level (which tends to make things even more intimidating). How in the hell do you separate these chicks from the pack? I like walking in parks while listening to audiobooks (staying alone in the house tends to let dark thoughts in, about my loneliness) but something like 95% of the time, hot girls are usually either with a guy (most likely boyfriend) or with a group of friends, not alone.

I already know that some of you will advice picking up chicks on the street but most of the eye catching ones are usually in no mood to talk cause they are in a hurry, whereas I would think the ones that come to the park, come to take a load off and enjoy some peace and quiet, thus being a bit more receptive to strange guys coming over to proposition them.

You clearly aren't following the advice that we labored to give you. Delete every picture you have of this girl and block her on all social media (this is an order). We already told you everything you did wrong and left no stone unturned, so you're just wallowing by bringing her up to your friend. You're just prolonging this way more than you need to. She obviously only seems so special because you have limited access to new options. So fix that by continuing to meet new people.

Just get out there and do more activities where you can meet strangers and network. Stop worrying so much about the quality. Be realistic about what your value is physically and career wise and shoot for that ballpark or below it to start. One doesn't simply go from being a depressed hermit to being Rico Suave with twenty year old 8+s over night.

Approaching women in public is inherently a bit needy and is basically like cold calling. With no social proof or status it is going to be hard to do well for yourself and naturally has very low returns for most. It's fine for practice but unless you're exceptionally good looking and good with game it's going to be hard. If you can't impress the washed up cougars at speed dating it's going to be a tall order to close hot strangers in the park.

Why don't you try nightlife to get some practice and confidence? When you're trying to get back into things and build up confidence at least go after a demographic that is open to meeting new people.

I deleted her phone number, all photos from my phone, I have unfriended her from FB. This isn't from now, but from before I created the thread. I gave in so to speak and checked out her public FB pics and I am glad to see that I starting to see her a ghost from the past, I don't really get those pains of imagining her with someone else. She was just...there. So I think I am on the right track on this front.

I know that I need to get out and meet people, it's what my friend was telling me as well, hence the (failed) approaches, speed dating etc. My problem with your last piece of advice is that I loathe the nightlife scene. Fucking hated it when I was a teen, don't care for it now in my 30's. I have 2 left feet, music is outstandingly loud (you literally can't hear what the chick next to you is saying) and usually really shitty with regards to what I like to listen to. Not really much of a drinker, drinks are OVERPRICED as fuck, especially in the better clubs. Basically the maybe five times I've been in a club in my life have all ended with unsuccessful attempts at picking women up, getting way too expensive drinks, getting cheaper drinks at outside bars if the people I went with struck out as well, going home, puking, sleeping, waking up with a headache. Visiting a hooker would have paid better dividends and been less of a gyp.

Not to mention the human flotsam you saying hanging in these establishments, of both sexes. Jesus Christ, the stories I could tell you from my friend that went out to these clubs every weekend when he was younger.

The nightclub life will never be for me, I knew this very early on, I don't like being there and it shows. I don't say this to chicken out but I do believe we need to play to our strengths. My kriptonite has always been leggy brunettes that don't make me embarassed for the human race when they open their mouth. I highly doubt you find that combination in nightclubs from what I've seen. This is why I thought that, as someone without much experience in these last couple of years, I would go for more bookworm-ish types that you could find in bookshops and parks. Hope you get the gist of what I am saying.

[BadgerHut]

(06-26-2018 09:01 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

It really feels as she is starting to drift into the past.

That's great, man. That's what it feels like when you start to get over it.

Keep that momentum going - like others say, get in environments to meet and flirt with women (doesn't have to be night game, I don't dig that either). Go on meetup.com or Groupon and start going to activities like a beast, just get in front of new girls you're never going to see again after that day so it's low-risk, and hone your game.

[jcardial]

(06-26-2018 02:32 PM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

(06-26-2018 01:02 PM)jcardial Wrote:  

(06-26-2018 10:48 AM)mistakemaker Wrote:  

Another thing: How in the hell do you try to approach interesting girls that are in groups?

As I said before, I am NOT the type to go out to clubs or bars, but I don't mind going out in parks, for example, or just walking around. I swear to God, nearly everytime I saw a decent or highly smashable girl in the park, she was with a fugly friend and a couple of times, with girls around her looks level (which tends to make things even more intimidating). How in the hell do you separate these chicks from the pack? I like walking in parks while listening to audiobooks (staying alone in the house tends to let dark thoughts in, about my loneliness) but something like 95% of the time, hot girls are usually either with a guy (most likely boyfriend) or with a group of friends, not alone.

I already know that some of you will advice picking up chicks on the street but most of the eye catching ones are usually in no mood to talk cause they are in a hurry, whereas I would think the ones that come to the park, come to take a load off and enjoy some peace and quiet, thus being a bit more receptive to strange guys coming over to proposition them.

You clearly aren't following the advice that we labored to give you. Delete every picture you have of this girl and block her on all social media (this is an order). We already told you everything you did wrong and left no stone unturned, so you're just wallowing by bringing her up to your friend. You're just prolonging this way more than you need to. She obviously only seems so special because you have limited access to new options. So fix that by continuing to meet new people.

Just get out there and do more activities where you can meet strangers and network. Stop worrying so much about the quality. Be realistic about what your value is physically and career wise and shoot for that ballpark or below it to start. One doesn't simply go from being a depressed hermit to being Rico Suave with twenty year old 8+s over night.

Approaching women in public is inherently a bit needy and is basically like cold calling. With no social proof or status it is going to be hard to do well for yourself and naturally has very low returns for most. It's fine for practice but unless you're exceptionally good looking and good with game it's going to be hard. If you can't impress the washed up cougars at speed dating it's going to be a tall order to close hot strangers in the park.

Why don't you try nightlife to get some practice and confidence? When you're trying to get back into things and build up confidence at least go after a demographic that is open to meeting new people.

I deleted her phone number, all photos from my phone, I have unfriended her from FB. This isn't from now, but from before I created the thread. I gave in so to speak and checked out her public FB pics and I am glad to see that I starting to see her a ghost from the past, I don't really get those pains of imagining her with someone else. She was just...there. So I think I am on the right track on this front.

I know that I need to get out and meet people, it's what my friend was telling me as well, hence the (failed) approaches, speed dating etc. My problem with your last piece of advice is that I loathe the nightlife scene. Fucking hated it when I was a teen, don't care for it now in my 30's. I have 2 left feet, music is outstandingly loud (you literally can't hear what the chick next to you is saying) and usually really shitty with regards to what I like to listen to. Not really much of a drinker, drinks are OVERPRICED as fuck, especially in the better clubs. Basically the maybe five times I've been in a club in my life have all ended with unsuccessful attempts at picking women up, getting way too expensive drinks, getting cheaper drinks at outside bars if the people I went with struck out as well, going home, puking, sleeping, waking up with a headache. Visiting a hooker would have paid better dividends and been less of a gyp.

Not to mention the human flotsam you saying hanging in these establishments, of both sexes. Jesus Christ, the stories I could tell you from my friend that went out to these clubs every weekend when he was younger.

The nightclub life will never be for me, I knew this very early on, I don't like being there and it shows. I don't say this to chicken out but I do believe we need to play to our strengths. My kriptonite has always been leggy brunettes that don't make me embarassed for the human race when they open their mouth. I highly doubt you find that combination in nightclubs from what I've seen. This is why I thought that, as someone without much experience in these last couple of years, I would go for more bookworm-ish types that you could find in bookshops and parks. Hope you get the gist of what I am saying.

I never said anything about clubs. There's not a single classy spot in your city to mingle and have a drink or two? It's just a good way to hone your social skills and interact with women that are much more likely to want to be approached. It doesn't have to be your main vehicle for meeting people but it can only help to have extra experience. Sure the average girl is going to be less cerebral especially at a club, but there are very normal girls out cocktail and wine bars. Almost everybody goes out with friends at some point.

If you end up dating a twenty something she's inevitably going to want to go out once in a while. It's a big asset to have even some basic dancing skills and to not come across as a boring stiff old man. I'd take some classes or hire a private teacher. You don't have to be able to tear it up, but having stone zero skills is a game leak that can be plugged easily.