[Buck Wild]

(04-20-2018 03:27 PM)N°6 Wrote:  

It’s the first time I’ve read in an MSM article that women are needed in the workforce to drive down savings rates by means of excess consumption.

Yes that also jumped out at me. Sometimes the red-pill is just so undeniable even the MSM can't help it.

[kosko]

A pool of thirsty men does not drop standards. Only in the west have men shown they will shake up and marry older women and sluts. In India and China, the price will get higher for good brides.

You will see submarkets start to develop where:

A. Men Travel to find a bride
B. Men import brides
C. Men get at each other for the limited pool of brides

You won't see crazy stuff such as men sharing women, that is matriarchal shit that is done in feminized societies. Show me where in India and China where "Polyamorous" is a thing, only in the Soy west is that stuff tolerable.

If anything high powered men gain even more women as if women can be even pickier, they will share the very best versus taking the 2nd best for themselves.

All this will lead to what many people predict (including old forum member Althone McGinnis) that this surplus of men who stare down a tunnel with no prospect with a wife will actively work to destroy their political and institutional systems. Because if you can't at least sucker the men to think that grunting away at work will give them the 'chance' at a wife and family, then you are running on borrowed time. Once the men wake up to see it all as a sham, they will do quick work to destroy the society out of frustration. There will be chasms and conflict in India and China shortly unless both Governments can figure something out.

If folks fear there will be a surge of men coming to the West, not so fast, we may only see men come here for work to attain a level of income that they can take back with them to India and China and leap front up the class ladder to have more options. We may see a surge of Indian and Chinese male "students" who come here for school and work and then bounce back after a couple of years.

[cascadecombo]

(04-20-2018 10:21 AM)Suits Wrote:  

(04-20-2018 09:00 AM)Ethan Hunt Wrote:  

(04-20-2018 08:54 AM)YoungBlade Wrote:  

(04-20-2018 08:12 AM)Suits Wrote:  

(04-20-2018 07:57 AM)YoungBlade Wrote:  

So, don’t bang China or India. Got it.

Correction: Do bang China.

I’m sorry, but I don’t think I could handle your sloppy seconds.

I would't worry too much. We all know there aren't any Suits Sloppy Seconds around anywhere.

Tell that to the two forum guys who have had my sloppy seconds.

The real question here is why are you only offering them your sloppy seconds?

[Tiger Man]

(04-20-2018 03:48 PM)kosko Wrote:  

A pool of thirsty men does not drop standards. Only in the west have men shown they will shake up and marry older women and sluts. In India and China, the price will get higher for good brides.

You will see submarkets start to develop where:

A. Men Travel to find a bride
B. Men import brides
C. Men get at each other for the limited pool of brides

You won't see crazy stuff such as men sharing women, that is matriarchal shit that is done in feminized societies. Show me where in India and China where "Polyamorous" is a thing, only in the Soy west is that stuff tolerable.

If anything high powered men gain even more women as if women can be even pickier, they will share the very best versus taking the 2nd best for themselves.

All this will lead to what many people predict (including old forum member Althone McGinnis) that this surplus of men who stare down a tunnel with no prospect with a wife will actively work to destroy their political and institutional systems. Because if you can't at least sucker the men to think that grunting away at work will give them the 'chance' at a wife and family, then you are running on borrowed time. Once the men wake up to see it all as a sham, they will do quick work to destroy the society out of frustration. There will be chasms and conflict in India and China shortly unless both Governments can figure something out.

If folks fear there will be a surge of men coming to the West, not so fast, we may only see men come here for work to attain a level of income that they can take back with them to India and China and leap front up the class ladder to have more options. We may see a surge of Indian and Chinese male "students" who come here for school and work and then bounce back after a couple of years.

A few thoughts

The CPC has to be worried about this. A huge group of angry, unmarried, unsexed men... Yeah, that won't cause your government any problems in the future. In FLDS and related communities, the leaders have to regularly purge (as in kick out) groups of younger men. There is a surplus of available men, and the leadership knows this will topple the society if not dealt with.

Whatever one's views on abortion are, why are sex-selective abortions allowed? We have to admit to ourselves that it will lead to these types of problems. In some societies, I wouldn't doubt if it leads to a surplus of women. Either way, we are screwing with a fundamental natural aspect of human reproduction. In fact, there are always slightly more men born than women - a seemingly natural selection that takes place to account for the fact that men have a naturally higher mortality rate.

And on an unrelated note,

"Today websites like ZhongYueLove.com (China-Viet-Love) offer a selection of Vietnamese women. Some services offer a money-back guarantee that the brides will be virgins, and a free replacement for any who run away within a year."

Which member of the forum has the best handle on written Chinese. I need help with something.

[Vasily Zaytsev]

Interesting post. I also wouldn't be surprised if there is violence in some form or another in the next decade or two. Some men are capable of living solo and spend more time on work and hobbies. But, there will always be men out there like Elliot Rodgers, who decide to try and take out their revenge on others for being more successful than them.

[Garuda]

I think the social pressure to dump foreign men is beginning to show.

[The Catalyst]

Does a mere 70 million matter when in the west the male/female ratio is the equivalent of 60/40 or 70/30?

[thebassist]

(04-20-2018 07:47 PM)Garuda Wrote:  

I think the social pressure to dump foreign men is beginning to show.

Have you ever been to China?

[asiaslayer]

Lol. Foreigners are no longer viewed positively or as a status upgrade for most women in China. Go to any nightclub in any tier 1 city. You'll see male model tier guys from Europe begging for the table scraps of some 4/10 Rainy with a mustache and thick coke bottle glasses, while all the hot girls are seated at tables with geeky, beta as fuck rich fu er dai guys that have 5 Lamborghinis in the parking lot.

The trade imbalance really favored the Chinese man.

These newly rich elite in China are going to start absurd and ridiculous bidding wars for the hottest girls of child-bearing age that are left in China, as Arado correctly pointed out. China will most likely be a total shit heap for game for most foreign guys in the near future. You simply can't compete with this kind of money.

[Constitution45]

(04-21-2018 01:55 AM)asiaslayer Wrote:  

Lol. Foreigners are no longer viewed positively or as a status upgrade for most women in China. Go to any nightclub in any tier 1 city. You'll see male model tier guys from Europe begging for the table scraps of some 4/10 Rainy with a mustache and thick coke bottle glasses, while all the hot girls are seated at tables with geeky, beta as fuck rich fu er dai guys that have 5 Lamborghinis in the parking lot.

The trade imbalance really favored the Chinese man.

These newly rich elite in China are going to start absurd and ridiculous bidding wars for the hottest girls of child-bearing age that are left in China, as Arado correctly pointed out. China will most likely be a total shit heap for game for most foreign guys in the near future. You simply can't compete with this kind of money.

When has this since been the case ? I was over there in 2012/13 and foreigners still were held in a high regard by the females.

I am not doubting you, just geniunely interested.

I was quite surprised how foreign Western men in particularly seemed to still date down when moving to places like China and Russia. In fact nearly all of the Western men that I knew in Russia, were in relationships with overweight American/Australian women.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

China's problem will sooner or later disappear later on as the middle class will have more kids. In fact there is some data that point to the fact that many of our modern toxic ingredients like parabens work as female hormone mimickers and generate more females being born - this strangely enough works in China's favor, because a slight surplus of female births goes a long way.

The poor Chinese men will have to remain single, get together with single mothers or import brides.

I don't think that this will cause some great problems in the future. The Chinese are too orderly and the government too strong. The poor men will simply not procreate and die off. There won't be any roving armies of pussy-less men raping and pillaging across the country.

India's problem is more embedded in the religion and ancient culture. This will be more volatile at times, but they do have at least the option of cheap whores in many parts of the country.

It will change much slower, but again - the culture is not overly volatile and has a proven track-record of being able to stamp out such unrest for millennia.

[Fortis]

Personally, I lean more towards the idea that this probably won't hit most of the tier-1 cities very hard. If I were a laowai hanging in the nongcun, I'd be more worried since jealousy would run hotter.

In my time in China, I haven't felt the gender imbalance much.

[Belgrano]

I maintain my position from the last thread we had on this topic:

30 million more men than women in China - 2 husbands per wife?

(10-27-2015 01:06 PM)Belgrano Wrote:  

Those 30 million men are mostly the poor, disenfranchised farmers in the hopeless, depopulating countryside or equally poor migrant workers. They have no power, no influence, no lobby, and they are not organized in any way. And the Chinese government will make sure it stays that way.

If they happen to be lucky and live close to the border to an even poorer country, such as Laos, Vietnam, or North Korea, they can spend their life savings on buying a wife, as is already practiced now.
(Yes, buying one, usually they are treated more like property than like wifes.)
More openminded or adventurous ones might take up construction jobs in the new African colonies partner countries and take African wifes, a practice that has also been on the rise during the recent past.

Otherwise, nothing will happen.
Those 30 million guys simply got screwed by the system and their culture. Wrong time, wrong place. They´ll grow old and die. That´s it.

In the time since I wrote this, China has also abandoned its one-child policy. Gender balances should be on their way back to normal soon enough. One generation of surplus men had to pay the price for stopping China's population growth overall and thus making widespread prosperity possible. That won't be enough to endanger the system the CCP has built.

[Transsimian]

(04-21-2018 01:55 AM)asiaslayer Wrote:  

Lol. Foreigners are no longer viewed positively or as a status upgrade for most women in China. Go to any nightclub in any tier 1 city. You'll see male model tier guys from Europe begging for the table scraps of some 4/10 Rainy with a mustache and thick coke bottle glasses, while all the hot girls are seated at tables with geeky, beta as fuck rich fu er dai guys that have 5 Lamborghinis in the parking lot.

Clubs aren't the best barometer of Western SMV, One night stands from clubs aren't typical amongst all but the most desperate or foreign-hungry girls. Instead, social circle is king with day and online game being our the only reliable alternative.

You'll still be getting a hotter girlfriend than a Chinese guy with a similar income level or physique, but being a foreigner is no longer enough. You have to provide extra value into the relationship beyond your exotic status.

If you aren't competing with high-status multimillionaires in your own country, then why would you expect you'd do better with the addition of a language barrier and state-driven xenophobia.

I'm not that worried about the supposed gender ratio, what matters is that rich men lock down multiple women, and it's far safer for a frustrated Chinese incel to blame 50,000 White men who date one woman, then it is to blame powerful officials and businessmen who take multiple women out of the dating pool.

As for Garuda's video, the Australian guy provoked them by filming their squabble, so it's not a fair example

[Simeon_Strangelight]

China will normalize in the next future.

Besides - what's the big deal about a 30 mio. male surplus? In the caveman times only 40% of men reproduced while 80% of women managed it. 30 mio. for a huge country like China is nothing.

I saw a TV clip once of a Chinese threesome living together. It was composed of a poor farmer and his girlfriend/wife and another man who was a factory worker. Usually the farmers lived alone, but the factory worker sent them money and thus bought the right to come home a couple times a year and fuck the woman/play the husband for that period while the other guy disappeared. But that is a poverty-level arrangement - the peasants got some additional necessary income while the factory worker got the approximation of a wife.

It's comparable to the poly arrangements of low SMV men and women you find in the West. Heck the Chinese threesome couple is more logical because it's mostly economical - if either one of the men got rich, then he would stop it or get himself a hot young thing - no more sharing of women.

[Suits]

(04-20-2018 01:26 PM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

You read these articles about a huge female shortage all the time, but foreigners seem to do okay in China if they're willing to put the work in, which would seem to argue against the demographic doom scenario.

First of all, most foreigners date down in China. I feel bad when I see the girls most guys are with. The Western guys who date up are the exception. Secondly, most guys who date up, do so by exploiting a very special niche: girls who are hot, but plain by Chinese standards for reasons that are a combinations of ridiculous and retarded.

Third, foreign guys who are doing well in China have super tight game. I do not, but compared to your typical Western guy who shows up here, my game is elite by Western guy in Chinese standards, because even a lot of guys who arrive fresh off the airplane who had great game and got laid a lot back home spend months here making adjustments to the local market.

Most of it is due to mental blocks that once overcome are easy fixes, but there's a lot to know if you are going to kill it here. Learning Chinese, for example, is a major tool that is going to be extremely useful, even if the girls you are dating speak great English.

Most Western guys here don't do well here because they have game...they do it by signing on as a long term boyfriend/husband, which works for all parties involved (until it doesn't), because beta provider game is actually competitive here.

Even then, relying on nothing other than plain old beta provider game, you average Western guy has super awesome game compared to your average Western guy. The only way you could have worse game than most of these guys is if you are from an Indian village (dot not feather).

These guys are walking incarnations of everything that makes pussies dry up. It's not their fault -- it's the culture and economic conditions they were raised in, but overcoming it for 99% of them is not on the horizon and doing so for most would require being a cruel backstabbing asshole who crawled his way to the top with a combination of corruption, immoral actions and just generally being a total scumbag to everyone he met along the way.

If you are a Western guy who has any level of game in China and you've even slightly adjusted to the local environment, you're already in the top 5% of most attractive men nationwide and at least in top 15% in a major city. Sure, maybe not for the marriage marketplace, but when a girl is looking for a sexy adventure, she could definitely do worse and is more than willing to take your dick.

If you speak Chinese, dress well and have tight localized game, you're probably in the top 3% most desirable men for a hookup, even in a major city. Sure, you're not going to be able to compete with the really rich guys with game, but there's not that many guys in China with that type of situation, even in a city like Beijing and most aren't young either.

As with anywhere in Asia, there is a pool of foreign groupies you pretty much exclusively take foreign dick and this pool is always larger than the number of foreign men with enough game to be relevant.

[Arado]

(04-21-2018 04:34 AM)Belgrano Wrote:  

I maintain my position from the last thread we had on this topic:

30 million more men than women in China - 2 husbands per wife?

(10-27-2015 01:06 PM)Belgrano Wrote:  

Those 30 million men are mostly the poor, disenfranchised farmers in the hopeless, depopulating countryside or equally poor migrant workers. They have no power, no influence, no lobby, and they are not organized in any way. And the Chinese government will make sure it stays that way.

If they happen to be lucky and live close to the border to an even poorer country, such as Laos, Vietnam, or North Korea, they can spend their life savings on buying a wife, as is already practiced now.
(Yes, buying one, usually they are treated more like property than like wifes.)
More openminded or adventurous ones might take up construction jobs in the new African colonies partner countries and take African wifes, a practice that has also been on the rise during the recent past.

Otherwise, nothing will happen.
Those 30 million guys simply got screwed by the system and their culture. Wrong time, wrong place. They´ll grow old and die. That´s it.

In the time since I wrote this, China has also abandoned its one-child policy. Gender balances should be on their way back to normal soon enough. One generation of surplus men had to pay the price for stopping China's population growth overall and thus making widespread prosperity possible. That won't be enough to endanger the system the CCP has built.

So you don't think it's going to have a tangible impact on the dating markets in Southeast Asia or Russia/Ukraine as Chinese men go there to find brides?

[WalterBlack]

(04-20-2018 03:48 PM)kosko Wrote:  

A pool of thirsty men does not drop standards. Only in the west have men shown they will shake up and marry older women and sluts. In India and China, the price will get higher for good brides.

You will see submarkets start to develop where:

A. Men Travel to find a bride
B. Men import brides
C. Men get at each other for the limited pool of brides

You won't see crazy stuff such as men sharing women, that is matriarchal shit that is done in feminized societies. Show me where in India and China where "Polyamorous" is a thing, only in the Soy west is that stuff tolerable.

There are cases of one woman being married to multiple men in India, but the practice is dying out:

Rajo Verma, a 24-year old Uttarakhand woman who is married to five brothers

Quote:

Most of us are aware of polygamy, a social arrangement in which a man can take multiple wives. But in this small village in the Indian state of Uttarakhand, polyandry is practiced. Polyandry is a marriage system that permits a woman to have multiple husbands. This marriage system was evolved as a practical way of controlling population and preventing the division of family property.

This system might sound peculiar to those of us who live in metropolitan cities within the confines of modern society, but this system has been practiced for centuries in certain Indian villages, where limited farmland is available for multiple sons.

As per this marriage system, a women is found, who matches the age of all the brothers of a family and married off to them. They all live in the same house and work on the same land. Such polyandrous families seldom produce more than six to seven children, keeping the population in check too.

24-year old Rajo Verma, a resident of a small village near Dehradun, lives in a one-room shanty with five siblings. The mother-of-one, sleeps each night with a different brother, based on a set schedule. She does not even know which one of her husbands is the biological father of her son.

Rajo and her first husband Guddu had married a few years ago in a Hindu ceremony. Since then she has married Baiju, Sant Ram, Gopal and Dinesh – all four brothers of Guddu.

First husband Guddu, who remains Rajo's official spouse, says, "We all have sex with her but I'm not jealous. We're one big happy family."

The entire family sleeps on blankets laid out on the floor, as they do not have beds. Rajo says that when she got married, she knew what to expect, as her own mother was married to three brothers.

She says, "Initially it felt a bit awkward. But I don't favour one over the other," adding, "I get a lot more attention and love than most wives."

With widespread modernization, this archaic practice of fraternal polyandry has mostly died out in India. But, it somehow has managed to survive in some northern Himalayan regions of India and Tibet. The reason this practice has still survived in India and China is the poor sex ratio in both these countries, as there is shortage of women for young men.

The reasons for this appear to be more for scarcity reasons and less for feminism.

(04-20-2018 03:48 PM)kosko Wrote:  

If anything high powered men gain even more women as if women can be even pickier, they will share the very best versus taking the 2nd best for themselves.

All this will lead to what many people predict (including old forum member Althone McGinnis) that this surplus of men who stare down a tunnel with no prospect with a wife will actively work to destroy their political and institutional systems. Because if you can't at least sucker the men to think that grunting away at work will give them the 'chance' at a wife and family, then you are running on borrowed time. Once the men wake up to see it all as a sham, they will do quick work to destroy the society out of frustration. There will be chasms and conflict in India and China shortly unless both Governments can figure something out.

If folks fear there will be a surge of men coming to the West, not so fast, we may only see men come here for work to attain a level of income that they can take back with them to India and China and leap front up the class ladder to have more options. We may see a surge of Indian and Chinese male "students" who come here for school and work and then bounce back after a couple of years.

I severely doubt they would go back. I can't speak for China but the average Indian wants to get the fuck out of India. Life is only good there if you have money. The only people from India who I know that moved to the west and then moved back are old people who are comfortable being in their villages. My father's village in Punjab has around 25% empty houses. I was born and raised in UK, but most of male cousins who were born and raised there now live in Europe. My female cousins married Indians with western passports.

Trust me, if it wasn't so hard for the average Indian to get a western visa, the west would be flooded with millions of Indians.

Many Indian guys go abroad, make money and a western passport, and then come back to India to find a wife. It's pretty easy for an Indian with a western passport to find a wife in India. Once they get married they take their wife to the western country that they live in.

Despite what the average IRT makes you guys think, the average Indian guy from India wants an Indian wife. He wants somebody who can talk to and help take care of his parents. There's plenty of cases of guys from India marrying a woman with Poland or Germany, and then as soon as they get the passport they divorce her and bring over a woman from India.

The vast majority of Indian families prefer a son, but I have a heard that some families want to have a daughter - the reason? Well the average western born and raised Indian woman wants nothing to do with men raised in India - they'd rather marry a guy from the west, whereas plenty of foreign born Indian men are content with marrying a woman from India.

It's as easy for a western Indian guy to find a wife in India as it for the average western white guy to find a wife in the Philippines or Thailand.

One thing I'll say about FOB thirsty Indian guys in Europe is that at least they try to interact with local European women - I doubt Chinese guys would do that.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(04-21-2018 04:23 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

Trust me, if it wasn't so hard for the average Indian to get a western visa, the west would be flooded with millions of Indians.

In reality - if travel and VISA was easy than 2-3 bio. Indians, Asians and Africans would move to the West absolutely flooding it Camp of Saints style. Of course the economic systems would then collapse and some countries would become actual dumps or war-torn hellholes.

[americanpituco]

At least it's documented in those countries, I have a good friend who's spent time in Beijing & Shanghai, and says the ratio in those megacities isn't as bad as the average city in the US.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(04-22-2018 05:46 AM)americanpituco Wrote:  

At least it's documented in those countries, I have a good friend who's spent time in Beijing & Shanghai, and says the ratio in those megacities isn't as bad as the average city in the US.

That's because they have less immigration than the West and the women from the rural areas move faster to the big cities. The ratio of men to women under 30 in many Western cities is likely far worse than the Chinese gender imbalance.

[Cheetah]

Quote:

First of all, most foreigners date down in China. I feel bad when I see the girls most guys are with. The Western guys who date up are the exception. Secondly, most guys who date up, do so by exploiting a very special niche: girls who are hot, but plain by Chinese standards for reasons that are a combinations of ridiculous and retarded.

What ridiculous and retarded beauty standards are you referring to?

[americanpituco]

(04-22-2018 06:01 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

(04-22-2018 05:46 AM)americanpituco Wrote:  

At least it's documented in those countries, I have a good friend who's spent time in Beijing & Shanghai, and says the ratio in those megacities isn't as bad as the average city in the US.

That's because they have less immigration than the West and the women from the rural areas move faster to the big cities. The ratio of men to women under 30 in many Western cities is likely far worse than the Chinese gender imbalance.

Will this ever be documented in the US? Not only did he say it was worse, he said it was way worse.

[Suits]

(04-22-2018 06:51 AM)Cheetah Wrote:  

Quote:

First of all, most foreigners date down in China. I feel bad when I see the girls most guys are with. The Western guys who date up are the exception. Secondly, most guys who date up, do so by exploiting a very special niche: girls who are hot, but plain by Chinese standards for reasons that are a combinations of ridiculous and retarded.

What ridiculous and retarded beauty standards are you referring to?

The Chinese populous have a very unusual view of what an attractive woman looks like.



Now, you may look at the above photos and say to me, "Suits, you moron, the girl on the left is heavily made up and I'd rather bang the girl on the right." To which I would respond, "the girl on the right is digitally airbrushed past the point of resembling herself, is also heavily made-up, but I'd gladly bang both girls."

Both the Western and Chinese standards of beauty hold up great when we are talking about 8s, very well when we are talking about 7s, but the we end up on shaky ground when we start encountering 6s and especially 5s. A 5 by Chinese standards might be a 4 by Western standards and vis-versa.

I've been in China long enough that the local standard of beauty has rubbed off on me somewhat, so I'm sympathetic to what they find attractive and consider some of the "hot" women Western guys marry hideous. Personally, I don't have a real dog in the fight, because my own preferences are somewhat niche and my standards are low enough that I'll bang just about anything in a skirt. I do routinely bang women who I consider to be 7's (and probably would be by Chinese standards), but that doesn't stop me from banging borderline 5s just for the goof.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

< Youth counts for a lot. There are European countries including the US, where most 18-19 year old girls would be 6s if they were all slim like in the 1970s.

I also have this theory that the looks of people generally improve as they have access to better nutritious food, water - also have more knowledge about good pregnancy nutrition. I have spoken with some older folk in Eastern Europe. The folk got old fast and they were uglier in the 1970s-80s. It started to improve with the generations in the 1990s and even continues to this day. Peace times and prosperity bring out the best in terms of genetics.

China is still in this process in my opinion due to their artificially low birth rate for such a long time. And contrary to the US and other Western countries - they may pull it off without fattening their women down to 3s and 4s when they could be natural 18 year old 6s.