[Sonoma]

Unless I'm eating a shitton of potato/rice, it's really hard to get the caloric intake and the protein desired by being vegan. While heavy meat intake is bad, I have no interest in forfeiting the pleasure of steak.

Veganism is seen as a negative because you're signing your life over to another set of rules for little reason.

While the average vegan might be healthier than the average person, I think you can easily be healthy while still eating meat and not sucking the fun out of food.

[Guriko]

I have not been able to read through all of the posts yet, so I apologize in advance if this has already been posted.

I have stopped evaluating ‘-isms’ at face value and have started doing so on the basis of their membership. It is not that I do not like veganism, I do not like vegans. Have met quite a few and mostly the act with a chip on their shoulder coupled with an overly zealot righteous attitude about their choices in life against everybody else’s.

The same reasoning I apply to the Manosphere. I like it so much not because of its content. That is only a partial answer. I love it due to the members it attracts.

[Matsufubu]

If you could lose weight and live to a hundred by sucking dicks for the rest of your life, would you do it?

That's why I'm not vegan: there's more to life than lasting as long as possible.

[Leonard D Neubache]

This thread:

Vegan: Derpaderp derpamillion derps derp a derpathousand derps per derp!

Omnivore 1: "500 word reasoned argument.
Omnivore 2: "500 word reasoned argument.
Omnivore 3: "500 word reasoned argument.

Vegan: If you would just accept that Derpaderp derpamillion derps derp a derpathousand derps per derp then you would see that derpa derp deederpa derp!

Repeat for ten pages.

[roberto]

What the fuck is with Cowspiracy?

I think the real conspiracy is how watching it turns people into zombies who accept half truths and bad science as gospel.

I was talking to a middle class hipster guy the other day. 'Watch Cowspiracy maaan, you'll see'. Later on in the 'debate (predominately him shouting at me asking what gives me the right to eat meat [I said opposable thumbs ]) we got on to the subject of sustainability. He said eating pheasants was sustainable. Like the bloody things just grow wild in the woods. He had no idea that pheasants are raised (in the UK) to be shot, and that a massive amount of food and manpower goes into gamekeeping. Far more than the equivalent amount of energy required to rear a kilo of lamb.

That's the trouble with all these liberal types. They're too wishy-washy, unrealistic and utopian, and know sweet FA about how things really work. Yet they see fit to inflict their misguided beliefs upon the rest of us.

[TeutonicKnight]

Eating meat
is a yes.
To yourself
To your inner beast
To your masculinity
To your humanity
To your ancestors.

[FireStarter]

(05-24-2016 03:37 AM)tanner Wrote:  

The real problem is Animal Overpopulation in factory farms and the resources required to sustain them.

Thanks Tanner, you've inspired me to help the planet. I'm going to do my part in reducing the Animal Overpopulation by eating more of them.



That cow won't be destroying the Earth anymore.

Not on my watch. I can't do it alone though, I invite everyone to join me and eat more steaks so that, together, we can save the planet.

[shameus_o'reaaly]

Imitation meats. What the hell is the point?

Getting adequate protein can be timeconsuming for the majority of commuters who don't eat meat, but soya mince, quorn sausages and tofurkey seem like the more retarded compromise.
Every meat substitute is an exercise in pointless over-complicating. Check out the latest invention:How do you make vegetables bleed? New plant burger launched

You can eat fine and be healthy with peas, lentils, nuts, oils, seeds and brown rice etc, and there are an ample population of healthy vegetarians, so why go to this trouble:

Quote:

A new vegetarian patty has been created that smells like a beef burger and even bleeds like it – but it’s made entirely from plants.

Made from pea protein and with an injection of pulverised beetroot to replicate the blood, the Beyond Burger launches today at a Whole Foods store in Boulder, Colarado.
“A lot of people love to eat meat. What I’m doing is allowing them to eat more of what they love, more meat. It’s just meat from plants. That’s the only difference,” he told CNN.

I don't mind vegan evangelists, I've gone long periods without eating meat, but it's smarter, cheaper and simpler to just make a pea soup than a pea burger which you treat as meat. If being a vegan is more moral, why does it get treated like a lifestyle they're trying to lure people to follow?


On topic, meat-eating is often wasteful but that's carelessness on the part of the customer, it's not endemic. Get people to start buying brisket as well as sirloin, or trying rabbit, goat, calves liver, lamb's kidneys, oxtail. Eating meat-rich diets will probably be a thing of the past soon unless you raise your own chickens or fish, but the likely healthiest sustainable one would be meat, eggs and dairy in small, regular quantities, with second-class protein the rest of the time. I eat like this on cost grounds.
It's not new-prior to the introduction of widespread refrigeration, meat was occasional, usually just on a Sunday.

[Days of Broken Arrows]

I don't think a vegan diet is for everyone. People in the U.S. are all from different parts of the world originally and my feeling is our diets are usually best suited to the region from which our DNA originated.

This is why I think the vegan preaching annoys people. If we were all one homogeneous society maybe veganism would be a good idea. But from what I've read and observed, people from Nigeria (let's say) can't consume what someone from Ireland does and have that have exactly the same effect.

Even if you don't buy that concept (and some people don't), we're simply all different people period. What works for you might not work for me.

Case in point: My ex-wife went vegan two years ago. She saw a documentary on how chickens are kept and it disturbed her. However, in those past two years she's put on so much weight I didn't recognize her in recent online photos. When her weight goes up, she ends up with other health problems (high blood pressure, problems with her back, etc.). So what is the point in this?

If a diet is making you gain so much weight that your health is in jeopardy, I would say that maybe that diet isn't for you.

Conversely, I have a hard time digesting meat so I eat very little of it. I fare better this way. I don't gain weight at all sticking to fish (like salmon), salads, vegetables, yogurt and nuts. So this works for me.

Putting aside the moral issue of whether killing animals is OK, I don't think preaching to anyone what they should eat does any good. It's been said before, but I think once we removed morality from sex we left a void in the lives of the moralists. They had to preach about something because it's in their nature...and food became the cause du jour, pun intended.

[Chauncey]

Her name is Snow!

[JayR]

Bumping this thread with a personal story. I went plant-based (not vegan) 8 weeks ago solely for health reasons....but it's pretty cool and figured I'd share.

I'm a forum member of the relatively advanced age of 50+, and despite being a fit and trim dude, I recently learned I have heart disease and the dreaded LipoproteinA gene. LipoA is a dangerous lipid that clogs your arteries and makes you susceptible to heart attacks, strokes, and dementia, and it's estimated 1-in-5 people carry the gene. For some reason, it's not tested for in the normal cholesterol/lipid panel (unless you ask) -- probably because there is no cure for it and therefore no money to be made from pharma sales. Bob Harper of "Biggest Loser" fame has it, and nearly died at age 40 from a massive heart attack before being diagnosed (he only survived because he was at the gym near a defib machine).

http://people.com/bodies/bob-harper-hear...pped-dead/

So despite being an otherwise healthy dude, after learning about my LipoA gene and family history, my doc had me undergo a coronary artery scan for calcium deposits (heart clogs). My Agatson score from this test is what really freaked me out. Tim Russert had a score of 210 and keeled over dead. My result was higher (no doxx, but it was a lot higher, and higher is worse).

Fuck!

At a fit 6'/185, I have serious heart disease. Now what?

My doc told me to immediately taper off my TRT regimen (he does not want any exogenous hormones), and put me on a statin and aspirin. Much as I hate taking drugs, I don't want to end up like Russert, so I'm on Lipitor now, like a fuckin' geezer.

Dissatisfied with this diagnosis and wanting to fix my body, I immediately began researching my condition, which led me to this book, "Preventing and Reversing Heart Disease" by Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn:

https://www.amazon.com/Prevent-Reverse-H...=esselstyn

YAASSS! My coronary artery disease can not only be halted, it can be REVERSED through dietary changes! I went all in.

As of 9/6/17, I cut out meat, fish, and dairy, and went entirely whole-grain/plant-based (this is not vegan -- I can enjoy honey and figs that those freaks reject because bees and wasps are involved ).

It sucked at first, but...

As of today, I'm down 20 pounds and down 5% bodyfat from 185/18% to 165/13%. My bench is down slightly, my squats are up slightly, and my body-weight movements like chins, dips, jump-rope are way up. My cardio pace is through the roof with no additional effort. Most importantly, I feel great overall, and I look better in the mirror (1.5 chin is back to 1.0, skin is clearer, 1-pack is back to a 6-pack).

Is my heart unclogged? I hope so, but I don't really know.

The reasons are all in the linked-to book, but the only supplement I'm taking now is a sub-lingual B-12. All other nutrients are from the plant diet. You have to eat a LOT of food to do this and still lift heavy, but so far cutting out meat/dairy has not impacted my lifts.

[Praetor Lupus]

I don't have a problem with vegans per se. I just have a real issue with people preaching at me in general, and telling me what to eat in particular.

And everyone doing that happens to be a vegan.

[Australia Sucks]

That vegetarian patty sounds weird. If something is not meat why pretend it is?

[Laska]

^^Because if God made anything purely for our happiness, it's meat.

[Truth Tiger]

JayR, I'm glad you're still with us and experiencing improved health. However I doubt you're getting adequate nutrients from plants grown in depleted soil as the governments have known is the case since the 1930s. Look up Zelcorpion's threads on supplementation and be sure you have eliminated the 12 bad foods per my signature. You will want to get very familiar with your blood levels for various vitamins and minerals. You need to ground / earth. You need a far IR mat for recovery. Research Dr. Joel Wallach, N.D., and find out ways to taper fully off the pharma drug cocktail. Aspirin makes sense but statins will damage your body. After 50 men need more cholesterol not less. Also look up the blood type diet by Dr. D'Adamo, N.D. I'm an O and my diet necessarily has to differ from other types. I balance salmon, beef, and chicken as meat based protein sources and have 3-6 eggs a day, 50/50 raw/over easy. I'm mindful of consuming AGE via overly cooked / browned foods. I avoid most oils which cause oxidative damage to cells (i.e. inflammation and damage to blood vessels which is repaired by cholesterol causing blockages over time). Low-sugar green juices periodically. Maca powder in raw eggs + banana shakes. Our genetic predispositions and gene markers also matter and help modify our diets so good you've found this for yourself so far.

I've never done TRT and never will and will NEVER recommend it over natural methods which are safer and more effective.

Pharma (statins?! Holy shit!) is never the way to go for health and longevity. Also calcium and magnesium need to be taken in a closer to 1:1 ratio, not 2:1 or 4:1 as many supplements have. Most people get too little magnesium in their diets and an over-abundance of calcium. If you get muscle twitches or migraine headaches, you're almost certainly mag deficient.

Every man has to find the diet and lifestyle that works and it's easier with the tools we have available now.

Ref: early 40s previously fatigued, shingles at age 39, total testosterone under 300, extreme fatigue. Corrected in 1 year via natural means: stress reduction, diet, moderate exercise with full recovery time between workouts, quality supplements, earthing, etc.

[The Beast1]

@JayR, i'd be curious to see what your labs say after a 6 month diet change. Please get this checked again and post when you do. It's the only way to ensure your diet change actually worked.

[Truth Tiger]

+1 to TheBeast1, labs are essential. So is getting really good functional medicine advice. Check out Chris Kresser.

[zigZag]

Vegans are the western equivalent of fundamentalist Muslims in terms of Zeal and fanaticism. They are the whiniest and intolerant people i've come across. In my experience nowadays they all say "Hey i'm not one of those vegans that likes to try to convert people" But in reality they are. I don't think people have a problem with veganism... if you feel that works for you then go for it. The problem is with vegans and them being annoying douches who preach more than a church pastor and constantly complain about everything meat related.

[Johnnyvee]

The world`s foremost authority on diet,(In my opinion)
Dr. Loren Cordain on why you should avoid veganism/vegetarianism.

It basically boils down to nutrient deficiencies, but there is a lot to be said about how we grow food, and raise animals as well, that does not necessarily favour veganism which basically means massive grain production is necessary.
This does not have to be the case with animal feed if we do things right.

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

(12-10-2013 11:43 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

Soy.

This is the earliest soy reference I've seen, with the same usage and meaning as the current trendy word. I guess actually Gmanifesto has used it for many years, long before his usage of it on twitter sparked the current trend.

Still, it's interesting to see a current buzzword used 4 years earlier.

Most don't talk about this.

[HardcoreSexpatMotherfucker]

It is absolutly possible to get a full nutritional profile (including rare vitamins like B12) by eating only vegan. I haven't tried it yet, but plan to do.

[Filbert]

(12-11-2013 07:06 PM)killthosepuppys Wrote:  

imo ppl who consume animal products daily or even to every meal are stupid and delusional and it smells like a dog has been dead for 10 days after they take a shit

I agree with this bit - when on a vegetarian diet, your shit actually smells nice ))

[Conscious Pirate]

(11-10-2017 01:14 AM)Filbert Wrote:  

(12-11-2013 07:06 PM)killthosepuppys Wrote:  

imo ppl who consume animal products daily or even to every meal are stupid and delusional and it smells like a dog has been dead for 10 days after they take a shit

I agree with this bit - when on a vegetarian diet, your shit actually smells nice ))

I won't trust a man who's aftershit aura doesn't make me wince.

[Filbert]

(12-11-2013 04:28 AM)BIGINJAPAN Wrote:  

Also the notion that veganism is somehow good for the environment and not cruel is so far from the facts...

I've read somewhere that those who meditate forgo meat and fish b/c these things lower your consciousness. In meditation, you ascend in your consciousness, therefore you try to avoid anything that lowers it, including casual association with 'iguanas' )). Not b/c it's sinful to kill animals or whatever..

[Cumlluminates]

Moderation is always key, not veganism...