Quote: (10-19-2011 05:08 PM)Samseau Wrote:
When you see a black or hispanic in upper education, remember that they need to do around 35% less work than a white or asian guy does to get the same results in our "education system".
Hi there!
I'm Athlone. I'm one of those minorities in upper-education you're talking about. I currently attend an Ivy League school. I'm a little late to this one, but thought I'd jump in. I understand that you do not take my aforementioned academic credentials seriously and likely never will given my ethnicity, but I figured I could at the very least offer some perspective on this subject, which I like to call "privilege".
I will speak from experience when I say this: for every minority male here that you assume doesn't deserve an Ivy education, there are 2-3 white males who are here for reasons other than their academic merit.
I have several family members who are administrators at Ivy League schools and the elite prep schools in New England that feed students to them. They see the numbers.
The lowest scores in each incoming Ivy class are not the downtrodden affirmative action charity cases you portray. They are elite, upper-class whites (usually males) from elite prep schools with very strong pedigrees and sometimes (not always), legacy. These are kids who come in here with 22-24 ACT scores (average score at my school is about 32 out of 36) and coast right through admissions. Your low-stat, bottom-of-the-class admit is more than likely a WASP as opposed to a minority.
How do they get in? Golden handshakes and facetime. That is how this world works-facetime is their god, and a very generous one at that. It is a very small world up here, and they take full advantage of that.
These kids walk in here, dick around for four years, graduate with a 2.8-3.0, and within a year or two after graduation they're set to takeover dad's hedgefund (or walk into another nice position dad's friends have kept warm for him). That is the reality. They've had the road to the Ivies smoothed and laid out for them since childhood.
Have you ever wondered how Ivy League athletics work? They're interesting.
Football here is highly regulated. Recruits must come in with academic credentials tied to those of the regular student populace.
To do this, you have a band system, which categorizes recruits every year.
Band 1: These kids have to be close to the average for the student populace. On the new SAT, they'll usually score around 2000 and up. The school average is about 2100-2150, so these guys are pretty much on par with your normal student.
Band 2: This is where most kids in the class end up. Scores here come at around 1800-1900. This is good, though well below the school's average. Most of these kids, by their own admission(they joke about it often enough among themselves) would not have gotten into the school without football.
Band 3: The lowest band. Kids here score from 1600-1700 or so.
Coaches are required to limit Band 3 takes to only about 2-3 recruits per class(out of around 30-35). Band 2 might get around 16-18 guys, and the rest will be in Band 1.
I know who the "low band" recruits were on my team for several of the years before or after me.
Hint: Only one of them was black. None were Hispanic or Asian.
In fact, they were almost uniformly white (just like the team itself).
(for the record, I got a 2100 and walked onto the team after I was admitted).
This type of deal goes for other sports too. In fact, it has been argued that some sports at these elite schools (ex: sailing, equestrian, squash, etc) are mere affirmative action positions for the elite. Nobody else competes in them at a high enough level in prep school to actually go D1 (only the rich can afford them and elite private schools are usually the only ones that offer the activities to begin with), and the only D1 schools that compete seriously in these sports are elite (Ivies, NESCAC, and a couple of others).
So, if you're an upper class white american and you want to guarantee your kid a spot in the Ivies, what do you do? Aside from networking and handing out golden handshakes, you can also put them on a boat from age 10 and get them into competitive sailing at the prep school. Even if their scores are below average, you can bet they'll get in as a recruit.
Of course, if you stood any one of these beneficiaries next to me without knowing much else, you'd assume a fairly positive vision of them. They look like the all-american good-ole Ivy boys: white, clean cut, good-looking, athletic, fairly well-spoken in social gatherings, wealthy (and thus quite well dressed). Mom and Dad both look nice and all are super cordial and social. They come from the nicest towns and the nicest schools, have the nicest jobs and drive the nicest cars.
Me? Well, I'm black. I just look like your typical stereotype of the black athlete: dark skinned, high on muscle and testosterone. I certainly don't "look smart". My mother works for the government-I've never seen my father. We drive a relatively affordable Japanese import(a lesser known brand at that). I don't have a pedigree among the social elite, nor a father to give golden handshakes to people for me. Being not nearly as wealthy as these guys, I don't dress as nicely, which to the casual observer would just solidify the image: those kids MUST just be superior, right?
This negro clearly doesn't belong here. He doesn't dress right and his family has no real status or prestige.
Accordingly, most people expect nothing of me.
Of course, in reality, these "all-american" kids are cheating off of me in class and pulling quarterly GPAs almost a point below my own. For all of the praise these kids receive for their pedigree and for the sheer wealth they possess (much of which their families are spending filling university endowments and paying massive tuitions for exclusive private academies, often since the kids were in kindergarten), they still need to copy
my homework.
I can say concretely that they are not anymore academically sound than the vast majority of the other blacks on my team either, having seen examples of both their work. They know this, btw. Most of them aren't too arrogant about their position, and will admit their lack of academic acumen, going as far as to say they have no business in the ivies and "might not graduate"(though they always do, of course).
But everyone else will assume they are great, because they think just like you: those white kids belong here. They
look the part. These kids come from "good" families and just look all-american. Plus, whites always work harder to get here than minorities. Black, hispanic and native american kids are just here for charity-they don't really belong.
White is right...
right?
RIGHT???
You keep thinking that.