[XXL]

i'll give you my PERSONAL take on it

(07-04-2012 12:15 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

- The tough emotional cost of being in a cold selling like sales push. Some guys will deny that this exists, but once you step off the internet and into real life you have to deal with this, which makes me believe that the guys who are denying it are actually just theorizing on the internet.

it feels like that if go around and target hunt trying to score a cunt. but that's not helpful attitude. as soon as i catch myself doing that i slap myself in a face.

to me the whole point of talking to girls is to explore the options, see who's who, what's what, make a move without expecting it to go anyhere instead of deciding beforehand. some guys will deny that this exists, but once you come to grips of know what you like then it's "hey let's meet" frame, not "how can i get HER?". i feel relaxed and carefree because i also know that even if i do absolutely everything right in my knowledge of the game i still can't control how she will react to me. so.. sweet! "hello, i like YOU, i don't like YOU, but it's ok, are you beautiful polish girl? blablabla.. ".

the reason you feel that emotional stretch is that
- you feel sorry to be approaching in some subtle way. it's like "i'm doing my approach cause i think i'm suppose to".
or..
- you see approaching as walking around scanning environment like a leach, seeking to trick some girl into bed with you and being sad/angry/negative afterwards if that doesn't work. so you're kind of sold beforehand and start the chase too hard too early.
or..
- you take it too seriously. in the end it's just socializing.

(07-04-2012 12:15 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

- The cost of spending your day off wandering around the city center trying to cold sell your cock that you could have spent doing something that you actually enjoy.

the best answer, not surprisingly, gave:

(07-04-2012 01:23 PM)Giovonny, XXLs lost twin brother Wrote:  

Walking around the city for hours day gaming can be a waste of time.

But, day gaming as you are going about your normal business is a more productive option.

Be ready as soon as you walk out your front door. Bus, train, subway, coffee shop, cafe, restaurant, work, lunch break, smoke break, gym, grocery store, mall, sidewalk. You don't have to make time for day game. Just be ready to talk during the day.

of course. as i'm going about my stuff day by day i pass by enough girls to chat up right there. no need to even step out of the way unless i notice a very cute girl somewhere

(07-04-2012 12:15 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

- A lot of guys are not being real. They go out and project themselves as an awesome guy when they have only half developed themselves into a solid person. The woman subconsciously realises this just by looking into his eyes but can't rationalise it because he's saying awesome things so she later flakes.

that's why i'm into downplaying myself and self-deprecation humour. never impressing. never posing. congruence baby

(07-04-2012 12:15 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

- Day game will SKYROCKET your night game. It's more common to get rejected and flaked on during the day as opposed to night because the context isn't geared towards dating during the day time. People are out doing something.

true. i've learned the game in daytime interactions, cold, warm and social circle. normal situations and no alkohol makes the socializing is real and authentic. every little thing is noticed. social intuition gets sharp as fuck. nightime is like a caricature of daytime.

[Juan Antonio]

I'm convinced it's all a numbers game.

Day game is a lot like sales/marketing. There's a concept called "funneling" and "prospecting" which is something that is seen a lot in the dating scene but many people seem to not recognise which leads to frustration.

The idea is to collect numbers in bulk, text them all and see who responds. The ones who convert are your customers

Eventually, you'll have so many customers that you will develop an abundance mindset and not worry about the ones that don't convert.

There's also a concept called "customer retention" which is essentially "relationship management."

We're a bit like marketers scamming clients into believing that our shit doesn't stink, when in reality, we're scamming them for their pussies.

There's a ton of similarities between sales and pickup. I used to do door to door sales. In sales, it's all about having a great attitude when you're out there and staying positive while use your personality. Game is no different. It's all a numbers game in the end and great salesmen/players have better success rate that's all.

[Noir]

I think you guys are overanalyzing this whole thing. I personally don't like to categorize "day game" in the same manner with going out and being a salesman or whatever.

I just step out of my door to go to class/gym/for a walk and I'll talk to whichever woman I see on the way I think is attractive. I don't leave my house specifically to talk to women.. I'm on my way somewhere but if I see what I like I'll approach. Not to count the number and make statistics or to compare it with night game and shit. No, I do it because it's during my daily routine and I'm fitting that shit in.

As for pulling it off, its all about being easy going and having good banter/intellectuality depending on the woman. Open normally, she's just a woman, not your boyhood idol. Be cool.

[Deb Auchery]

(07-05-2012 11:02 AM)Kikz Wrote:  

I think you guys are overanalyzing this whole thing. I personally don't like to categorize "day game" in the same manner with going out and being a salesman or whatever.

I just step out of my door to go to class/gym/for a walk and I'll talk to whichever woman I see on the way I think is attractive. I don't leave my house specifically to talk to women.. I'm on my way somewhere but if I see what I like I'll approach. Not to count the number and make statistics or to compare it with night game and shit. No, I do it because it's during my daily routine and I'm fitting that shit in.

As for pulling it off, its all about being easy going and having good banter/intellectuality depending on the woman. Open normally, she's just a woman, not your boyhood idol. Be cool.

I'm the same. But you have to realise some guys on here take day game seriously, very seriously

[Noir]

(07-05-2012 11:06 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

(07-05-2012 11:02 AM)Kikz Wrote:  

I think you guys are overanalyzing this whole thing. I personally don't like to categorize "day game" in the same manner with going out and being a salesman or whatever.

I just step out of my door to go to class/gym/for a walk and I'll talk to whichever woman I see on the way I think is attractive. I don't leave my house specifically to talk to women.. I'm on my way somewhere but if I see what I like I'll approach. Not to count the number and make statistics or to compare it with night game and shit. No, I do it because it's during my daily routine and I'm fitting that shit in.

As for pulling it off, its all about being easy going and having good banter/intellectuality depending on the woman. Open normally, she's just a woman, not your boyhood idol. Be cool.

I'm the same. But you have to realise some guys on here take day game seriously, very seriously

I understand that, I used to as well. The more you get into that headspace and put so much value upon those interactions the more you complicate things in your mind, therefore higher chance of fucking your shit up.

[Deb Auchery]

Well I agree with you, I would think it would make sense to just take a relaxed approach to things, have a drink in a bar with your friends, see how the night evolves. Or just concentrate on meeting new people through social events etc.

Talk to girls in the street for sure, if a girl gives you an IOI you must act, but I don't think organised gaming is worth the time. You could achieve the same results going to Salsa class or something.

[OGNorCal707]

I think the best spots for day game are outdoor day time festivals and events, it kind of depends on the city and town that you live in, whether or not there are many of these types of events to hit up. San Francisco is a good example, there are shit tons of outdoor events during the summer time, street parades, neighborhood festivals, etc. Some that come to mind are the Bay to Breakers race, the Northbeach Festival, Haight St. Fair, Stern Grove Music fest, etc.

Basically it's a festive atmosphere during the day, there are shit tons of women out (multiple targets to pursue), people are drinking beer, in a good mood, and it's almost like a "night game vibe" during the daytime. Women are going to be much more open to the approach in these types of situations, instead of being a "random creeper", you're just a friendly guy having a good time.

I went through a phase a couple years ago when I did a decent amount of day game, mostly at the grocery store, got some numbers, but they all flaked. I definitely think day game is harder, because it's not a context (like a bar) where people go to specifically to be social, have fun, and meet new people. Factor out the alcohol and consider that a lot of women are seriously trying to go about there day and are on the move running errands, and the logistics are definitely working against you to an extent.

I think 1 out of 10 approaches to get a date isn't bad at all, if it was 1 out of 10 approaches just to get a phone number, than I'd say that's pretty weak. I never kept count of my approach to # close ratio, but I'd say I probably got 5 phone numbers from 10 approaches, but the vast majority of those ended up flaking.

Oh yeah and it's funny because Deb reminds me a lot of a good friend of mine, he's 6 ft. 5 in., and basically has male model looks. The guy gets laid like a champ and constantly has women approaching him or giving all the IOI's for an approach invitation. My buddy is a cool guy and ultimately a nice guy, but he's an arrogant, egotistical fuck, and it gets really old after a while. That's great for guys like my friend and Deb that they were blessed with great height and looks, but that's akin to winning the genetic lottery. You did nothing to earn that, you were just lucky, so instead of being a douche and rubbing it into other peoples faces, why don't you be humble and realize how lucky you are.

No one likes a guy who brags, especially when they did nothing to deserve it. Guys like Roosh came up in the trenches and had to struggle, suffer, and persevere to become better men. They earned that shit. When my buddy brags, all I can do is shake my head, and think if you only knew....

[Roosh]

OG: Deb is bordering on game denialism at this point.

Quote:

I would think it would make sense to just take a relaxed approach to things, have a drink in a bar with your friends, see how the night evolves.

This is something a girl would say when giving advice to a beta.

[WestCoast]

Ha. He has "good looking dude syndrome" where he believes it's just as easy for everyone else. It's not game denialism or troll behavior. He has never been ugly before.

I used to be a 2. Maybe even a 1. (acne, 110 lbs, homeless, broke, no threads, ugly haircut) So I saw changes as i became "handsome" and know how much easier it is to pull when you look like a rockstar. It's tough for him to "live a day in an ugly man's shoes" because it never happened before.

Deb put on clothes 2 sizes too big, put fake acne all over your face, fuck up your hair, wear cheap ass clothes, now try your same approach should ruin your percentages.

(07-05-2012 12:19 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

OG: Deb is bordering on game denialism at this point.

Quote:

I would think it would make sense to just take a relaxed approach to things, have a drink in a bar with your friends, see how the night evolves.

This is something a girl would say when giving advice to a beta.

[Juan Antonio]

Ive been fiddling around with alot of my numbers recently. Trying out some anti-flakage techniques, time bridging, text game and soon to be phone game.

One thing that strikes me is Paul Janka's system: get around 40 numbers a week in around 60-90 seconds. Text game them all, find out who the solids are and then get them back to your house and fuck them.

Now, I've done the 60-90 second number close on several occasions. They always respond to text messages (If I open direct), but its always a bit tricky to get them to meet up for the day2. For obvious reasons - lack of rapport etc.

However, I've found that time bridging helps massively with flakes. So perhaps the 60-90 second close with a time bridge could lead to dates. I'm still experimenting with this stuff, but am actually focusing on instant dates at the moment.

However, just wanted to find out if any of you implement this system, and if not, what would the more experienced guys think of this system?

Ive tried the 60-90 second nclose with an indirect opener. 100% flake rate. However, Janka says open direct. So, I started testing it out direct. I could of got two D2s out of it, but the logistics were messed up. (One girl was in another city that I went to game too, and the other one text me for a meet up when I was in another city.)

So, 90 second number close, how likely is it to be solid?

I'm always in a constant battle with myself. Do I stay inset for a long time and build alot of comfort? Or do I run around getting loads and loads of numbers?

[Giovonny]

(07-05-2012 12:44 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

Do I stay inset for a long time and build alot of comfort? Or do I run around getting loads and loads of numbers?

I think quality is better then quantity when it comes to getting numbers.

I sed to get alot of numbers but most of them flaked. Now, I push as far as I can before even asking for her number. Go for a makeout, touch her, escalate, etc. The further you can push it in that first interaction, the more memorable you are to her.

Collecting numbers never got me alot of pussy. Making connections with girls did.

But, it always depends...

if the girl was walking and seemed to be in a rush, I kept things short and sweet.

if the girl stops and commits to the conversation and wants to talk, I will push for more connection.

[Deb Auchery]

(07-05-2012 12:19 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

OG: Deb is bordering on game denialism at this point.

Quote:

I would think it would make sense to just take a relaxed approach to things, have a drink in a bar with your friends, see how the night evolves.

This is something a girl would say when giving advice to a beta.

I must admit I don't know a lot about game, but one golden motto that I've heard repeatedly is "always be having fun"

The op does not appear to be having fun, packing sandwiches then heading out with other "gamers" into the city, crying in Starbucks and wondering where everything went wrong, hating the successful gamers.

Where's the fun in that?

[OGNorCal707]

(07-05-2012 01:03 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

I must admit I don't know a lot about game, but one golden motto that I've heard repeatedly is "always be having fun"

The op does not appear to be having fun, packing sandwiches then heading out with other "gamers" into the city, crying in Starbucks and wondering where everything went wrong, hating the successful gamers.

Where's the fun in that?

I partially agree with you, I think it's important to have fun and project a positive vibe, and it sounds like the OP might be approaching this the wrong way, or may need to adjust some elements of his game. However, I never got anything out of his posts that indicates that he's "hating the successful gamers." I mostly skimmed his posts because they were so long, so maybe I missed something, but I think you maybe making mountains out of molehills playa.

[Deb Auchery]

(07-05-2012 01:14 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

(07-05-2012 01:03 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

I must admit I don't know a lot about game, but one golden motto that I've heard repeatedly is "always be having fun"

The op does not appear to be having fun, packing sandwiches then heading out with other "gamers" into the city, crying in Starbucks and wondering where everything went wrong, hating the successful gamers.

Where's the fun in that?

I partially agree with you, I think it's important to have fun and project a positive vibe, and it sounds like the OP might be approaching this the wrong way, or may need to adjust some elements of his game. However, I never got anything out of his posts that indicates that he's "hating the successful gamers." I mostly skimmed his posts because they were so long, so maybe I missed something, but I think you maybe making mountains out of molehills playa.

Look for the part where he Is saying players are being fake etc

[Juan Antonio]

Let's look at some more numbers.

Commercial day game PUA Tom Torero (daygame.com) revealed he had 41 lays from 482 numbers in 2011.

Assuming he gets numbers from 1 in 3 approaches, that's ~ 41 lays / 1500 approaches or 1 lay per 37 approaches. And we don't know whether all these lays were exclusively from day game, so the ratio could be closer to 1 lay per 50 approaches.

Janka claims an 11% number to bang conversion ratio. Again, assuming he gets a number from 1 in 3 approaches, that's about 1 lay per 30 approaches.

What would the equivalent ratio be with night game? Would an average guy need to approach 30 girls in a bar or club (over the course of several nights) to find 1 girl to go home with him?

Is night game more efficient than day game?

[WestCoast]

Yeah I'll take deb's side on that comment if you run "happy person game". That's much more my style, I don't run "angry/rape game" too incongruent with my personality.

I am starting to think what deb means is "o out and have fun don't try to game a girl like she's a school test".

My guess based in his posts, deb is a good looking tall dude who runs "happy social guy game". This compares to someone like MikeCF who sounds like a good looking military guy game. While roosh runs "scientist political game" where he thinks out exactly what the correct word/phrase he will use, pin pointing his tone etc.

Also, night game is "faster" than day game, conversion is probably higher ony because it is more okay to touch them immediately.

[Samseau]

(07-05-2012 12:44 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

Ive been fiddling around with alot of my numbers recently. Trying out some anti-flakage techniques, time bridging, text game and soon to be phone game.

One thing that strikes me is Paul Janka's system: get around 40 numbers a week in around 60-90 seconds. Text game them all, find out who the solids are and then get them back to your house and fuck them.

Now, I've done the 60-90 second number close on several occasions. They always respond to text messages (If I open direct), but its always a bit tricky to get them to meet up for the day2. For obvious reasons - lack of rapport etc.

However, I've found that time bridging helps massively with flakes. So perhaps the 60-90 second close with a time bridge could lead to dates. I'm still experimenting with this stuff, but am actually focusing on instant dates at the moment.

However, just wanted to find out if any of you implement this system, and if not, what would the more experienced guys think of this system?

Ive tried the 60-90 second nclose with an indirect opener. 100% flake rate. However, Janka says open direct. So, I started testing it out direct. I could of got two D2s out of it, but the logistics were messed up. (One girl was in another city that I went to game too, and the other one text me for a meet up when I was in another city.)

So, 90 second number close, how likely is it to be solid?

I'm always in a constant battle with myself. Do I stay inset for a long time and build alot of comfort? Or do I run around getting loads and loads of numbers?

What works BEST for Paul Janka will not work for you.

What works BEST for Roosh will not work for me.


Basic fundamental principle of game is that every man must use different playstyles to achieve maximum results.

There is no "one style of game to rule them all" bullshit.

The best game for a man is always relative to the man.


However, that does not mean you cannot learn from Paul Janka or Roosh or anyone else who is successful.

Figure out what is working for them and apply it to your own situation.



There's basically two ways I've seen people do daygame:


1. Number-crunching.

Go out, talk to a girl for 5-10 minutes, get her number. Mass-text/call and go out on dates for the bang.

2. Insta-dates

Find a girl, take her somewhere for a quick drink or other activity. Try to transition to your place and bang.


Roosh's Day-Bang method is a combination of the two, but it is still number-crunching at it's core. He advocates a bunch of methods to help reduce flaking, such as GULNAC and fifteen minute conversations, but elderly chat doesn't work for me.

Whenever I got started with elderly chat, I found it damn near impossible to transition out of it. I would sometimes still get those 10-15 minute conversations, but girls would almost never bite on my big bait.


Then you got guys like Justin Wayne who advocate the insta-date > Bang, which honestly sounds more appealing to me since it mirrors how I do my night game.

But I've also had a two-hour coffee date with a girl that's gone nowhere, and I realize there needs to be a more stringent method of sorting through girls.


Reading this thread has given a bunch of ideas and a thirst for knowledge, however, I definitely want to try some new daygame ideas...

[Deb Auchery]

(07-05-2012 01:42 PM)WestCoast Wrote:  

Yeah I'll take deb's side on that comment if you run "happy person game". That's much more my style, I don't run "angry/rape game" too incongruent with my personality.

I am starting to think what deb means is "o out and have fun don't try to game a girl like she's a school test".

My guess based in his posts, deb is a good looking tall dude who runs "happy social guy game". This compares to someone like MikeCF who sounds like a good looking military guy game. While roosh runs "scientist political game" where he thinks out exactly what the correct word/phrase he will use, pin pointing his tone etc.

Also, night game is "faster" than day game, conversion is probably higher ony because it is more okay to touch them immediately.

Yes I run happy social game indeed, I feel at my most confident when in with my friends in the street hitting on girls.

For those who think that i'm the type of guy that has always done well with women this is not the case.

When I was a youth I was very skinny and underdeveloped, I didn't hit puberty until I was 17, I managed to lose my virginity at this time, but after that I was getting laid once a year if I was lucky. Also had a lot of social anxities, couldn't even talk to girls without breaking out in a sweat

Had a lot of growing pains when I was 17 in a small town in England. I went from being a very skinny kid of average height, to a very tall skinny man. When I was 19, I was 6'6" but about 150lbs!. I put up with a lot of shit, got called "stick", "rake", "pin man" I was the butt of many jokes. Also even though I was 19 or 20, despite my height, I looked about 14.

I went from being quite a sociable kid to a bit of a loner, there were times that I did not leave the house for two weeks at a time, just immersed myself in music.

I think between the ages of 17 and 22 I only had sex with 3 girls. I was a good looking guy, but girls couldn't see past my waif like appearance, hunched over, black clothes etc

At 22 I got in with the wrong crowd I started messing around with drugs, just about every drug, coke, pills, speed, mescalin, weed, mdma, mushrooms. I was watching people dying around me

Then after a heinous trip on magic mushrooms(witnessed a car crash) I decided to get the hell out of dodge and moved to the city. I got a job, started getting my act together. I started to go to the gym and fill out a bit, and gradually became more successful with women.

So these days I am pretty successful with women(although I can at times be shy) but when I was younger I went through a lot of pain seeing all my friends with girls etc, and I couldn't get shit

[XXL]

(07-05-2012 12:44 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:  

I'm always in a constant battle with myself. Do I stay inset for a long time and build alot of comfort? Or do I run around getting loads and loads of numbers?

try both and see what's better to you. we can give you you different schools of thought cause guys have different styles but essentially it's up to you to find your own way that fits you best.

i prefer longer arousing interactions. i learned it the hard way. the exact thing that stood in my own way was myself and my stupid habit of willingly walking away from my interactions with flaky numbers. now i know that i can't really turn on a girl to the point of enthusiasm and excitement with 1-3 minutes interactions. if talk to the girl long enough she will relax with me, open up to me, let me in her space, allow herself to be excited and aroused and eventually she enjoys that she will enthusiastically comply with me kissing her, leading her around, going on a date, going home. but that's just me.

[WestCoast]

Yep guessed so.

I think i'm in a weird position to be able to tell what kind of game a dude runs just by his typing and comments, ha.

Anyway slay on and remember 1/10 date is not bad in the USA for a lot of guys. For your level of game/looks/location and what have you, 1/10 may be awful.

This is no different than pulling 1 make out session a month at a club when you first start "game". Now that would be an embarrassment for my Standards but I was there before. Shit, I can't remember the last time I went out and DID NOT get digits/a make out. But that was certainly me 5 years ago, failing left and right.

(07-05-2012 02:15 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

(07-05-2012 01:42 PM)WestCoast Wrote:  

Yeah I'll take deb's side on that comment if you run "happy person game". That's much more my style, I don't run "angry/rape game" too incongruent with my personality.

I am starting to think what deb means is "o out and have fun don't try to game a girl like she's a school test".

My guess based in his posts, deb is a good looking tall dude who runs "happy social guy game". This compares to someone like MikeCF who sounds like a good looking military guy game. While roosh runs "scientist political game" where he thinks out exactly what the correct word/phrase he will use, pin pointing his tone etc.

Also, night game is "faster" than day game, conversion is probably higher ony because it is more okay to touch them immediately.

Yes I run happy social game indeed, I feel at my most confident when in with my friends in the street hitting on girls.

For those who think that i'm the type of guy that has always done well with women this is not the case.

When I was a youth I was very skinny and underdeveloped, I didn't hit puberty until I was 17, I managed to lose my virginity at this time, but after that I was getting laid once a year if I was lucky.

Had a lot of growing pains when I was 17 in a small town in England. I went from being a very skinny kid of average height, to a very tall skinny man. When I was 19, I was 6'6" but about 150lbs!. I put up with a lot of shit, got called "stick", "rake", "pin man" I was the butt of many jokes. Also even though I was 19 or 20, despite my height, I looked about 14.

I went from being quite a sociable kid to a bit of a loner, there were times that I did not leave the house for two weeks at a time, just immersed myself in music.

I think between the ages of 17 and 22 I only had sex with 3 girls. I was a good looking guy, but girls couldn't see past my waif like appearance, hunched over, black clothes etc

At 22 I got in with the wrong crowd I started messing around with drugs, just about every drug, coke, pills, speed, mescalin, weed, mdma, mushrooms. I was watching people dying around me

Then after a heinous trip on magic mushrooms(witnessed a car crash) I decided to get the hell out of dodge and moved to the city. I got a job, started getting my act together. I started to go to the gym and fill out a bit, and gradually became more successful with women.

So these days I am pretty successful with women(although I can at times be shy) but when I was younger I went through a lot of pain seeing all my friends with girls etc, and I couldn't get shit

[Deb Auchery]

Yeah I mean I did alright in London, but would never hit on girls in the street. I mostly found girls on the internet, and also bars/clubs. To be honest I enjoyed internet hunting the best, there is this one site that I cleared up on called clicktonight.com, full of absolute slags, but also some russian/swedish immigrants fresh off the boat. I cleaned up. Then there was beautifulpeople.com, and also Gumtree which is the European equivalent of Craigslist. There was a section called "casual relationships" I put ads on there saying something like "Tall, dark, English Gent, new in London looking for a pretty girl for uncomplicated fun. I got loads of replies from hot E Europeans fresh off the boat, that's when I started finding the bars in town that were close English schools, as many of them came to London to study English. Fun times

[WestCoast]

Nice man, good work.

Try to run day game in Los Angeles... That place makes me wonder if I have any game at all!

(07-05-2012 02:34 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

Yeah I mean I did alright in London, but would never hit on girls in the street. I mostly found girls on the internet, and also bars/clubs. To be honest I enjoyed internet hunting the best, there is this one site that I cleared up on called clicktonight.com, full of absolute slags, but also some russian/swedish immigrants fresh off the boat. I cleaned up. Then there was beautifulpeople.com, and also Gumtree which is the European equivalent of Craigslist. There was a section called "casual relationships" I put ads on there saying something like "Tall, dark, English Gent, new in London looking for a pretty girl for uncomplicated fun. I got loads of replies from hot E Europeans fresh off the boat, that's when I started finding the bars in town that were close English schools, as many of them came to London to study English. Fun times

[Spartan]

I think i'm using the "eye test" now as a way to sort through girls based on advice I got on this forum.
people's pupils dilate when they are attracted to you. so after 2 minutes of conversation you can see if they are interested. getting a smile and body language IOIs helps too.

i've spent 1 hour instadates that go nowhere and 3 minutes street approaches that translate. not doing these long interactions anymore... especially cuz you can't really run GALNUC and stuff on girls running errands or waiting for a bus (3mins average interaction) but these are usually the hottest girls.(my status as a foreigner and the lack of locals running day game means I stand out enough to be memorable).

[Jalouse]

I'm pretty certain the OP is in London which is a good place to Daygame because there are lots of high traffic spots with pretty girls around and if you have the balls you will not struggle to approach 10 girls a day, the downside is that there are lots of guys doing daygame there.

Samseau gave great advice above that it is down to you so don't focus so much on other guys achievements, it's no point getting too geeky about it i.e I have to approach 20 girls to get a phone number and then go on 10 dates to get a lay, with this approach you're missing the connection that happens between you and the girl which is the most important thing that moves it along.

Some guys say that they see no improvement in their flake rate when they spend a longer period of time with the girl, well this is definitely telling you something if it happens consistently. If the girl only spends a minute with you then a flake is understandable because she really doesn't know much about you but if she spends 3 hours with you and then still most likely flakes she's had a much longer of period of time to judge you and she's decided that you're not that interesting to follow up with.

[Hannibal]

Not every man is the same when it comes to social interaction. The guys who find it draining to constantly socialize (myself included) are probably introverted or jaded as hell.

The guys who go out there day in and day out to play the numbers game are the ones who should be getting praise for their efforts, not criticized. Especially if they find it exhausting to do so, they're committed.

I've talked to plenty of naturals before and the problem is that not even they know how they do what they do to get chicks. A naturally attractive guy is as solipsistic as most American women, they don't empathize for shit and they don't see why it's so hard for everyone else out there to get laid. It's really gay when my friends get into discussions about picking up chicks because the guys who get laid the most without trying think they have a PhD in pussy broscience. They believe in some really beta shit but they still act alpha.

Last guy I asked about how he got laid all the time, he told me "If you stop actively looking for pussy, you'll probably find it". This is the same guy who sees no problem with shitting where he eats (church, social circle, work, etc). He doesn't go out and "game", he doesn't "sarge", he just goes out with his friends (or alone) and gets laid with seemingly little effort. Then he might brag about it to his friends. Last I heard, he was at over 100 lays and he started when he was 13.

I've pulled off some flawless stuff that impressed a few of my friends who are naturals, but that's basically because I was acting like a textbook alpha male. It took a conscious, concentrated effort to do so.