[TheMan]

Even in me, in my socially inept, bio-mechanically oblivious pre-red-pill days, had always been aware to a certain degree of this, commonly observed and scientifically supported phenomenon--Not the how and why mind you but definitely the who and the what. I just accepted that it was a [disgusting and sometimes amusing] part of the female psyche and then promptly forgot about it, quickly returned them atop their pedestals and then continued hanging with the boys.

However, as of late, something really distressing has come to my attention.

...Men are starting to do the same thing.

Now, I work in an office. There are quite a few people that I interact with regularly and have office friendships with some but most are general acquaintances and all are professional relationships.

I've been practicing and studying the tao of red-pill since back in 2006.
Since then I've had my peaks, plateaus and valleys while learning and when I started this job I was at a plateau. I have since been [successfully] working past that [improving physique, sharpening social skills] and of course those around have taken notice. I often catch the girls in the office looking sometimes very obviously. They're noticeably more "friendly" towards me, some even [unconsciously?] touching my chest when talking to me in the kitchen etc.

Over the past six to eight months, I've noticed that kinda smarmy, insincere attitude from a lot of the guys. And just recently I've discovered that guys have been going around spreading rumors about me, saying everything from I do steroids to one saying that I tried to throw myself at / molest one of the secretaries [never happened, not even fucking close!! AND I made sure to get her saying so in writing] and there's more, but I think you get the point.

I'm not yet sure if I'm noticing this because

• of a jealous fallout of my red-pill related self improvement (which might tie this slightly to the 3rd point)
• because my increasing social aptitude and awareness is now making painfully visible what was once an unfathomable concept [to me]
• OR if this is just a sign of the terrifyingly steady and determinedly quickening march towards androgyny that [whether they realize it or not] is a major symptom (if not outright goal) of the type of doomed, unnatural society that feminism is so haphazardly thrusting us towards
  

So here is where I turn to you guys. This is totally out of left field for me and I've no idea how to fight / handle this (not those specific examples but as per the title). Do I

• suck it up and learn one of the darker feminine arts
• OR go with whats in my heart ...and start crushing some skulls?
  

Have any of you experienced this phenomenon, what have you done?
Any feedback is greatly appreciated

[Cookie]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the average male doesn't just hate game, he hates success in all forms.
As long as you keep doing what your doing, those weaker guys are always going to hate.
I wouldn't recommend shooting back at them, just ignore things and keep rolling forward.

[TheMan]

(08-24-2012 09:06 AM)Cookie Wrote:  

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the average male doesn't just hate game, he hates success in all forms.
As long as you keep doing what your doing, those weaker guys are always going to hate.
I wouldn't recommend shooting back at them, just ignore things and keep rolling forward.

Thanks

P.S.
Nice Abs Bro

[teh_skeeze]

It's the product of working in a white collar environment. Working blue collar jobs is much different. You tend to work in teams more, sweat your ass off, yell, scream, and swear at each other. Then when the work day is done, you go out for a few beers.

I find that white collar professionals are more forward minded, and in order to get ahead you have to stand out from your peers. When they can't do it on their own merit, someone is getting thrown under the bus. If I were in your position, I would make mental notes on these people. Then, when you get promoted over them, they will be looking for a new job.

[mental]

That's just pure envy. By being awesome, people start to hate your awesomeness. Everyone wants to be awesome, but no one wants to put in the work needed to be awesome. Since their tactics are women's tactics, don't be reactive (that's what they want), you should instead just laugh at their pitiful attempts, just like when a woman tries to control or insult you. Bonus points for being charismatic, that'll make them look weak and their rumors will seem unfounded and ridiculous.

[Neo]

I hear you all day with this man. That's just the way things are. Ever notice how the people at the top always have the most haters? Most guys hate it when other people succeed.

An average man sees another guy with a hot girl and gets jealous.

A player sees a guy with a hot girl, oberves him and tries to learn something. I don't even remember the last time I felt jealousy towards a guy who had a hottie on his arm. I think to myself, 'She's great looking, now what's he doing right?'

Here's another thing that will happen. Some of your 'friends' will want you to fail.

I experienced this first hand when I tried to start a business in 2007-2008. I thought that my so called friends would come through with help but instead they talked smack. They claimed that all I cared about was money and I trying to 'use them to get ahead.' They wanted me to stay at their level. Before that time they never said anything like this.

When I was younger I was thin as fuck and a total nerd. I couldn't get a girl for the life of me. All of my 'friends' were there. Then when I started stepping up to the plate and approaching women guess who stopped talking to me? Yep my 'friends.' It's like that with women too. Fat chick cockblocks cause why should her friend hook up and not her?

It's rare to find someone who wants you to succeed. Look at all the hate Roosh and this site get. The average man looks at this site and becomes angry. Here are all these guys traveling and scoring hot exotic ass, he's got a fat wife who hasn't fucked him in months. It's easier to hate than to actually put in the work and become skilled. It's easier for his reality to believe that we are all losers who never get laid and only sleep with ugly girls and prostitutes.

Avoid these type of guys like the plague.

If you're getting haters you're probably doing a lot of things right.

[Grit]

@Neo

I feel the same way. The only way to get things done in today's world it to hard charge past all the haters and hope not to step on some chick's ego and get a false rape charge.

All male job environments worked because no matter how much social shit happened, men could still put it aside with the belief in their work: so what if you got cheated on, you have to build a fucking empire! Thats pretty much how it worked.

Women are obsessed with entering and consequently ruining the productivity of the job world. For all I know and can see, every product or service offered since feminism is fiat.

[TheMan]

(08-24-2012 03:52 PM)mental Wrote:  

That's just pure envy. By being awesome, people start to hate your awesomeness. Everyone wants to be awesome, but no one wants to put in the work needed to be awesome. Since their tactics are women's tactics, don't be reactive (that's what they want), you should instead just laugh at their pitiful attempts, just like when a woman tries to control or insult you. Bonus points for being charismatic, that'll make them look weak and their rumors will seem unfounded and ridiculous.

Word

[TheMan]

(08-24-2012 05:59 PM)Neo Wrote:  

I hear you all day with this man. That's just the way things are. Ever notice how the people at the top always have the most haters? Most guys hate it when other people succeed.

An average man sees another guy with a hot girl and gets jealous.

A player sees a guy with a hot girl, oberves him and tries to learn something. I don't even remember the last time I felt jealousy towards a guy who had a hottie on his arm. I think to myself, 'She's great looking, now what's he doing right?'

Here's another thing that will happen. Some of your 'friends' will want you to fail.

I experienced this first hand when I tried to start a business in 2007-2008. I thought that my so called friends would come through with help but instead they talked smack. They claimed that all I cared about was money and I trying to 'use them to get ahead.' They wanted me to stay at their level. Before that time they never said anything like this.

When I was younger I was thin as fuck and a total nerd. I couldn't get a girl for the life of me. All of my 'friends' were there. Then when I started stepping up to the plate and approaching women guess who stopped talking to me? Yep my 'friends.' It's like that with women too. Fat chick cockblocks cause why should her friend hook up and not her?

It's rare to find someone who wants you to succeed. Look at all the hate Roosh and this site get. The average man looks at this site and becomes angry. Here are all these guys traveling and scoring hot exotic ass, he's got a fat wife who hasn't fucked him in months. It's easier to hate than to actually put in the work and become skilled. It's easier for his reality to believe that we are all losers who never get laid and only sleep with ugly girls and prostitutes.

Avoid these type of guys like the plague.

If you're getting haters you're probably doing a lot of things right.

Can't avoid 'em but thanks for "doing things right " reminder.

[joehoya]

Back in my worst beta days, I must confess that I was guilty of doing some punk ass, backstabbing, beta/omega shit like this ONCE.

I have a buddy who is quite possibly the smoothest natural player I have ever met. The dude had his mack game tighter at age 14 than most guys who claim to be PUAs have it after 5 years of practice. Keep in mind that this was almost a decade before mystery hit the scene.

Well in high school as a senior I started hanging with this freshman girl. Just friends (I was WAY too much of a pussy to go further). Two years later, I start hanging out with her again over summer break (still as a friend) but my super-player friend takes an interest in her. We are both in college but she is still in high school. It must be said that at this time my player friend had begun to "explore his sexuality" and started fucking dudes as well as girls.

Anyway, I am talking to the girl and she makes a passing remark that lets me know that she is at least a little interested in my friend. She was a fairly conservative girl, but I bet that she would have been open to hooking up/getting dicked down by him. Me being the complete beta douche that I was back then mentioned "Yeah X is a great guy and really open with himself. In fact he just came out of the closet as bisexual."

The look on her face was as if someone farted in her mouth. She tried to play it off like she wasn't completely grossed out by it, but I knew that I had struck a cord. She kept probing, asking questions about whether I was sure or not. I gave details of him coming out to a bunch of other folks, AND me seeing him make out publicly with guys and having guys stay the night with him. I kept saying it like it was a good thing that he could be comfortable being himself around friends, but really it was all to turn this chick off. She even checked with her best friend, who was also friends with another of his friends and got it confirmed.

From that point on, she had ZERO sexual interest in him. Keep in mind that everything I said was true and none of it was secret. HOWEVER it was still the most douchebag thing I have ever done to a friend (I can't remember doing anything worse), all because I wanted to keep him away from a chick that I had a crush on. I don't feel guilty about many things in my life but I STILL feel guilty about that.

In the end, it didn't amount to shit. Sure, I prevented him from fucking her, but I NEVER FUCKED HER EITHER. I pussed out and never made a move. So what was the point? It was like throwing away a friend's slice of pizza because you can't afford one of your own.

In the years that followed, I did try to make it up for him. Any time he was gaming a hot girl that had an plain/ugly friend, I was the guy who fell on the grenade for him (more times than I care to remember). Anytime he needed someone to give him cover so that he could cheat on his girlfriend, I was there.

After awhile we became a pretty good team and would talk the other up to different girls. I remember him running game on this tall gorgeous stripper just to set her up for me (it worked). He is also the only dude (aside from some group sex parties/gangbangs) that I have shared a girl with one night. We both gamed this chick back to a hotel room and passed her back and forth between us 5 or 6 times. Good times.

Then he got married and the party stopped.

[TheMan]

(08-25-2012 05:12 PM)joehoya Wrote:  

Back in my worst beta days, I must confess that I was guilty of doing some punk ass, backstabbing, beta/omega shit like this ONCE.

I have a buddy who is quite possibly the smoothest natural player I have ever met. The dude had his mack game tighter at age 14 than most guys who claim to be PUAs have it after 5 years of practice. Keep in mind that this was almost a decade before mystery hit the scene.

Well in high school as a senior I started hanging with this freshman girl. Just friends (I was WAY too much of a pussy to go further). Two years later, I start hanging out with her again over summer break (still as a friend) but my super-player friend takes an interest in her. We are both in college but she is still in high school. It must be said that at this time my player friend had begun to "explore his sexuality" and started fucking dudes as well as girls.

Anyway, I am talking to the girl and she makes a passing remark that lets me know that she is at least a little interested in my friend. She was a fairly conservative girl, but I bet that she would have been open to hooking up/getting dicked down by him. Me being the complete beta douche that I was back then mentioned "Yeah X is a great guy and really open with himself. In fact he just came out of the closet as bisexual."

The look on her face was as if someone farted in her mouth. She tried to play it off like she wasn't completely grossed out by it, but I knew that I had struck a cord. She kept probing, asking questions about whether I was sure or not. I gave details of him coming out to a bunch of other folks, AND me seeing him make out publicly with guys and having guys stay the night with him. I kept saying it like it was a good thing that he could be comfortable being himself around friends, but really it was all to turn this chick off. She even checked with her best friend, who was also friends with another of his friends and got it confirmed.

From that point on, she had ZERO sexual interest in him. Keep in mind that everything I said was true and none of it was secret. HOWEVER it was still the most douchebag thing I have ever done to a friend (I can't remember doing anything worse), all because I wanted to keep him away from a chick that I had a crush on. I don't feel guilty about many things in my life but I STILL feel guilty about that.

In the end, it didn't amount to shit. Sure, I prevented him from fucking her, but I NEVER FUCKED HER EITHER. I pussed out and never made a move. So what was the point? It was like throwing away a friend's slice of pizza because you can't afford one of your own.

In the years that followed, I did try to make it up for him. Any time he was gaming a hot girl that had an plain/ugly friend, I was the guy who fell on the grenade for him (more times than I care to remember). Anytime he needed someone to give him cover so that he could cheat on his girlfriend, I was there.

After awhile we became a pretty good team and would talk the other up to different girls. I remember him running game on this tall gorgeous stripper just to set her up for me (it worked). He is also the only dude (aside from some group sex parties/gangbangs) that I have shared a girl with one night. We both gamed this chick back to a hotel room and passed her back and forth between us 5 or 6 times. Good times.

Then he got married and the party stopped.

BOOOOOOO

...not at you did at him getting married.

Seriously though, that's cool dude you know what you did and have the balls to admit / fix it and when you did it you felt bad after. Part of what pisses me off is that it just seems like these cunts don't even realize / acknowledge that what they're doing is so wack, dishonorable and anti-masculine, quite the opposite some of them are even kinda smug about it.

[Samseau]

Great story Joehoya. Can't believe this guy was such a horny player he would fuck anything, and then be the type who gets married. Care to elaborate on what made him pull the trigger?


I don't find what you did to be too objectionable, except for the fact that it was behind his back. I think the more "manly" thing to do would have been to tell your friend how you felt about that girl and request him to stay away.

[joehoya]

(08-29-2012 10:20 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Great story Joehoya. Can't believe this guy was such a horny player he would fuck anything, and then be the type who gets married. Care to elaborate on what made him pull the trigger?

I really don't know, man. She isn't nearly as hot as other girls has has been with. The chick is barely a 5 (probably closer to a 4), and that is only because she is not overweight. She is smart and fairly sexually agressive. Not just a slut, but more of a man-eater type.

He says that she was "the one", but that is bullshit. I have 3 theories:
1) He got tired of the game. The dude has been putting in work since AT LEAST 13 or 14. He actually got a girl pregnant at 14 (she didn't have the kid, though). Maybe after trying damn near every sexual act, he got bored.

2) The girl is more "alpha" than him. Most girls he has been with, regardless of how hot, he has been able to control COMPLETELY. This chick does her own thing and tells him such. Maybe that turns him on. She is also reasonably smart, not something I can say about many of his conquests.

3) Work. This is a big one. Before, he was a total slacker and had tons of time to game girls. Some years ago, he found a corporate job with EXCELLENT earning potential, but crazy hours (80 hour weeks are normal, 60 hour weeks are the minimum, and 100 hour weeks are not unheard of).

He is making a bunch more money, is more respected by his friends and family, BUT is too tired to chase pussy anymore. He and I used to troll the local stripclubs trying to pull a dancer on weeknights, when most normal people would have to be in bed because of work the next day. We were doing that shit multiple times a week, every week. No way could he keep that pace with the job he has now.

(08-29-2012 10:20 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

I don't find what you did to be too objectionable, except for the fact that it was behind his back. I think the more "manly" thing to do would have been to tell your friend how you felt about that girl and request him to stay away.

The reason why I didn't do that was because I was a COMPLETE pussy and too embarrassed to tell him. He not only would have backed off, but he would have encouraged me to actually ask her out (I never did). I was still in that "rejection is the end of the world" mode that most betas find themselves in.

I actually gave myself the excuse of "I don't want to ruin our friendship" for not pursuing the girl, even though I NEVER would have been friends with her if I didn't want to fuck her. By the time I had completely stepped out of my betatude and came back into town, some dude had already locked her down, and she really wasn't hot enough to try to break up their relationship.

[Samseau]

Quote:

3) Work. This is a big one. Before, he was a total slacker and had tons of time to game girls. Some years ago, he found a corporate job with EXCELLENT earning potential, but crazy hours (80 hour weeks are normal, 60 hour weeks are the minimum, and 100 hour weeks are not unheard of).

You'd think with all of that work and money, he would have had a hot wife. Yet, this story is all too common. Most guys love to believe in the fantasy of landing a good job so they can land a good wife. The truth is that a big job kills your time, and prevents you from keeping your game sharp enough to land a hot woman.

Quote:

The reason why I didn't do that was because I was a COMPLETE pussy and too embarrassed to tell him. He not only would have backed off, but he would have encouraged me to actually ask her out (I never did). I was still in that "rejection is the end of the world" mode that most betas find themselves in.

Well, now I understand why you feel guilty about it. Being afraid of rejection is the most beta trait one can have. I know, I've been there myself.

[void]

100 hour job.
a) is non productive after say 10-12 continous hours each day
b) would be like 14 hours a day, 7 days a week = no life
c) what does someone live for with such work hours. taking a relaxed shit at the end of the evening?
d) i see potential for an early death because of bad lifestyle. eat, sleep, workout will be really hard to pull off with this hours

[TheMan]

(08-30-2012 02:35 PM)void Wrote:  

100 hour job.
a) is non productive after say 10-12 continous hours each day
b) would be like 14 hours a day, 7 days a week = no life
c) what does someone live for with such work hours. taking a relaxed shit at the end of the evening?
d) i see potential for an early death because of bad lifestyle. eat, sleep, workout will be really hard to pull off with this hours

Good point.