[Courage Reborn]

By your writing, you are coming across as insane.

The extremist Madonna/whore worldview, and asking how to suppress your wife's imaginary hypergamy, is insecurity.

Women are human. They're faithful, until they aren't. They're submissive, until they're not.

Human behavior is not black & white. And no amount of unicorn theory is going to up your wife's loyalty. Especially if she's out earning you, which is what you should be most concerned about fixing here.

[Cobra]

TL;DR of OP's thread (even though he refuses to believe it).

"I'm miserable. My wife makes more money than me, wears the pants in the relationship, and I don't know what to do. So I think I should find another woman to make her upset as a last resort before I leave her and the kids. I'm writing this post as a cry for help but am going to try and write it like I have control instead. "

You want to sound like you have control but it comes off desperate. You sound miserable man.

Feel free to be more honest and admit your insecurities. Then we can help.

[whatsayitboys]

(12-18-2015 03:38 PM)Cobra Wrote:  

TL;DR of OP's thread (even though he refuses to believe it).

"I'm miserable. My wife makes more money than me, wears the pants in the relationship, and I don't know what to do. So I think I should find another woman to make her upset as a last resort before I leave her and the kids. I'm writing this post as a cry for help but am going to try and write it like I have control instead. "

You want to sound like you have control but it comes off desperate. You sound miserable man.

Feel free to be more honest and admit your insecurities. Then we can help.

I appreciate your reply but I think I've exhausted these discussions. There seems to be a unconscious bias in regards to discussions about mate poaching.

I have insecurities, sure, I deal with them. I am not new, I'm just more purple than red. I'm on the MMSLP side of things, which for hardcore reds can be annoying, but not everyone wants to just fuck plates their entire lives.

My main point of discussion has been innate vs training in regards to submission, I hoped old guards had some discussion points on this. To simply summarize it as an issue of SMV disparity is disingenuous. I think this point is underdeveloped since many people advice against dating women with graduate degrees. The people who have put a lot of work into AB testing and have dated much more prolifically than I have would be able to talk about this.

So far there hasn't really been anyone discussing the real merits here.

I was also interested in discussions about mate poaching.

Neither of these things seem to be of interest. I came here for sexual strategy, self improvement is something I've already incorporated into my life.

My true insecurity is laid bare. I am concerned that submission is something a woman must innately desire to support a family. Anecdotally I believe these women make up 2-5% of the population.

I'm not saying you can't make women submit, that's easy. What I'm questioning, is whether or not trained obedience and submission (As Patrice O'Neal called it, learning a jump shot for a post wall woman) can rival a woman who is naturally subservient.

My true insecurity as I said is that I question whether a family is stable enough less the woman is a natural subservient.

[GlobalMan]

(12-18-2015 05:30 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

My true insecurity as I said is that I question whether a family is stable enough less the woman is a natural subservient.

And that's a fair enough question to have. But everything else you're saying is just steeped in pseudoscience and made up statistics and timelines. When you get too technical it looks too 'try hard', it makes people have a tendency to question the sincerity of the post/you. "Trained to absolute completion", "2-5%", stuff like that.

[whatsayitboys]

(12-18-2015 05:50 PM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(12-18-2015 05:30 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

My true insecurity as I said is that I question whether a family is stable enough less the woman is a natural subservient.

And that's a fair enough question to have. But everything else you're saying is just steeped in pseudoscience and made up statistics and timelines. When you get too technical it looks too 'try hard', it makes people have a tendency to question the sincerity of the post/you. "Trained to absolute completion", "2-5%", stuff like that.

Any positing on the question now that we've somewhat put our gloves away?

[GlobalMan]

(12-18-2015 06:48 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

(12-18-2015 05:50 PM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(12-18-2015 05:30 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

My true insecurity as I said is that I question whether a family is stable enough less the woman is a natural subservient.

And that's a fair enough question to have. But everything else you're saying is just steeped in pseudoscience and made up statistics and timelines. When you get too technical it looks too 'try hard', it makes people have a tendency to question the sincerity of the post/you. "Trained to absolute completion", "2-5%", stuff like that.

Any positing on the question now that we've somewhat put our gloves away?

I hesitate to say start a new thread on it, but I think the chance to revive this one under new clearer intentions may be gone.

The main mistake you made, and that doomed this from the start, is making a thread as your first post here. It's better to participate a little, stick to commenting a bit, let people get a feel for you and recognize you before making a thread, especially one that's somewhat abstract.

A "braindump" from someone that no one knows isn't going to garner the best reaction. It's just mental diarrhea. You have to realize we get a lot of trolls here. And written in the incoherent way you did, that's not helping. Your thread had- New member, incoherent writing style, unclear objective, and there was little likability.

You have to write with your audience in mind. What can they take away? How can they participate? Have I made the topic clear? Some jazz riff dripping in theory, metaphor, and some absurdities won't work if you're trying to ask a question.

Here's what will:

OP, on the proper medication Wrote:

So here's the story, I have been married X years and
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I fear that xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Do you think it's possible to xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx​xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Anyone that has experience with this, I'm grateful for your thoughts.

[Gmac]

[Robert Plant]

If whatsayitboys is for real, he is on the verge of really screwing up two families and in essence creating a lot of really bad karma, karma simply being the result of one's actions. This guy needs professional help before he becomes one of those sad, soul crushed old men in SE Asia who lives by himself and frequents brothels.

[Dino]

I lost him at: Gents

I have officially lost my title as the most condescending rvf poster to date.

[Cobra]

OP, the reason it's hard to continue this discussion is due to your insistence and belief that tactics exist for similar situations to yours. I think what you fail to realize is that there are no "best practices" out there for specific situations due to the sheer number of external factors that control them. For example, you speak of "mate poaching" like it's some type of common occurence. The flaw lies in your internal thought process and lack of self confidence to deal with the situation. This is a fundamental flaw because I truly believe you're denying it. Looking for theories and concepts externally to help you will in fact hurt you in the end.

Fitting a few women into theories do not take into account the various behaviors, goals and overall personalities of each of them. You just do not seem to know them well.

So instead of going on and on about what you think and want to do, maybe you can just concisely lay out facts and then we can give you options. If you cannot do this, I do seriously suggest therapy. I say this because i can understand your situation and also understand that you're headed down the wrong path. Therapy can do wonders in your situation.

The fact that I took the time to write this should tell you the forum membership wants to help. However, we're asking you to grip reality first.

[SamuelBRoberts]

Quote:

I have insecurities, sure, I deal with them. I am not new, I'm just more purple than red. I'm on the MMSLP side of things, which for hardcore reds can be annoying, but not everyone wants to just fuck plates their entire lives.

Sometimes the manosphere gets really, really silly.
I guess today is one of those times.

What on Earth is this nonsense? You're "more purple than red"? You're "on the MMSLP side"? You want to "fuck plates"?

Even though I know what some of these terms mean, it's still this impenetrable field of stupid jargon. Can you just use normal words, like a normal human being?

[Prof. Ligate]

Your post seems fresh out of the 'red pill' column on reddit. So much over-the-top theory and complication.

[malc]

Women (and men) have a fixed nature since time eternal that will respond to certain incentive systems in a predictable way. The current incentive system for women in the west fucks men over hard because they can get away with so much with no legal consequences for them. Put a Russian woman in the USA and some divorced friends and 5 years later she will be as bad as any other american with some echo of her cultural past sustaining her. That is the real problem facing men. Everything else is easy to handle.

Men in your rare case have the incentives flipped. You are in the case where the woman makes a bigger income and the woman would be fucked over hard if they leave the man. The woman is further fucked over by being older, a single mother and being so high powered that finding a man that would be better than her and meet her standards now might as well be a unicorn. You have a lottery ticket as far as the incentives game goes.

In the one case I have seen that like that with an ambitious doctor and a herb programmer, the doctor is still with the programmer, they have a kid and she isn't going to attract a $500k/yr surgeon or anesthesiologist or anyone else close to her level. She's a fun woman, who obviously wants a strong man in her life, kind of sad, but thats how it goes.

So stop fucking overthinking it, realize your position and the fucking leverage it gives you and use it to your advantage. You are in a very enviable situation, use it to give your kids a happy stable marriage in north america. You also have her intelligence and the divorce statistics of PhDs going in your favor.

[Guitarman]

(12-17-2015 09:47 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

(12-16-2015 06:06 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

(12-16-2015 05:55 PM)Travesty Wrote:  

(12-16-2015 05:11 PM)whatsayitboys Wrote:  

She's a cornfed college educated doctorate degree holding white girl.

Yes, this is why there are no real answers for you.

You put yourself underwater.

You're going to have to be more clear here. Not sure if you're just rejecting western women, or educated women or what.

Women with graduate degrees are much less hypergamous in my experience. They spend their CC years studying.

I'm surprised the OP hasn't a line through his name yet.

[Saweeep]

I haven't got a clue what this thread is about.

Baffling.

[Guitarman]

CrashBangWallop as a fellow Englander I assume this thread is just trolling, that is why it is confusing.

[Tigre]

(12-20-2015 06:56 AM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  

I haven't got a clue what this thread is about.

Baffling.

This thread gave me strong flashbacks to IRT's posts.

IRT wrote many long, rambling posts about the state of the world and why he was failing to get girls.

He achieved nothing by writing what he did. But he was a rational and analytical guy by nature. He found it came naturally to ruminate over all the elements involved and move them around in his head.

As if it would somehow all gel into some complex mathematical proof. Everything would be simplified and he would suddenly magically discover the secret to getting girls that had eluded him.

Meanwhile, people would look at a photo of him and in 30 seconds could tell him what he needed to fix. "Hey IRT, get rid of that dorky haircut, switch your glasses to contact lenses, lift weights, change up your style".

But he would find excuses never to do those things, because it involved getting out of his comfort zone. The only action he took was to write more long winded posts about being Indian and wishing he could get white girls.

**

How does this relate to the OP? I feel that the OP is intellectually searching for something in manosphere doctrine that will make things someone else's fault and not his.

Deep down he knows it's morally wrong to do what he's contemplating.

He knows that if a woman blows up a perfectly good marriage on a whim, it's a shitty thing to do. We would call her a cunt for doing that.

He's looking for something in red pill thinking that says he's justified for doing it. That you can walk away from your wife, kid, your wedding vows, because of something that might potentially happen but hasn't yet. And everyone will tell him: "You made the right decision, buddy. You're a strong, enlightened man for doing this."

But no one on the forum is going to tell him that.

[eradicator]

It is almost as if I am reading a comic book about alternate universes, "WHAT IF Indian race troll got married and wanted to fuck other girls." This is what it would sound like.

[kinnikinik]

As with many, I am super confused what this thread is actually about. However, I understand enough of the first couple posts that I have a strong enough reaction to make my first post here... So, at the risk of sounding beta:

whatsayitboys, you're an arrogant, self-centered man (not an insult, just a fact, which I assume you already recognize). Unfortunately, for you, you went and had kids and now you have a responsibility that goes beyond your selfish desires: raising your children well. So, go ahead and play your head games, mold your wife as you need and fuck your 'unicorn' but blowing up your family AND the Unicorn's for the sake of, er... that's the part I don't understand, is childish, selfish and abusive (to your kids).

Suck it up, buttercup. You've got kids, you did that, live with it!

[ChickenLover9T9]

My gut feeling after seeing all that is you should leave your wife, go out into the world and have relationships with many and various women. If you did that, there is a chance a lot of the underlying insecurities you have would magically vanish. I know you have kids, but hey, that's just what I'd do. Alternatively you can just leave forums like this alone, bury your head in the sand, grow old with your wife, raise your kids - there are worse ways to go.

I have no problem with long-winded accounts of things, and many posts here by some members are quite interesting. But the fact that you took pages to detail your one relationship with your wife belies your claim that you are a true "veteran" and all the other veiled bragging, and to put your life in the hands of strangers on the internet, well that's just stupid.

There's one thread going on the travel forum about a guy I thought was literally half-retarded at first (no offense intended, and I do believe English is his second language, to his credit) ... but now he is unabashedly taming oriental strange left right and centre and his complaints about the price of Toblerones I find amusing and endearing, contrast this to OP's whining about unicorns and PhDs etc etc

[GlobalMan]

You can always tell who won't be sticking around or contributing

Their first post is a long thread about a personal problem seeking answers.

Once their 'problem' is solved, or if we correctly judge them as insane, they never return.

[Rhyme or Reason]

(04-17-2016 03:58 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

You can always tell who won't be sticking around or contributing

Their first post is a long thread about a personal problem seeking answers.

Once their 'problem' is solved, or if we correctly judge them as insane, they never return.

Even just the title "My life is in your hands" is pretty cringe worthy. It betrays a complete lack of agency or sense of accountability. So does the rest of his post.