[The Lizard of Oz]

(08-23-2014 09:31 AM)nerdjack80 Wrote:  

We have no control over foreign policy, lets stay focused on the chimpfest in Missouri. This is the greatest opportunity we have had in a long time. Keep fanning the flames.

[starchild5]

(08-22-2014 01:27 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

I don't know. All I know is there are major red flags that the video is fake. It's possible that ISIS faked the video for some reason. It's possible that the U.S. faked the video for war propaganda. It's also possible the video is real.

However, anyone who watches that video carefully and who has also watched other ISIS beheading videos can clearly see huge discrepancies between this one and all the others.

How convenient that ISIS has not touched a single Oil Field in Iraq.

If they really had bad intention against the west, they would destroy 100s of oil fields across Iraq owned by Shell, BP etc etc western corporations.

For example.

Majnoon Oil Field in Iraq is one of the largest in the world owned by you guessed it...SHELL ....Conveniently, No Oil Fields owned by western corporations is touched by ISIS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majnoon_oil_field

Majnoon oil field is a super-giant oil field located 60 km (37 mi) from Basra, Basra Governorate in southern Iraq.[1] Majnoon is one of the richest oil fields in the world with an estimated 38 billion barrels of oil in place.

Also, the contractor for constructing Oil Fields in Iraq is none other than Haliburton ...Owned by man of peace and democracy Mr. Dick Cheney himself.

Its so obvious..Its not even on a sheeple level now. ISIS has destroyed everything but conveniently left out Oil Fields lol.

ISIS has so much love for OIL ..which the world has accused the reason America went into Iraq in the first place a decade ago.

Its pretty much guaranteed that the US air strike will miss Oil Fields and ISIS but target civilians and babies.

Hideous agenda to murder million more innocent Iraqis for elites sick ritual...

ISIS is just another CIA front to destabilize Iraq using their "Crisis Actors" and kill Million more human beings.

I'm betting 500 dollars that in all its media circus..ISIS will never ever destroy a single oil field.

If ISIS so almighty powerful, all they had to do was to strike the Oil Fields Across Iraq and bring the west to its Knees...Its seems...Hurting the corporations aren't on the agenda of CIA fronts

[Sourcecode]

Then their cash flow will also stop...
Iraq doesnt have much to go off of.. oil is what they can sell... why destroy infrastructure for a resource that is also your cash crop?

[Walderschmidt]

(08-21-2014 01:37 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

Here's the link to the video: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f78_1408486626

I agree with kosko that this appears staged. In fact, it looks exactly like you'd expect it to if it was made by the U.S. to whip up popular support for increased military action against ISIS. Contrast this video with the earlier ISIS beheading videos. The difference is stark.

1) Most glaring of all, this video doesn't even show the actual beheading, something ISIS has never shied away from before. The body and the head are neatly posed at the end, shot from a single perspective with much less blood than seen in previous beheadings. This isn't even a video shot either, it's a still photo being panned to give the illusion of it being a video recording. Obviously it's much easier to photoshop a still photo than a video, so this extremely suspicious.
2) The professional nature of the video production
3) Multiple cameras
4) Multiple camera cuts
5) A tiny knife
6) The nonchalant vocal tone and body language of Foley
7) The position of the killer when he begins to make the cut. A grossly inefficient mechanical position for sawing off a head with a tiny knife, and a disgustingly messy position (guaranteeing his clothes will be needlessly soaked in the victim's blood, note that in other beheading videos the killers deliberately try to avoid this, the same way you would if butchering an animal). It's an excellent position if you want to hide the fact that you aren't actually cutting, though. Also, if he was really cutting we would have seen blood, even in the brief time before the camera cut out. But no blood.
8) The movie villain-like callout of President Obama and the American people at the end. Utterly ridiculous.

Foley was most likely tapped as a CIA asset years ago, it's possible he was recruited after becoming a conflict journalist or that might have been his cover from the beginning. Who knows if he was really captured or what his story was. Maybe his cover was blown or about to be and he was no longer useful. Maybe he just wanted to get out and disappear and CIA told him this was his ticket to do so.

That being said, it's possible that it's real. Definitely smells like bullshit, though. Tons of weird things about the video, combined with the obvious fact that the U.S. has all the incentive in the world to make something like that, the egregious history of falsified atrocity propaganda of this kind and that ISIS's origins stem from the CIA/Mossad to begin with. Just seems way too convenient at this point.

I'm just gonna leave this here:

"Beheaded" James Foley - His Secret Life and the CIA

I'm not going to draw any conclusions; instead I will ask - is it so hard to believe that the US government could act with malicious intent? Or create a problem it has to "solve" to divert attention?

Wald

[sinnerman]

(08-23-2014 10:42 AM)starchild5 Wrote:  

(08-22-2014 01:27 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

I don't know. All I know is there are major red flags that the video is fake. It's possible that ISIS faked the video for some reason. It's possible that the U.S. faked the video for war propaganda. It's also possible the video is real.

However, anyone who watches that video carefully and who has also watched other ISIS beheading videos can clearly see huge discrepancies between this one and all the others.

How convenient that ISIS has not touched a single Oil Field in Iraq.

If they really had bad intention against the west, they would destroy 100s of oil fields across Iraq owned by Shell, BP etc etc western corporations.

For example.

Majnoon Oil Field in Iraq is one of the largest in the world owned by you guessed it...SHELL ....Conveniently, No Oil Fields owned by western corporations is touched by ISIS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majnoon_oil_field

Majnoon oil field is a super-giant oil field located 60 km (37 mi) from Basra, Basra Governorate in southern Iraq.[1] Majnoon is one of the richest oil fields in the world with an estimated 38 billion barrels of oil in place.

Also, the contractor for constructing Oil Fields in Iraq is none other than Haliburton ...Owned by man of peace and democracy Mr. Dick Cheney himself.

Its so obvious..Its not even on a sheeple level now. ISIS has destroyed everything but conveniently left out Oil Fields lol.

ISIS has so much love for OIL ..which the world has accused the reason America went into Iraq in the first place a decade ago.

Its pretty much guaranteed that the US air strike will miss Oil Fields and ISIS but target civilians and babies.

Hideous agenda to murder million more innocent Iraqis for elites sick ritual...

ISIS is just another CIA front to destabilize Iraq using their "Crisis Actors" and kill Million more human beings.

I'm betting 500 dollars that in all its media circus..ISIS will never ever destroy a single oil field.

If ISIS so almighty powerful, all they had to do was to strike the Oil Fields Across Iraq and bring the west to its Knees...Its seems...Hurting the corporations aren't on the agenda of CIA fronts

Before going on the conspiracy rant you should look at the map and find where Basra is and where the ISIS presence is. Basra is in the southern most part of Iraq which is very much under the government control and is close to Shiite majority areas.

[Ice]

I can understand why one could come to the conclusion that the video is fake. At first I thought, too, that there is quite little blood, and that Foley is astonishingly composed in his speech. But look at these photos (NSFW):

http://www.redakcja.mpolska24.pl/6737/ho...hrzescijan

You can see some beheadings there, and there's not much little blood, either.

These photos are shocking though. These Islamic State guys must be stopped.

Also, as someone mentioned above - you can't possibly fathom what it does to you when you're being brainwashed, threatened, and tortured for two years. Maybe they threatened Foley with extremely sadistic tortures if he doesn't make an effort to recite the speech in a believable manner - hence the "amateur actor"-like speech.

I think the video is real, unfortunately.

These people are fucking barbaric.

[Crackshot]

The video WAS fake, at least in part


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...taged.html

Analysts believe the British jihadi in the video may not have been James Foley's killer, although it is accepted that the journalist was murdered

The video of James Foley’s execution may have been staged, with the actual murder taking place off-camera, it has emerged.

Forensic analysis of the footage of the journalist’s death has suggested that the British jihadist in the film may have been the frontman rather than the killer.

The clip, which apparently depicts Mr Foley’s brutal beheading, has been widely seen as a propaganda coup for Islamic State miltant group.

But a study of the four-minute 40-second clip, carried out by an international forensic science company which has worked for police forces across Britain, suggested camera trickery and slick post-production techniques appear to have been used.


A forensic analyst told The Times that no blood can be seen, even though the knife is drawn across the neck area at least six times.

“After enhancements, the knife can be seen to be drawn across the upper neck at least six times, with no blood evidence to the point the picture fades to black,” the analysis said.

Sounds allegedly made by Foley do not appear consistent with what may be expected.

During Foley’s speech, there appears to be a blip which could indicate the journalist had to repeat a line.

One expert commissioned to examine the footage was reported as saying: “I think it has been staged. My feeling is that the execution may have happened after the camera was stopped.”

However the company, which requested anonymity, did not reach a definitive answer.

It concluded: “No one is disputing that at some point an execution occurred.”

[scorpion]

(08-25-2014 08:14 AM)Crackshot Wrote:  

The video WAS fake, at least in part


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...taged.html

Analysts believe the British jihadi in the video may not have been James Foley's killer, although it is accepted that the journalist was murdered

The video of James Foley’s execution may have been staged, with the actual murder taking place off-camera, it has emerged.

Forensic analysis of the footage of the journalist’s death has suggested that the British jihadist in the film may have been the frontman rather than the killer.

The clip, which apparently depicts Mr Foley’s brutal beheading, has been widely seen as a propaganda coup for Islamic State miltant group.

But a study of the four-minute 40-second clip, carried out by an international forensic science company which has worked for police forces across Britain, suggested camera trickery and slick post-production techniques appear to have been used.


A forensic analyst told The Times that no blood can be seen, even though the knife is drawn across the neck area at least six times.

“After enhancements, the knife can be seen to be drawn across the upper neck at least six times, with no blood evidence to the point the picture fades to black,” the analysis said.

Sounds allegedly made by Foley do not appear consistent with what may be expected.

During Foley’s speech, there appears to be a blip which could indicate the journalist had to repeat a line.

One expert commissioned to examine the footage was reported as saying: “I think it has been staged. My feeling is that the execution may have happened after the camera was stopped.”

However the company, which requested anonymity, did not reach a definitive answer.

It concluded: “No one is disputing that at some point an execution occurred.”

So this fancy team of forensic experts concludes the obvious (which apparently was better than what a lot of people here could do): that the video does not show Foley being killed.

They then conclude that even though the video was clearly staged, Foley must still be dead.

Apparently, faking the actual execution raises absolutely zero suspicions that the same people may have faked a photograph showing the dead body. Interesting police work there.

(08-22-2014 06:09 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

There's a lot of otherwise solid guys that are really undermining their credibility by claiming this is a false flag operation.

I mentioned it earlier but no one tried countering it. How can this be a false flag operation when IS has assumed responsibility for the attack?

The video was posted on their official Diaspora social media account (Al-Furqan media). While the account had been deleted by Diaspora since then (just like their official Twitter and YouTube was deleted) there's been no denials or pushback since then.

Can I get my credibility back now?

[kaotic]

Shit's going to get real interesting:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/...er-4097083

Task Force Black

I like that name.

[Crackshot]

Telegraph again, saying he has been dead for a year


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/t...r-ago.html

Friends of the murdered US hostage James Foley have condemned “disgraceful” claims by the Syrian regime that the journalist was killed a year ago, as a series of contradictory theories about his death took hold.

Bouthaina Shabaan, the political and media adviser to President Bashar al-Assad, said the United Nations had “information” that Mr Foley’s beheading happened last year, as well as claiming that he was kidnapped by the US-backed Free Syrian Army before being sold to his killers.

She told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme: “James Foley was killed a year ago, not now, and they only released the picture now. The UN has the information that he was killed a year ago, so there are a lot of rumours that are confused with the truth.”

Mr Foley’s boss, Phil Balboni, of the GlobalPost news organisation, said: “This is totally false and contradicted by a very significant body of incontrovertible evidence.

“We have multiple eyewitness accounts from hostages held with Jim as recently as last month. It’s a disgrace that this was ever broadcast or published.”

Mr Foley’s family has released a transcript of a letter he wrote to them in June, conveyed by a Danish hostage who committed the letter to memory before he was released. Hostages’ letters home were confiscated by their kidnappers.

The fact that Daniel Rye Ottosen saw Mr Foley in June proves that Dr Shabaan’s claim, motivated in part by the desire to play up the alleged role of Free Syrian Army in his death, cannot be true.

It is, however, just one of the increasing number of conflicting claims about Mr Foley’s death that have arisen since the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil) posted a video online last week showing his decapitated body.

Some experts who have analysed the video of Mr Foley’s last moments have concluded that at least two people took part in killing him. Two different knives appear in the film, one held by the British jihadist who speaks in the video, and a second lying on the ground next to Mr Foley’s body.

One forensic analyst has suggested the British killer is only pretending to cut Mr Foley’s throat in the video, as no blood is seen, despite the knife being drawn backwards and forwards six times, and Mr Foley does not struggle, which could mean he had been told the whole film was a stunt.

Whitehall sources have also said it remains a possibility that the man whose voice is heard in the video, identified as a kidnapper called “John”, may not be the hooded figure shown in the film. Isil may have used a British voiceover to add shock value to the film and to make it more difficult for the security services to identify the killer.

Dr Shabaan’s claim, though bogus, does raise the question of exactly when Mr Foley was killed. On August 13 GlobalPost and the Foley family received an email stating that the 40-year-old would be “executed”, and the video was posted on August 19.

Until now it had been assumed that Mr Foley was executed on or shortly after August 13, but there is no proof that he was still alive at the time, and it remains possible that he had already been murdered and that his killers delayed publicising his death either to get a safe distance away from the location where he was killed, or to ensure maximum publicity by releasing it on a day when there were no other major international news stories.

[Pepini]

Body of lies movie scene:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paCyf1IAKug

[big poppa]

(08-25-2014 08:14 AM)Crackshot Wrote:  

The video WAS fake, at least in part


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...taged.html

Analysts believe the British jihadi in the video may not have been James Foley's killer, although it is accepted that the journalist was murdered

The video of James Foley’s execution may have been staged, with the actual murder taking place off-camera, it has emerged.

Forensic analysis of the footage of the journalist’s death has suggested that the British jihadist in the film may have been the frontman rather than the killer.

The clip, which apparently depicts Mr Foley’s brutal beheading, has been widely seen as a propaganda coup for Islamic State miltant group.

But a study of the four-minute 40-second clip, carried out by an international forensic science company which has worked for police forces across Britain, suggested camera trickery and slick post-production techniques appear to have been used.


A forensic analyst told The Times that no blood can be seen, even though the knife is drawn across the neck area at least six times.

“After enhancements, the knife can be seen to be drawn across the upper neck at least six times, with no blood evidence to the point the picture fades to black,” the analysis said.

Sounds allegedly made by Foley do not appear consistent with what may be expected.

During Foley’s speech, there appears to be a blip which could indicate the journalist had to repeat a line.

One expert commissioned to examine the footage was reported as saying: “I think it has been staged. My feeling is that the execution may have happened after the camera was stopped.”

However the company, which requested anonymity, did not reach a definitive answer.

It concluded: “No one is disputing that at some point an execution occurred.”

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

[IvanDrago]

Here is a bit of fun. How about the video of his siblings being interviewed? Fake, real?

[Lizard King]

The current consensus is that the video was staged, and he was killed off camera.

The idea that he was killed in the past is very plausible, because the timing of the incident is WAY TOO CONVENIENT for the West.

[The Reactionary Tree]

Another story saying the beheading may have been staged

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national...-1.1915845

Quote:

A masked jihadist may not have actually beheaded American journalist James Foley in the barbaric video released by Islamic terrorists last week, a forensics expert said.

Though there was no doubt that Foley was beheaded, it was possible the jihadists killed Foley off camera and staged the video to make it look like an execution, an expert told the Times of London.

"I think it has been staged," the visual forensics expert, who was not identified, told The Times after scrutinizing the four-minute, 40-second film.

"My feeling is that the execution may have happened after the camera was stopped."

The analyst pointed to several pieces of evidence that suggested the video was a chilling bit of propaganda, but not an actual decapitation.

First, although the masked jihadist can be seen repeatedly drawing the knife across the 40-year-old war reporter's neck, no actual incisions were visible, the analyst said.

Similarly, there didn't appear to be any blood spilling from Foley's throat, and the sounds he made at the moment of his death didn't sound right.

The analyst also found a slight blip in the scripted remarks Foley made in the video, suggesting he may have had to repeat a line, which was spliced into the final version, The Times reported.

In the video, as the beheading occurs, the screen suddenly fades to black.

The next shot is of Foley's bloodied head resting on his back.

The analyst made clear, "No one is disputing that at some point an execution occurred."

Whether the beheading occurred on-camera, one terrorism expert said the Islamic State purposely featured an English-speaking executioner because the video was intended for a Western audience.

"It sends a message to both the U.K. and the U.S. who are intervening at this stage in some way in the conflict," Aymenn al-Tamimi, a fellow at the Philadelphia-based Middle East Forum think-tank, told The Times.

"I think it sends a powerful message that it doesn't matter where you are from, your allegiance is with the Islamic State and one day the Islamic State will encompass the entire world in terms of their thinking," he said.

"Islamic State really revel in beheading," he added. "They have definitely improved the production quality of their videos over the past couple of years."

Meanwhile, British intelligent agents said they were close to identifying the masked extremist who appears in the video holding the knife to Foley's throat

He was believed to be Abdel-Majed Abdel Bary, a 23-year-old London rapper and the son of an Egyptian militant facing terrorism charges in connection with Al Qaeda's bombings at the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania in 1998.

Bary left his family's million-dollar home west of London last year to fight for radical Islam in Syria and once posted a Twitter photo of himself holding a severed head.

Investigators weren't yet ready to officially name him as the killer, but were "close" to doing so, British ambassador to the United States Peter Westmacott told NBC's "Meet the Press" Sunday.

Foley was honored at a memorial mass at Our Lady of the Holy Rosary parish in Rochester, N.H. on Sunday.

His parents released a letter written during his years in captivity, which had been seized by jailers but was eventually delivered to them by a freed prisoner who had memorized Foley's words.

Danish photojournalist Daniel Rye Ottosen spent 13 months in captivity with Foley. After his release in June, Ottosen, 25, called Diane Foley and dictated the letter to her.

In it, Foley said the happy memories of times spent with his family lifted his spirits in captivity.

"I think a lot about my brothers and sister. I remember playing werewolf in the dark with Michael and so many other adventures," Foley said in the message.

"I think of chasing Mattie and T around the kitchen counter. It makes me happy to think of them."

[scorpion]

Quote:

Though there was no doubt that Foley was beheaded, it was possible the jihadists killed Foley off camera and staged the video to make it look like an execution, an expert told the Times of London.

...

The analyst made clear, "No one is disputing that at some point an execution occurred."

This is just absolutely idiotic. The execution video is blatantly fake, but they're falling all over themselves to ensure us that Foley is dead.

What the fuck? This just reeks of damage control on a botched false flag.

We're supposed to believe that the most bloodthirsty and vicious organization on the planet decided to fake an execution video for no reason? And that, having gone to the trouble of faking Foley's execution (for no discernible purpose, as they would only risk making themselves look bad if the subterfuge was uncovered) they then execute him anyway?

Combine that with these bizarre interviews with the Foley "family" where his parents and siblings are so happy to sit down and have lengthy conversations with the media, the British government's unprecedented and hasty warning that merely watching the video of the "execution" might be illegal, and the speed at which the U.S. government seems to be heading back into the Iraq largely on the back of this video.

Seriously, if you can't smell at least a whiff of bullshit on this story, your nose is busted.

[Sp5]

Well, a fake video would explain why he made that speech. "Play along, say this, and we'll keep you alive." I am agnostic on the question of whether he's still alive, though.

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

There have been many Muslim heroes in the war on terror - thousands of interpreters, support staff, Iraqi and Afghan police and soldiers have been killed by extremists. There are also Muslim CIA officers and Special Forces troops.

You know nothing.

[mikado]

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

Christians are killing Muslims in Centrafrica, and no one cares.

I'm sure Jesus is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion.

See, I can play this game too.

[bojangles]

Note for UK citizens: actually downloading or viewing the beheading of James Foley is classed as a terrorism offence by the Met (yep they've said that)

[surfnow]

analysis made by a professor doctor expert surgeon:

http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=103164

"I understand that away from the MSM there is universal scepticism as to the ‘decapitation’.
1. Knife shown, if real, could not sever even the soft tissues. Same with Dr Kelly and his wrist. To sever tendons and nerves one needs a knife of scalpel sharpness. I know that in shechita, for instance, the knife is extremely sharp. (Personal communication – from Jewish butcher – I was on my way to Gaza via Tel Aviv.)
2. The neck – after ”beheading” is very clean cut and not bloodied. With a knife, that was likely not sharp, the skin inscision would have been jagged. Did the assassin take a wet cloth to clean the neck stump? Of course he did not. Maximum effect was the aim.
3. This stump of neck, parts of the right hand look pale and bland – looks like a dummy from an Oxford Street window.
4. I note ‘pixillation’ above the left ankle. Why?
5. The suit is NOT a Guantanamo ‘jump suit’. Someone had written of him being clad in a ‘jump suit’, from that torture centre, for extra effect.
We know it is poor conjuring, but the lie penetrates because the whole of our vile MSM conspires with the psychopaths who run the show. Furthermore, anti-Muslim prejudice has been massaged vigorously and the ‘big lie’ of Hitler sinks deeply in.
I am aware Sir Peter that the SIS in Britain have looked very closely at this ‘video’. Given its conclusion, I have to question whether there was a surgeon, anatomist and forensic pathologist on hand to add expertise to any conclusion.
Why should I question the ‘diagnosis’ here and have the temerity to approach you? It is because I have had a scientific training and a good deal of experience of knives and tissues, and blood."

http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=103068

"The Fake Beheading of James Foley"

"From the beginning the video appears to be a fraud, for instance, when noting the way Foley and also the fraudulent executioner are speaking. Foley is speaking matter-of-fact, as if he is speaking in a studio: completely relaxed, uninvolved. The fake executioner also speaks in a matter-of-fact, emotion-free manner.

To many people it did appear significantly real, considering that the man in question does look like James Foley and the final image, the one with the ‘severed’ head, has a degree of realism.

There is also the presumed act of severing. It looks like a real knife being used to cut through the neck. No no such cutting can be seen. Nor is the expected flow of blood from the severing noticeable. Not even a drop of blood flows from the area of the presumed severing down through the forces of gravity the neck. Nor does any blood spurt onto the shirt of the ‘victim’ nor on the hands and knife of the ‘executioner.’"

[big poppa]

(08-27-2014 03:30 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Well, a fake video would explain why he made that speech. "Play along, say this, and we'll keep you alive." I am agnostic on the question of whether he's still alive, though.

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

There have been many Muslim heroes in the war on terror - thousands of interpreters, support staff, Iraqi and Afghan police and soldiers have been killed by extremists. There are also Muslim CIA officers and Special Forces troops.

You know nothing.

Are they doing these things in the name of their religion? Because the hundreds of thousands of extremist muslims are doing their evil deeds in the name of their religion.

You know even less.

[big poppa]

(08-27-2014 04:33 AM)mikado Wrote:  

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

Christians are killing Muslims in Centrafrica, and no one cares.

I'm sure Jesus is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion.

See, I can play this game too.

Head on out to Syria and let me know about the better standard of living you have compared to nations founded on Christian values. Looking forward to hearing back from you.

[Sp5]

(08-28-2014 03:35 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

(08-27-2014 03:30 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Well, a fake video would explain why he made that speech. "Play along, say this, and we'll keep you alive." I am agnostic on the question of whether he's still alive, though.

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

There have been many Muslim heroes in the war on terror - thousands of interpreters, support staff, Iraqi and Afghan police and soldiers have been killed by extremists. There are also Muslim CIA officers and Special Forces troops.

You know nothing.

Are they doing these things in the name of their religion? Because the hundreds of thousands of extremist muslims are doing their evil deeds in the name of their religion.

You know even less.

These "extremist" guys do things for a lot of reasons, including not wanting foreigners in their country, getting paid by other people, and wanting to get laid. When you separate out "not wanting foreigners in their country" and people being paid cash, the number of real religious extremists drops pretty low.

They get labeled as "Taliban" or "Al Qaeda in Iraq" but a lot just did not like foreign troops in the country.

I've lived in the region, I worked in the war on these kind of issues, and am learning the language - one thing I can assure you is that Muslims are at least, if not more, hypocritical about religion than Christians.

On our side, yes some Muslims fought on our side because they thought the Al Qaeda types were besmirching their religion, patriotism, whether Iraqi or American, and of course getting paid.

[big poppa]

(08-28-2014 09:12 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

(08-28-2014 03:35 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

(08-27-2014 03:30 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Well, a fake video would explain why he made that speech. "Play along, say this, and we'll keep you alive." I am agnostic on the question of whether he's still alive, though.

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

There have been many Muslim heroes in the war on terror - thousands of interpreters, support staff, Iraqi and Afghan police and soldiers have been killed by extremists. There are also Muslim CIA officers and Special Forces troops.

You know nothing.

Are they doing these things in the name of their religion? Because the hundreds of thousands of extremist muslims are doing their evil deeds in the name of their religion.

You know even less.

These "extremist" guys do things for a lot of reasons, including not wanting foreigners in their country, getting paid by other people, and wanting to get laid. When you separate out "not wanting foreigners in their country" and people being paid cash, the number of real religious extremists drops pretty low.

They get labeled as "Taliban" or "Al Qaeda in Iraq" but a lot just did not like foreign troops in the country.

I've lived in the region, I worked in the war on these kind of issues, and am learning the language - one thing I can assure you is that Muslims are at least, if not more, hypocritical about religion than Christians.

On our side, yes some Muslims fought on our side because they thought the Al Qaeda types were besmirching their religion, patriotism, whether Iraqi or American, and of course getting paid.

What about guys like Saddam Hussein and the ISIS characters massacring Kurdish and Christian minorities throughout Iraq? Whether or not there are foreign troops invading, it seems to me that the Muslims are always looking for some minority or another to massacre and commit genocide against, all in spirit of their Jihad and in the name of Allah. Do you truly believe that they would live in peaceful co-operation with each other if it weren't for foreign invasion? I know for certain that in Australia, the US, Britain, etc.. Catholics don't go out massacring Protestants and vice versa (not anymore anyway).

Note that I did not say all Muslims are terrible people, I would not blanket hundreds of millions of people in this way. But it seems to me that a huge number of them use their religion as an excuse to commit atrocities that no God could possibly excuse. The Christians have at least progressed since the Middle ages, will the Muslims ever do the same?

[Sp5]

(08-28-2014 11:32 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

(08-28-2014 09:12 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

(08-28-2014 03:35 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

(08-27-2014 03:30 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Well, a fake video would explain why he made that speech. "Play along, say this, and we'll keep you alive." I am agnostic on the question of whether he's still alive, though.

(08-26-2014 11:12 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

I'm sure Allah is extremely proud of these heroes... What a fucked up religion

There have been many Muslim heroes in the war on terror - thousands of interpreters, support staff, Iraqi and Afghan police and soldiers have been killed by extremists. There are also Muslim CIA officers and Special Forces troops.

You know nothing.

Are they doing these things in the name of their religion? Because the hundreds of thousands of extremist muslims are doing their evil deeds in the name of their religion.

You know even less.

These "extremist" guys do things for a lot of reasons, including not wanting foreigners in their country, getting paid by other people, and wanting to get laid. When you separate out "not wanting foreigners in their country" and people being paid cash, the number of real religious extremists drops pretty low.

They get labeled as "Taliban" or "Al Qaeda in Iraq" but a lot just did not like foreign troops in the country.

I've lived in the region, I worked in the war on these kind of issues, and am learning the language - one thing I can assure you is that Muslims are at least, if not more, hypocritical about religion than Christians.

On our side, yes some Muslims fought on our side because they thought the Al Qaeda types were besmirching their religion, patriotism, whether Iraqi or American, and of course getting paid.

What about guys like Saddam Hussein and the ISIS characters massacring Kurdish and Christian minorities throughout Iraq? Whether or not there are foreign troops invading, it seems to me that the Muslims are always looking for some minority or another to massacre and commit genocide against, all in spirit of their Jihad and in the name of Allah. Do you truly believe that they would live in peaceful co-operation with each other if it weren't for foreign invasion? I know for certain that in Australia, the US, Britain, etc.. Catholics don't go out massacring Protestants and vice versa (not anymore anyway).

Note that I did not say all Muslims are terrible people, I would not blanket hundreds of millions of people in this way. But it seems to me that a huge number of them use their religion as an excuse to commit atrocities that no God could possibly excuse. The Christians have at least progressed since the Middle ages, will the Muslims ever do the same?

Saddam Hussein never massacred Christians, in fact they were quite protected under him - his deputy Tariq Aziz was a Christian, and the Christian community in his rule was large.

Kurds are Muslims too, and Saddam killed them because they were fighting him, often in conjunction with the Muslim Iranians he was also at war with.

ISIS is a new thing, and so far I have read of them imposing taxes on Christians, but not massacring them. I would be skeptical of atrocity reports in the current environment.

Christians pretty much conquered the world. The Spanish killed millions in the Americas in the sign of the cross. The Brits gave out smallpox infected blankets in Massachusetts, they machine-gunned the Ashanti in Ghana. They forced the Chinese to buy opium from them. All of this was justified in the name of civilizing the natives and bringing the word of God to them, the missionaries were always there. The French, Italian, Germans and Belgians massacred locals, including many Muslims and brought hell on earth, example the Belgian Congo.

Christians also took over the Muslim world - all of it from Indonesia to Morocco was a European colony in 1945. Taking over these countries took a lot of shedding of blood, for example the RAF used to regularly bomb rebellious cities in Iraq in the 1920s, pretty much indiscriminately. They tried to carve up Turkey, but only Ataturk's organized defense saved it. A large piece of then-Arab land, Palestine, was handed over to foreign settlers by dictate of Britain.

In recent times, the west has brought bombing and chaos to Iraq, Libya and Syria, for murky reasons probably related to oil.

Don't tell me about how Christians have progressed since the Middle Ages.