[j r]

(06-04-2012 03:18 PM)ATTA Wrote:  

I'm lulz-ing up a storm. Here is a great study that came out that pokes a gaping hole into your inaccurate observation. Enjoy. And if that ain't enough I can link you a whole bunch more. Can do it for dayz.https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordp...inderm.pdf

What exactly in that article is disproving something that I said? Did I say that I don't believe in the heritability of IQ? Did I say I don't believe that you can make statistically significant observations across population groups? None of that is HBD.

The difference between HBD and actual evolutionary biology/psychology is like the difference between astrology and astronomy.

[Excelsior]

This is a big reason why I no longer read Heartiste and IMF as often as I once did (they were some of my main sources when I first got into game). While they occasionally can make good points that are valuable, it is difficult to support people that maintain such open hostility to you and people who look like you. Granted, not all of the users in these parts of the manosphere fit this bill, but the massive contingent of militant, nationalist, and often frustrated beta-types can color one's perception of a place quite clearly.

Why: And far as why this racism is so widespread, you can basically call it a self-defense mechanism, or (as others have pointed out here) another manifestation of sexual competition. These guys feel marginalized and it helps to be able to look down on other races of men in the wake of what they feel is an "onslaught" on their own manhood (read: minorities more competitive, declining white privilege, etc). Many of their claims are irrelevant and refutable, but that is beside the point-these guys feel like they're losing (and many of them really are losers), and this is all they can hold onto. They feel they're losing their ability to compete, and minorities (particularly blacks, but hispanics as well) are a convenient scapegoat for this.

Who: Blacks are perceived as the greatest threat to them, so they get the most flack. I've read of OneSTDV and several other dudes in the HBD-Sphere writing of how they actually lost sleep and got sick over the idea of a white woman having sex with a black man. No exaggeration-they actually get sick over the thought of any incidence of this type of relationship occurring.

Thousands of instances of this occur in the United States everyday (black + white interracial pairings are among the fastest growing in the country), nevermind the rest of the world. How insecure do you have to be to actually let something like this (the sexual choices of completely unrelated people) make you physically ill?
HBD-insecure, that's how.

But Men Are Naturally Competitive: Yeah, men are all naturally sexually competitive, but these guys take it to a whole new level. To use one example, blacks have often been at a very strong sexually competitive disadvantage with white men in the USA, a disadvantage that goes back to the days of slavery (when white men got first dibs on black females, could regularly separate black men from their women and subsequently rape/impregnate them with impunity) and continues to this day. This is without even mentioning the huge advantage lighter white men enjoy in large swaths of the world that we often consider full of quality women (ex: Just about all of Asia and Latin America).

In theory, blacks have plenty of reason to curl up until a little butthurt ball and cry about it (and, if you read what I wrote in that link, so do Asian American men), but I just don't see the same absurd levels of fuckery and bitchery from them as I do from these HBD types. The disadvantage is a hurdle and a frustrating one, but we deal with it. The fact that white men may have greater average levels of success with many types of women (including those of my own race) is not going make me ill. I'm not going to go cry and lose sleep because there are white dudes fucking girls who wouldn't give me the time of day in large part due to my race.
If I did do that, I'd never sleep and I'd be standing in a puddle 24/7, especially on the particular campus I'm on. You've just got to be more secure than this-find people who do like you and stick to them. Get in where you fit in.

The Endgame: Regardless, the particular white men who are of this insecure, "marginalized" kind are becoming more common in some parts of the manosphere (particularly those linked closely to HBD, of which there are increasingly many). As we mentioned, they have already largely taken over sites like Heartiste, and they're using game as a cover for their insecurities. For them, this is about more than just getting better with women and improving their romantic lives via knowledge. As far as they are concerned, they're engaged in a racial struggle, one in which they "take back" their society-combating feminism is just one part of this "American reconquista". The others involve re-marginalizing the "less civilized" elements of the society (read: "NAMs", non-asian minorities) and making it a better place for white men. When they say they want a patriarchy to return, they're not talking about rule by patriarchs (fathers). They want rule by white patriarchs. If they could hit a button and go back to 1950, they would.

If you're black or a non-white hispanic, approach these parts of the manosphere with caution and know that though you agree on some basic points (we're all denizens of the manosphere as a whole after all), you are still their enemy. They do not see you as equals-you are part of the problem as far as they are concerned.

[Samseau]

Everyone makes racial generalizations. The ones who say they don't are liars.


The "HBD" is a bunch of bullshit; why coin a term to make legitimate the claim that races are different? I think the term "race realism" is more accurate, but since there are tons of white nationalists out there the sensible white people have to come up with a less offensive term.

Whatever, I just keep it real. The best dancers I know are black. The smartest mathmaticians and programmers I know are asians. The richest guys I know are Jews. The most creative guys I know are white. Surprise surprise.

[Scarlet_Terror]

Quote:

So we should base public policy around individuals? Get real, dude.

Yes. Equality of opportunity. That means no affirmative action or quotas. If anything, some could argue race-realism justifies AA and public housing projects.

[j r]

(06-04-2012 03:44 PM)Scarlet_Terror Wrote:  

Quote:

So we should base public policy around individuals? Get real, dude.

Yes. Equality of opportunity. That means no affirmative action or quotas. If anything, some could argue race-realism justifies AA and public housing projects.

Yeah, sure. You could argue that if you were to ignore everything that we know about actual history, but that's the problem with HBD or race realism or whatever you want to call it.

And just to be clear here, the whole notion that you have to make a choice between political correctness and HBD, or whatever, is completely false. They are both bullshit ideologies.

[Scarlet_Terror]

It's funny. Living in DC makes you both more and less racist at the same time.

[MikeCF]

I don't have any problems with black guys - even the "young thugs" like Trayvon.

Look at George Zimmerman.

That's what guys posting on HBD message boards look like.

As I say, again and again, hit the gym. Put on some muscle. Learn how to box. Get punched a few hundred times.

You'll soon have few problems with "AMOGs," "black thugs," or other threatening male types.

[speakeasy]

@Athlone

I had never heard of that blogger OneSTDV. I just took a look at his blog and some of the comments and WOW. Of course he's blog-rolled to Roissy/Heartiste. Look at this little gem:

Quote:

This is one reason that I've been a climber and a kayaker and just general outdoorsman for over 30 years now; the lack of "DIE-versity" in the outdoor community appeals to me. When I hike into the woods, the last thing that I want to see-besides a Grizzly- is a ghetto stooge! Or a transgendered feminist, or "people of color", what the Hell is that supposed to mean anyway?

Yep, I'm thrilled at the lack of variety in the outdoor scene, love, love, love, love it! I love going and climbing and being around other white people, so shoot me! Besides, in my 30 years of doing it, I've only seen a couple of black folk attempting it. They seem to be afraid of the height?

I'm glad that Roosh's stuff has pretty much avoided being taken over by the racist crowd, even though there's some of them clearly lurking amongst us.

[Parlay44]

(06-04-2012 01:41 PM)j r Wrote:  

Here's the other thing. Roissy's blog always got a strange mix of players and frustrated betas. The players tend not to care too much about race, but for the frustrated betas it becomes just another way that society has failed them.

Players don't care about race because they're not looking for anything long term ...ahem marriage. I believe frustrated betas obsess over race because they want to marry someone that their parents and family approve of. Once you stop caring what people think you're free to date whoever you want.

Family tends to directly or indirectly influence who you date in order to pass on their same values, religion, culture or whatever. Once you get over 30 they stop giving a shit and just want to see you get married before they die.

Dealing with family bs is mentally exhausting. I told them I'm not dealing with anyone's bs anymore. It's my way or the highway. You'd be surprised how people get in line when you step up and take charge

[Roosh]

I've always thought HBD to be an intellectualized form of racism.

[Scarlet_Terror]

According to OKC, black and asian men were tied for second to last with reply rates from women. Indian dudes were last. White men were #1. First world problems, right?

For women, middle eastern was #1, followed by white women.

[thegmanifesto]

(06-04-2012 03:14 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(06-04-2012 03:04 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

This is why I don't have any relation to the "manosphere".

Hell, I am still not even sure what the whole "manosphere" is. Sounds like some gay nightclub in SF or something.

Welcome back G. These are the kind of G-liners that I missed.

And for those saying game and HBD go hand and hand. Really??? All the black dudes I've met with game might take issue with that!

Thanks Speak.

Yeah, I will always bring the flavor.

Back to the thread, I have noticed a bunch of those cats trying to diss me, because I post a lot of hip-hop and soul music on my blog.

I think bottom line is a lot of these guys didn't grow up in the same environments that I did.

It would be interesting to find out where these cats grew up.

I will bet some dough that it was in some 3rd tier state, suburban strip mall wasteland.

[Tuthmosis]

Two things:

G: Where the hell you been, man? I was starting to get worried. You've missed out on some good shit around here. Welcome back.

Thread: There are ugly streaks of hyper-conservative dogma and, more disturbingly, bald racism in the "manosphere." Roissy has always trumpeted this shit which, in addition to his meandering, over-written posts, turned me off a while ago. While I think it's silly to ignore the implications of race for the sake of "political correctness," I think some of these proto white-supremacists take it too far. They're the white versions of Indian Race Troll, to be frank, maybe worse.

[R Smoov]

Honestly, I like reading blogs that inspie. Everyone had someone they looked up to in their lives. Some bloggers helped me up my game and still be thirsty to make my life better the average American Beta.

If a blog has comments that are just trying to devalue my race, why read it? I feel that with every non-white race the people that go against the grain are those who don't take that race shit to heart.

I just want to up my game and life and bang some chicks. The second I start sweating about my race, the less confident I feel in myself. So my advice is to let those beta chumps discuss about what race is better. You got places to be, barbells to lift, money to make and chicks to bang.

Naptime for Rosca.

[playa_with_a_passport]

Reading HBD and WN blogs/forums is a guilty pleasure of mines. I had no idea I had it this good as a Black Man in America. Shit just get handed to me without working for them and I get to rape White women with impunity</sarcasm>

But seriously, I understand but at the same time don't get Roissy's posters almost homo erotic facination with Black males. As a case in point, his last post reviewing the Game of Justin Wayne(a Black PUA who bangs mostly cute white girls in NYC) was surprisingly fair and balanced. However,like always his comment section decended into pure pandemonium.

The common theme among them was how dare Roissy acknoweldge that there are Black men out there who are fucking White dime pieces consistently. But little do they know that they have nothing to worry about. For every Brotha out there with game solid enough to bang hot white chicks regularly, there is 100 of 'em who idea of opening a White chick(a fat one at that) is asking "do you like Black guys?" Thus, They are getting all riled up over a "menace"(millions of Black males with tight IC Game) that doesn't exists(at least not yet ). I believe psychologist call that "projecting"

[Rah]

This just occurred to me. Aren't actual players primarily hedonists? Hedonism doesn't seem compatible with any "manosphere" topics that don't have to do with travel, health, wealth, self improvement, entertainment, leisure, and pulling ass. Men's rights, all the hate directed at women, all the hate surrounding race, all the hate against government, all that hate. Who has time for that if you're busy having a ball?

I think about this because I find myself constantly getting sucked into "what would be best for society" dialogue, which does nothing to get me where I want to be. I think it's a natural trap to fall into when things aren't going like you want them to, rather than just manning up and working with the system as it exists to get what you want.

[j r]

Holy shit! I just started reading the Justin Wayne thread. I haven't read Heartiste in months and I had no idea that it had gotten that bad. The comments section is one long race troll thread.

From the very first comment:

Quote:

Shoot Me
This is an absurd post. You simply cannot watch an esteemed-up black guy work white girls and see it as anything other than what’s wrong with our world.
I shut that stupid video off about 3 minutes into this because there is no way that a white guy would make headway with that girl talking that ridiculous bullshit. One can analyze all they want, but he’s working “thank God I’m a black dude in a world where the white women are trained to fuck even the most utterly ridiculous of us” game………and absolutely nothing more.

This guy agrees:

Quote:

peterike
What Shoot Me says. I find black dudes hitting on white girls nauseating. The only thing more nauseating is how many white girls think it’s so great.

This guy is the perfect example of the bitter beta (notice the use of "WE" when referring to shit that he had no hand in accomplishing)

Quote:

Darius Jackson
What is wrong with being “jealous”? Its not necessarily a negative trait. . One definition is “vigilance” in protecting something.I am a ‘jealous guy.” (For ex,I am “jealous” of Asians and Indians with money. their countries are giant shit pits,they could never create/sustain what WE have done—yet the assholes get to LEAVE their stinking toilets and come here and get all the bennies of being an American.) Now,I dont like niggazz. The reasons are obvious.To see them with white women makes me physically ill. It may be a white woman that I couldnt care less about and wouldnt bother with,but I would still be offended at that sick ugly shit. Guys who consider themselves to be “alpha” and play the “I am too cool to care” card are just pretending. we see right thru you. As CH says being alpha means getting da poozie,and thats all. You get da poozie you be a alpha. So you’re alpha–but you’re STILL a douche because you’re too chicken to admit you hate that shit. PS:Niggaz hate WM/BF attraction,rare as it is.

And of course, the all-time favorite:

Quote:

itsme
wake up white man.

[Cookie]

I'm a white guy from an all white town (really it had about as much diversity as some small town in a 1950's sitcom) and in one of the whitest states in the Midwest. And I can't stand racism. This is one of the reasons that I never read IMF or Roissy. Those two slander everyone else all day, yet I guarantee that they'd have no qualms getting with women from other races (hell if I remember correct, wasn't Ferd's first girlfriend Chinese or something?).

[raliv]

(06-04-2012 04:07 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

I don't have any problems with black guys - even the "young thugs" like Trayvon.

Look at George Zimmerman.

That's what guys posting on HBD message boards look like.

As I say, again and again, hit the gym. Put on some muscle. Learn how to box. Get punched a few hundred times.

You'll soon have few problems with "AMOGs," "black thugs," or other threatening male types.

This.

When all is said and done, bitching about race and immigration isn't going to help you at all because honestly, you can't do anything about it because you're not a damn politician.

I prefer to focus on things that will improve the quality of my life:

Weights
Muscle
Health
Clothes
Game
Looking and feeling good

Just focusing on those things and you can blow away the other male competition, white, black, red, yellow, or orange. I ask myself: will this help me get laid? And I go do that. That is what it is all about at the end of the day.

[speakeasy]

(06-04-2012 07:11 PM)j r Wrote:  

Holy shit! I just started reading the Justin Wayne thread. I haven't read Heartiste in months and I had no idea that it had gotten that bad. The comments section is one long race troll thread.

From the very first comment:

Quote:

Shoot Me
This is an absurd post. You simply cannot watch an esteemed-up black guy work white girls and see it as anything other than what’s wrong with our world.
I shut that stupid video off about 3 minutes into this because there is no way that a white guy would make headway with that girl talking that ridiculous bullshit. One can analyze all they want, but he’s working “thank God I’m a black dude in a world where the white women are trained to fuck even the most utterly ridiculous of us” game………and absolutely nothing more.

This guy agrees:

Quote:

peterike
What Shoot Me says. I find black dudes hitting on white girls nauseating. The only thing more nauseating is how many white girls think it’s so great.

This guy is the perfect example of the bitter beta (notice the use of "WE" when referring to shit that he had no hand in accomplishing)

Quote:

Darius Jackson
What is wrong with being “jealous”? Its not necessarily a negative trait. . One definition is “vigilance” in protecting something.I am a ‘jealous guy.” (For ex,I am “jealous” of Asians and Indians with money. their countries are giant shit pits,they could never create/sustain what WE have done—yet the assholes get to LEAVE their stinking toilets and come here and get all the bennies of being an American.) Now,I dont like niggazz. The reasons are obvious.To see them with white women makes me physically ill. It may be a white woman that I couldnt care less about and wouldnt bother with,but I would still be offended at that sick ugly shit. Guys who consider themselves to be “alpha” and play the “I am too cool to care” card are just pretending. we see right thru you. As CH says being alpha means getting da poozie,and thats all. You get da poozie you be a alpha. So you’re alpha–but you’re STILL a douche because you’re too chicken to admit you hate that shit. PS:Niggaz hate WM/BF attraction,rare as it is.

And of course, the all-time favorite:

Quote:

itsme
wake up white man.

Okay, I just decided to take a look at the Roissy thread. As soon as I saw the first minute of the video with the black dude making out with those white girls I knew there'd be a shit storm in the comments. I'm frankly surprised Roissy even posted it given his audience.

The level of betaism meets racism is just off the fucking charts over there. It's like those two traits are just feeding off each other in an infinite feedback loop. The quotes above are just the tip of the iceberg. It's quite amusing to read this stuff as you drill down. It gets to the point that some of these guys in order to assuage their cognitive dissonance that a black guy is picking up hot white girls have to convince themselves that they are all actresses he hired and it's been faked. These guys are THAT pathetic! I knew his blog readership was bad, but I didn't know it had gotten this bad since I stopped reading. It might as well be Stormfront in the comments area.

And yeah, I too am quite familiar with the whole world of HBD/WN myself as I've read some of that stuff just out of curiosity.

[rudebwoy]

I do read Roissy's page, I think he has some good insights. The racist stuff is out of control and there are some serious insecure dude's on that site, which just makes me laugh.

The sad part is that most of these guys don't understand there precious white women, not saying I do but they are a different "breed" altogether.

[silent_scope]

I got into it with whoever Roissy or Heartiste is about some racial shit and he deleted my comments on the matter when I called him out about it. Pretty lame.

I avoid the political threads and stick to the game/science proving game posts, because regardless of how he feels about race issues in the country, the early game shit on there is universal and it's on point.

[Basil Ransom]

As for white guys freaking over black guys getting with white girls:

This is basically human nature, more or less. Group of tribe A see their fertile charges fornicating with tribe B. Tribe A proceeds to get pissed. I'm sure when a black guy sees a hot black girl with a white guy, he doesn't start loving white guys either. Sex and bloodlines make for powerful instincts, especially when they mix. Yes, there's more to it than that, but to get all high and mighty about white guys getting protective of white women is pretty dubious.

Here's some classic Roissy:



The drawing is illustrating how the prevalence of fat chicks is pushing guys to give outsized attention to the remaining slim girls. What happens when girls of some races are more desirable than others? The same thing that's happening in that cartoon, to varying extents, depending on how big the differences in attractiveness are among the different groups. Among the American-born girls, white girls are the most desired. On the globe as a whole, it's not that cut and dry by any means, but I'm talking about America. Here's a study finding that black men and white women are the most attractive. Taking that at face value, that means the whiter this country is, the better it is for any individual player. Plus, it often works to your advantage to be the only _____ guy in the room.

Or put it in terms of say, European nationalities - if you had a mix of ugly Brits and hot Swedes, of both sexes, the more Brits there are, the harder it would be to mack. The bottom line is, the more prevalent the group with the most attractive females, the easier it will be to game. And when those Swedes feel hemmed in by strange men, they start to get more insular, and withdraw. A top Harvard sociologist did his best to disprove this, but went public with his findings when he couldn't. When the number of Brits is small, the Swedes still feel relatively secure and open-minded.

(06-04-2012 04:07 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

I don't have any problems with black guys - even the "young thugs" like Trayvon.

Look at George Zimmerman.

That's what guys posting on HBD message boards look like.

As I say, again and again, hit the gym. Put on some muscle. Learn how to box. Get punched a few hundred times.

You'll soon have few problems with "AMOGs," "black thugs," or other threatening male types.

Hmm, looking at Zimmerman, I'd be surprised if that's what HBD guys look like...

Edit: lol, yeah not gonna read the comments about the Wayne guy, but I missed that post, looks like promising game. He seems to have awkward energy, but I salute his boldness.

'Heartiste' wrote at the end of that post "And then there’s that white guy from New York whose name escapes me who approaches a lot of chicks in the middle of the day and goes direct on them." Is he referring to Paul Janka? I highly doubt that Roissy wrote this post, in addition to a bunch of other reasons, I don't think Roissy would forget Janka.

[Timoteo]

I haven't been over there in AGES, but I couldn't resist this Justin Wayne discussion. The comments immediately devolved into a Klan meeting. But you know a lot of the guys that posted wouldn't approach those same white girls Justin did. One of them stated it point blank, like he was speaking truth to power - he immediately dispensed with the game analysis, and stated plainly that all he saw was a black guy approaching and engaging a white woman, and declared that he was speaking for every other guy that saw it, and was sickened by other guys that wouldn't admit to feeling the same thing. There are over 700 comments, but from what I read, only a couple small posts called out the bigots. My feelings on this kind of thing is that I'm never surprised, but always a bit disappointed.

[Vicious]

Funny that all these awakened white men seem to adopt the talk and mannerisms of black people. If we were to see a pic of them I'm pretty sure they would dress like them as well.