Posts: 2,474
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation:
42
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-03-2013, 09:45 PM
A page he made on Facebook page on December 1, 2013:
"You can tell if a discipline is BS if the degree depends severely on the prestige of the school granting it. I remember when I applied to MBA programs being told that anything outside the top 10 or 20 would be a waste of time. On the other hand a degree in mathematics is much less dependent on the shool (conditional on being above a certain level, so the heuristic would apply to the differene betwewn top 10 and top 2000 schools)."
Just another reminder of what separates STEM degrees from social science/humanities degrees - the former has inherent value from the type of knowledge that is contained within it while the worth of the latter is heavily based on appealing to the right authorities and gatekeepers of knowledge.
Posts: 5,392
Threads: 0
Joined: May 2013
Reputation:
27
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-03-2013, 09:50 PM
Very good point.
If only you knew how bad things really are.
Posts: 7,818
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation:
343
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-03-2013, 10:38 PM
I guess I'm old cause I know STEM degree holders that are underemployed or jobless. There isn't a lot of security in being an employee. Industry constantly changes, but the top employers always prefer the newest top students from the top schools.
And a lot of skill sets are useless, unless you're employed by a fortune 500 company.
Posts: 650
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2011
Reputation:
8
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-03-2013, 11:02 PM
What can you do that an educated English speaker in a third world country can't? Nothing? Your income will be about the same as theirs in 20 years.
Posts: 876
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation:
10
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-03-2013, 11:25 PM
The people who know how ALWAYS work for the people who know why, it doesn't matter what fucking degree either of them have, or from where.
Posts: 288
Threads: 0
Joined: Aug 2012
Reputation:
9
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 12:51 AM
Majors are bullshit if your banking on the major. The value of a degree is in the degree itself. Out of the corral, you have something that says you're trainable and ambitious enough to get through a 4 year program.
A great salesman with a degree in theology will always have work, whereas a passive engineer may not.
Internships are key. Get experience in something that has a broad appeal. Publishing (most major universities have an academic publishing house), advertising agencies, PR firms, and similar firms allow you to get "business" experience, even if you're only designing book covers or writing catalog copy. Work part-time sales. Wireless is a great gig in school. You make decent money, refine social skills, and talk to cute girls all day. Pair 2-3 years of that with an internship @ one of the above and you'll be ahead of 90% of grads.
Work for a small biz (after or during school) and pay attention. Take notes, figure out how you can use what you know to provide value to businesses on your own terms. People constantly want to do this B2C startup crap. No idea why. B2B startups can be proven in just a few months if you provide value. Also substantially easier to get started.
The value of a degree is subjective to your experience, circumstances, personality, and other factors. Don't count on your degree being "worth" any specific salary range.
Posts: 283
Threads: 0
Joined: Aug 2013
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 01:35 AM
I think STEM should be changed to MELTS to include Law.
Posts: 5,392
Threads: 0
Joined: May 2013
Reputation:
27
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 08:34 AM
Quote:Quote:
I guess I'm old cause I know STEM degree holders that are underemployed or jobless.
I do believe a lot of the "STEM shortage" talk is just part of a campaign to get more H1B visas for engineers from India and China.
If only you knew how bad things really are.
Posts: 283
Threads: 0
Joined: Aug 2013
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 12:47 PM
Quote: (12-04-2013 06:10 AM)cibo Wrote:
Quote: (12-04-2013 01:35 AM)Vendetta Wrote:
I think STEM should be changed to MELTS to include Law.
There's too many lawyers. Even top 15 law grads have issues getting jobs.
Really? I didn't know that. What about architects?
Posts: 7,818
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation:
343
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 12:56 PM
Lawyers, architects, accountants, dentists, pharmacists all used to be immediately lucrative professions.
Right now STEM is still the best bet, but it's not a slam dunk long term.
There are always going to be technicians, but the valuable person in that organization is the person that can find customers.
Posts: 4,481
Threads: 0
Joined: Nov 2012
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 02:46 PM
Both my brothers are engineers.
They say if you are an engineer you are best off getting as many finance qualifications you can through work.
The top people are the engineers who also get to control the budgets. That is where the power is.
Posts: 9,980
Threads: 0
Joined: Jul 2009
Reputation:
0
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 03:19 PM
Engineer is overrated.
The problem with being an engineer is you then have the personality of an engineer.
Posts: 3,153
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation:
85
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 03:23 PM
That quote is abysmal.
Would you rather hire an engineer who graduated from Stanford or Devry. Ummm Stanford.
Literally all professions rely heavily on where you were taught. This is universal in every industry.
You want the guy playing hoops for your team if he played for duke versus Utah state? Etc etc.
Who gets more money on average endorsements etc, a guy playing for the Knicks or the Pelicans.
Get the best degree you can from the best school you can get without going into debt that's the solution. That or start a company yourself.
I would argue the reverse. Get the best school always. Why? Drum fucking roll = connections.
Do you want a rollodex full of people from money or a rollodex of people from poverty. You always want the best possible connections. This is every industry in the world.
Posts: 3,153
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation:
85
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 03:49 PM
^ yes so you choose the best you can get for next to no debt.
Example: Ucla or Stanford. If ucla is for free or $200K for Stanford go to ucla.
If you are at the high end, getting admitted to ivy's you can get a full ride to a ton of places.
Posts: 2,696
Threads: 0
Joined: Feb 2013
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 04:37 PM
Quote: (12-03-2013 11:02 PM)babelfish669 Wrote:
What can you do that an educated English speaker in a third world country can't? Nothing? Your income will be about the same as theirs in 20 years.
Filipinos and Indians are going to take over the world.
Posts: 5,050
Threads: 0
Joined: May 2011
Reputation:
74
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 06:23 PM
A lot of people here have unrealistic expectations on these "connections". Athlone is one of the forums few bona fide Ivy League students and I vividly remember how he described how the true movers and shakers seal themselves off in clubs within the school and informal networks from which he was firmly although politely evicted. This is also one of the forums smartest posters.
So I'd be a little more careful about throwing my money on something as 'soft' as "connections".
Posts: 3,153
Threads: 0
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation:
85
Taleb on how to tell which majors are BS
12-04-2013, 06:32 PM
Connections is a broad topic.
I wrote above a dude from poverty should choose ucla over Stanford if ucla is a full ride. No brainer.
Go to the career center and look at the jobs they land. If you see the same lists of companies you're good to go.
The extremely high end = not gonna break in. You have to literally be born rich.
What the other type of connection is = other future successful people.
All my contacts are from college or work at this point.
So yeah the guy has it dead wrong. Going to a bad university and majoring in X doesn't mean anything because the people you compete against are a joke. That's all it really is.
Another example is if you get into cornell and NYU... Definitely choose NYU to save that $$. Aim for a partial scholarship or full ride. Debt = death.
There are really two major turning points in your life. No one will tell you this to your face but it's 100% true.
1. The college you attend
2. The first job out of college you obtain
If you can knock those out of the park it's almost inevitable you'll be sitting pretty in a few years. It is absolutely not an "or" topic you have to do both. If you went to MIT and end up working in accounting you're fucked. If you went to NYU but got into Barclays front office... I'll guarantee you the NYU kid will be doing better in 5 years.
All decisions in life compound over time, make good ones when you're young and you'll be great. Make bad ones and you've created new hurdles to jump later. It's how life works.
One extra note. Notice I don't care what you major in it's simply school + job. Smart move is to apply to a bullshit major, get into an elite school and get a full ride, halfway through "switch" majors to ones that don't need a separate application and then use that. Just cut your tuition in half as you bullshit the admins that you want to major in humanities fucking LOL just write a "I want to save the world essay" get that scholarship and "whoops" switching majors as you took the real classes over the summer freshman year to make it cheaper and jump all of the enrollment issues.