[billy]

Alberto, I see you are in Camden I actually spend a bit of time there but being in the UK, I can tell you that a vial of UGL test will be £30, pharma £40, Pharma nova will be £15, and 100 dbols or winny tabs will be £30. If you cannot afford a 40 quid tub of protein once a month you may struggle to pay for juice and the emergency shit you need to keep on standby.
Also Camden should be the best day game place in the UK based on the talent you see walking around but I never have much luck there hoe do you find day game there ?

[billy]

(09-18-2012 03:39 PM)mikeymike Wrote:  

terrible place to start omg. Telling a rookie to start off with the strongest oil based product and recommending the longest ester to boot with no idea how he'll tolerate it? Get some nolva, but don't need to worry about prolactin? and a half decent diet is a great way to get half decent results. If you can't get a decent build naturally no way you should be looking at gear. Learn what's causing you to fail and fix that first then look at gear when you're ready to take your body to another level.

It is extremely rare for low doses of tren to raise prolactin levels significantly and plenty of evidence suggests even high doses of tren will not cause prolactin issues unless oestrogen is very high. Good oestrogen control will prevent prolactin being an issue. If you think you have seen a scientific study showing any different I would like to see it as I have searched and found none. I have personally run 1g test and 900mg tren with NO need for any Ancilaries to control prolactin or oestrogen. You will not lactate without the presence of some breast tissue and you will not develop breast tissue with correct doses of nova.

[Nineteen84]

(09-18-2012 09:15 PM)HiFlo Wrote:  

i get a lot more eyefucking now from girls at 170 8%bf then when i was 210 16%bf.

i got a lot more eyefucking when I was 210 then when i was 145 sans gear.

What's your height?

[alecks]

please stop giving him advice on cycles.he doesnt know how to eat or lift yet.christ

[garygroundwork]

(09-18-2012 01:59 PM)alecks Wrote:  

(09-18-2012 01:46 PM)Neil Skywalker Wrote:  

I'd rather not be ripped and a have good functioning dick for the next 35 years.

I have a friend who used tit and said his balls shrinked to peanut sizes and almost no cum was coming out anymore when he was using roids. As soon as he stopped using his became normal again and but now his body shrunk again.

I would never mess around with my ding dong, especially not with illegal hormones/steroids and that shit.

only some compounds will do that,not all.there are plenty of dudes i know on certain cycles that say their hornier than ever.to each their own.

very true....while ur on them

its when u come off that is the problem... especially if u use compounds like deca

i have a mate who used tren he came off suffered depression for about 6 months (got over that as hormones returned to normal) but his erections have never been the same.

test only cycles are way to go with hcg throughout followed by good pct nolva/clomid etc... still its a lot of bullshit to go through for a bit of muscle

when u get older health becomes priority...good diet good exercise regime...lean, strong and healthy

[worldwidetraveler]

Just for curiosity sake, do you lose most of your gains when you get off steroids? It is hard to ascertain what is fact and what isn't when looking this stuff up.

[Moma]

What is the strongest liver builder you can recommend? Gear affects the liver so there are usually liver builders that are recommended.

Can anyone (looking for a chime in from Rionomad, Velkrum) recommend a strong liver repair concoction?

Thanks,

[mikeymike]

(09-19-2012 05:04 AM)billy Wrote:  

(09-18-2012 03:39 PM)mikeymike Wrote:  

terrible place to start omg. Telling a rookie to start off with the strongest oil based product and recommending the longest ester to boot with no idea how he'll tolerate it? Get some nolva, but don't need to worry about prolactin? and a half decent diet is a great way to get half decent results. If you can't get a decent build naturally no way you should be looking at gear. Learn what's causing you to fail and fix that first then look at gear when you're ready to take your body to another level.

It is extremely rare for low doses of tren to raise prolactin levels significantly and plenty of evidence suggests even high doses of tren will not cause prolactin issues unless oestrogen is very high. Good oestrogen control will prevent prolactin being an issue. If you think you have seen a scientific study showing any different I would like to see it as I have searched and found none. I have personally run 1g test and 900mg tren with NO need for any Ancilaries to control prolactin or oestrogen. You will not lactate without the presence of some breast tissue and you will not develop breast tissue with correct doses of nova.

1. bullshit. Extremely rare to raise prolactin issues? talk to most users who have used tren and see how many have faced prolactin based sides, they don't all manifest themselves as just lactating breasts...

2. Estrogen is again a culprit in the breast tissue arena, you're eliminating one side but leaving yourself open to others using strictly an estrogen blocker.

3. There will not be a scientific study on tren, it's not a medically viable product. Test, var, drol, gh and on and on all have mainstream medical uses so they are studied clinically. When you're talking vet hormones that aren't made by recognized pharmaceutical companies you won't get studies.

4. unless you're a very advanced physique you're taking way too much shit and I'm guessing you're not an advanced physique. You were talking about getting on a year ago-ish, if you're already upto a gram of tren a week where are you left to go?

5. You are not every case...some guys get near tren and they're facing every side known to man and some can take 300mg of tren ace per day and not feel a thing...I've seen them both...you need to act on the side of safety and not assume everyone will be lucky enough to be side free.

[mikeymike]

(09-19-2012 10:23 AM)Moma Wrote:  

What is the strongest liver builder you can recommend? Gear affects the liver so there are usually liver builders that are recommended.

Can anyone (looking for a chime in from Rionomad, Velkrum) recommend a strong liver repair concoction?

Thanks,

liv52, or whatever himalaya calls it now, otc and consistantly recommended for liver support thru the years. Liver is amazingly resilient, it can take a lot of abuse and bounce back but I've seen guys take mind boggling amounts of orals and their panels go thru the roof, then get on liv52 and it bounces back strong and the numbers fall back in line.

[mikeymike]

(09-18-2012 09:49 PM)HiFlo Wrote:  

You're too fat for a clean bulk. So called 'clean' bulks are used by people who are 10%bf and don't mind going to 12% during winter. At 16% you have just mush, mush mush. Furthermore, 90% of everyone underestimates their bf, so you're probably closer to 18%.

You know how fucking hard it is to go from 16% to 10% bodyfat? That's gonna take you 4-6 months AT LEAST of intense HIIT and a solid low carb meal plan.

+1

attempting to bulk when you're already carrying that much bodyfat is compounding a mistake. Clean up the mess you've made and then build on that frame.

[mikeymike]

(09-19-2012 08:30 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

Just for curiosity sake, do you lose most of your gains when you get off steroids? It is hard to ascertain what is fact and what isn't when looking this stuff up.

depends on what you take. You will lose something when you come off, how much depends on what you've taken. Guys will take loads of test and dbol and pack on 35 pounds in 3 months preparing to be big on the beach for the summer and they're just puffy messes, they get off cycle and see that come flying off. When you're packing on loads of water it'll come off. If you cycle and pack on 5-10 pounds of lean muscle lose bodyfat in the process, you might lose a little of that muscle but you could keep a majority of it without packing on much of the fat you lost. You won't be where you were when you're on most likely but you can be way further ahead then when you started if you do it properly or you can lose everything if you don't do it properly.

[Moma]

(09-19-2012 02:22 PM)mikeymike Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 10:23 AM)Moma Wrote:  

What is the strongest liver builder you can recommend? Gear affects the liver so there are usually liver builders that are recommended.

Can anyone (looking for a chime in from Rionomad, Velkrum) recommend a strong liver repair concoction?

Thanks,

liv52, or whatever himalaya calls it now, otc and consistantly recommended for liver support thru the years. Liver is amazingly resilient, it can take a lot of abuse and bounce back but I've seen guys take mind boggling amounts of orals and their panels go thru the roof, then get on liv52 and it bounces back strong and the numbers fall back in line.

can you provide a link to liv52, please?

[mikeymike]

(09-19-2012 02:48 PM)Moma Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 02:22 PM)mikeymike Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 10:23 AM)Moma Wrote:  

What is the strongest liver builder you can recommend? Gear affects the liver so there are usually liver builders that are recommended.

Can anyone (looking for a chime in from Rionomad, Velkrum) recommend a strong liver repair concoction?

Thanks,

liv52, or whatever himalaya calls it now, otc and consistantly recommended for liver support thru the years. Liver is amazingly resilient, it can take a lot of abuse and bounce back but I've seen guys take mind boggling amounts of orals and their panels go thru the roof, then get on liv52 and it bounces back strong and the numbers fall back in line.

can you provide a link to liv52, please?

http://www.himalayausa.com/herbalformula...aretab.htm

[AlbertoDelMuerto]

(09-19-2012 03:14 AM)billy Wrote:  

Alberto, I see you are in Camden I actually spend a bit of time there but being in the UK, I can tell you that a vial of UGL test will be £30, pharma £40, Pharma nova will be £15, and 100 dbols or winny tabs will be £30. If you cannot afford a 40 quid tub of protein once a month you may struggle to pay for juice and the emergency shit you need to keep on standby.
Also Camden should be the best day game place in the UK based on the talent you see walking around but I never have much luck there hoe do you find day game there ?

I recently had a testosterone serum done, my levels are average at 700 ng/dl, so I don't suppose I need testosterone supplementation. What I certainly need is an estrogen blocker, and I have already ordered 90 days supply for only 35 quids. As for D-bol, I'm not sure how bad the side-effects are but it seems too expensive for me. I stick to the cheapest protein and spend about 20 quids a month on it.

Camden is not really the best venue for daygame! I suppose Old Street is okay, but Camden not really. I've found the City of London and Picadilly to be the best daygame areas in London. I usually spend one entire day a week daygaming, get around 2-3 number approach 20-25 women. Other than that, I try to run daygame on the subway, when the trains aren't that loaded (you know the rush hour and all that), actually got quite a few numbers this way.

[Nineteen84]

(09-19-2012 05:07 PM)AlbertoDelMuerto Wrote:  

I recently had a testosterone serum done,

where'd you get this done?

[AlbertoDelMuerto]

(09-19-2012 07:57 PM)Nineteen84 Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 05:07 PM)AlbertoDelMuerto Wrote:  

I recently had a testosterone serum done,

where'd you get this done?

At the GP Surgery at 9 am.

[Nineteen84]

(09-19-2012 09:32 PM)AlbertoDelMuerto Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 07:57 PM)Nineteen84 Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 05:07 PM)AlbertoDelMuerto Wrote:  

I recently had a testosterone serum done,

where'd you get this done?

At the GP Surgery at 9 am.

Okay cheers, I thought it was something you had to pay to get done. I will ask my GP...

[tjuan]

OP: Before you even think about steroids you need to be eating twice what you're eating now.
Do that and your lifts will go through the roof.

[Magic Bullets]

Not worth taking unless you have a solid few years under your belt and have pushed your body as hard as it will go naturally. That is the general view on the gear. Even then it is not worth it, Arnold would still have a great physique if he was natural. Juice is too much of a crutch to rely on.

[billy]

(09-19-2012 08:30 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

Just for curiosity sake, do you lose most of your gains when you get off steroids? It is hard to ascertain what is fact and what isn't when looking this stuff up.

Some people lose most of their gains some not so much, many people try to cut after a long bulk and if you diet after a bulking cycle you can lose most of the gains you made. Lots of people stay on using a blast and cruise eg one guy I know blasts in 3-4 g of test per week with 900mg tren and some dbol, he does this for 4 weeks then cruises on 1g test per week for 4 weeks before another blast, After this in run up to a competition he would add in t3 winny DNP etc depending on how much fat he has to lose. A lot of pros never come off unless health problems force the issue.

[WanderingSoul]

(09-21-2012 10:49 AM)billy Wrote:  

Some people lose most of their gains some not so much, many people try to cut after a long bulk and if you diet after a bulking cycle you can lose most of the gains you made. Lots of people stay on using a blast and cruise eg one guy I know blasts in 3-4 g of test per week with 900mg tren and some dbol, he does this for 4 weeks then cruises on 1g test per week for 4 weeks before another blast, After this in run up to a competition he would add in t3 winny DNP etc depending on how much fat he has to lose. A lot of pros never come off unless health problems force the issue.

Are you advising someone who weighs 150lbs, and can't squat his own bodyweight, to take steroids? Do you think that is a better idea than to have him eat more and lift heavy?

[saturn]

Your focus is all messed up. Forget about steroids, sort out everything else, your wardrobe, hair cut, skin, eye wear, shoes- then learn a language and a musical instrument, do all the things necessary to be the best you can be and maximises you chances with women.

Once you have done everything else you can and the only way you can improve yourself is to go on steroids do it. But do the cost benefit analysis. I don't think its worth it.

[Magic Bullets]

I really like your advise Jacks. Placing too much emphasis on your looks and body is femine, don't get me wrong I spend good money on fashion, grooming and supplements. It is rediculous to do that with the sole intention of getting laid, it has to be for you. I can eventually see a day when steroids become a legal drug, sometime not to far into the future. The supplement industry is growing at a rapid rate and is usually a precursor to steroids. PUA is constantly evolving and the industry is eventually going to go more innergame, when that happens more men will start to have better choices with women.

[AlbertoDelMuerto]

(09-21-2012 04:22 PM)jacks48 Wrote:  

Your focus is all messed up. Forget about steroids, sort out everything else, your wardrobe, hair cut, skin, eye wear, shoes- then learn a language and a musical instrument, do all the things necessary to be the best you can be and maximises you chances with women.

Once you have done everything else you can and the only way you can improve yourself is to go on steroids do it. But do the cost benefit analysis. I don't think its worth it.

Jack, when did I say I needed fashion advice? You sound real effeminate to me.

[billy]

(09-21-2012 12:48 PM)RioNomad Wrote:  

Are you advising someone who weighs 150lbs, and can't squat his own bodyweight, to take steroids? Do you think that is a better idea than to have him eat more and lift heavy?

I have not met him have no idea what his BF% really is considering most peoples estimates are guesses, and don't really know exactly what look he wants to achieve. For all we know he could have three inch wrists and have no hope of lifting heavy weights ever even with juice. I do not presume to have a clue about him or what he needs to do to improve and nor does anyone else. 150 lbs is fucking tiny but for all you know that could be within 20lbs of his genetic max at which point he wlll start to put on fat not muscle when he eats more. All this crap said by idiots presuming to know what is the best diet and training or someone they have never met is bollocks. Good training is a system where you can try different things, monitor results and establish the best training regime at that time for that person.
I am not in a position to advise on taking whether or not someone should take steroids but I can say that I waited much longer than I should have to start myself.
The American message boards on the subject are widely regarded around the world to be full of mis-information and bro science rather than info based on scientific study or individuals who had actual blood tests done. If a person wants to start juice its up to them but they should at least get proper information rather than internet bro science to inform their decision.