There is no "right" or "wrong" answer. It all depends on each individual man, his game and the girl he is dealing with.
Just like the "indirect" vs "direct" debate, the answer is both. A man with strong social and sexual skills will know how use either option to guide the interaction in the way that he wants.
I'd like to respond:
Got it. Thanks for clarifying..
Let me respond:
Earlier I posted a few examples. Three of them were first dates with American girls. All three ended in bangs.
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Should we be buying appetizers on first dates with American girls?
It just depends.
Is your game strong enough to do it without giving up all your power in the negotiation?
Can you do it and still maintain your dominant "frame"?
Can you do it from a place of superiority rather than inferiority?
Do you want to be the dominant one in the interaction or are you okay with her thinking that she has some control?
Are you hungry? Can you afford it?
Those are the questions?
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Personally, sometimes I get an appetizer and sometimes I don't. It just depends on the situation.
Lately, I have been telling girls to eat something before the date.
Or, I tell them that we can just eat at my place.
Yes, of course..
"Game" is all about "feel"!
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For some reason I felt compelled to wrote this:
Some guys don't want to do it out of "principle".
Some guys don't care about any so called "principle".
Some guys give off a "provider" vibe.
Some guys give off a "lover" vibe.
Some guys use "provider" type game.
Some guys use "lover" type game.
Some guys do not recognize when a girl is taking advantage of them.
Some guys do.
Some guys are too cheap.
Some guys are too generous.
Some guys have strong enough game to the point where it doesn't really matter if they buy the appetizer or not.
I have been all of these guys.
Yes, my initial post was a little off base and too general!
I do think that some guys can maintain frame control whether they buy the appetizer or not.
This is very important!
Older women play little power games.
Younger girls appreciate a decent meal.
I do believe in "Game Minimalism". We should be trying to maximize our return with minimum effort. This stuff take time, money, energy. We should strive to be as efficient as possible.
When I drink with a girl, I try to drink a 5 dollar bottle of wine from Trader Joes. Its an organic syrah that I like. (I also try to date girls that live within 10 minutes of my house, do free dates with them, bang them when its convenient for me, etc., but that is another topic entirely)
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Edit: I almost deleted this post. Maybe, I should have stayed out of this thread!?!?! Most of my dates are with girls aged 18-21. The op is talking about dating girls in their late 20s...!?!?! I'm not trying to brag but I don't have much experience with that age group.
The difference between an 19 year old and 29 year old is vast.
Just like the "indirect" vs "direct" debate, the answer is both. A man with strong social and sexual skills will know how use either option to guide the interaction in the way that he wants.
I'd like to respond:
Quote: (10-06-2014 04:15 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:
The "No Appetizer" mindset is a guideline for the following conditions:
1. First date
2. American chick
That's all we're saying.
Got it. Thanks for clarifying..
Let me respond:
Earlier I posted a few examples. Three of them were first dates with American girls. All three ended in bangs.
-----
Should we be buying appetizers on first dates with American girls?
It just depends.
Is your game strong enough to do it without giving up all your power in the negotiation?
Can you do it and still maintain your dominant "frame"?
Can you do it from a place of superiority rather than inferiority?
Do you want to be the dominant one in the interaction or are you okay with her thinking that she has some control?
Are you hungry? Can you afford it?
Those are the questions?
-----
Personally, sometimes I get an appetizer and sometimes I don't. It just depends on the situation.
Lately, I have been telling girls to eat something before the date.
Or, I tell them that we can just eat at my place.
Quote: (10-06-2014 04:15 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:
A lot of this stuff, as you know well, comes down to the "feel" of the situation.
Yes, of course..
"Game" is all about "feel"!
-----
For some reason I felt compelled to wrote this:
Some guys don't want to do it out of "principle".
Some guys don't care about any so called "principle".
Some guys give off a "provider" vibe.
Some guys give off a "lover" vibe.
Some guys use "provider" type game.
Some guys use "lover" type game.
Some guys do not recognize when a girl is taking advantage of them.
Some guys do.
Some guys are too cheap.
Some guys are too generous.
Some guys have strong enough game to the point where it doesn't really matter if they buy the appetizer or not.
I have been all of these guys.
Quote: (10-06-2014 04:16 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:
The thread was more about frame control during the initial meeting.
Yes, my initial post was a little off base and too general!
I do think that some guys can maintain frame control whether they buy the appetizer or not.
Quote: (10-06-2014 05:09 PM)The Wire Wrote:
Quote: (10-06-2014 10:23 AM)Deluge Wrote:
How old are these girls who've done this to you guys? I only date 18-23 y.o's,
Good question. My case i've had the majority of woman in there late 20's pull this stunt.
This is very important!
Older women play little power games.
Younger girls appreciate a decent meal.
Quote: (10-06-2014 05:30 PM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:
Stop giving these ho something to drink.
We're going full minimalism on here.
I do believe in "Game Minimalism". We should be trying to maximize our return with minimum effort. This stuff take time, money, energy. We should strive to be as efficient as possible.
When I drink with a girl, I try to drink a 5 dollar bottle of wine from Trader Joes. Its an organic syrah that I like. (I also try to date girls that live within 10 minutes of my house, do free dates with them, bang them when its convenient for me, etc., but that is another topic entirely)
-----
Edit: I almost deleted this post. Maybe, I should have stayed out of this thread!?!?! Most of my dates are with girls aged 18-21. The op is talking about dating girls in their late 20s...!?!?! I'm not trying to brag but I don't have much experience with that age group.
The difference between an 19 year old and 29 year old is vast.