[basil]

Hey guys,
Recently come across this interesting woman, shes very motivated, hustling got a LOT going on in her life. Oh shes also a smoking hot model.
The beauty thing doesn't phase me, its common.

What I haven't really had to deal with before is this girl really has no spare time. Shes got a 9-5 kinda career going on, then has like 3 side businesses and bunch of other projects. She honestly keeps trying to talk me out of seeing her. Telling me her busy life has resulted in past relationships breaking down and all kinds of shit to make me change my mind.

Now I know what your thinking, I need to build attraction, show value. But there is only so much you can do via texts and what not. I need to get one on one face time.

She says ambition is her biggest turn on. I think I've demonstrated that, she seemed genuinely impressed with what I've done and what I'm chasing. I cant see lying and saying yeah I'm too busy to see you as well is really going to solve this problem.

I'm at a loss. How do I get her to invest and meet me half way?

[Caligula]

Wait, have you actually met her yet?

[basil]

Good call, yes met at an event last week. She was busy, I had to split so grabbed digits.

[Caligula]

You're overthinking this. Either you built enough attraction and will be able to get her to meet you, or you didn't build enough attraction and she will flake almost regardless of what you do.

Assuming you need to build more attraction - if your phone game is tight get her on the phone and get her excited about meeting you. Talk up how you're really busy and you're tired of girls not understanding that you have to take care of business. Hint at important shit you've got going on.

Ask her what her schedule is like. Yeah you're busy most of the week too. But tell her "Hey, I was going to go to ... on ..., why don't you join?" sometime when she's likely to be free.

If your phone game isn't tight try the same thing over text, without any of the DHV stuff. As you rightly say you can't really do that over text.

If that fails, NEXT.

Let us know how it goes.

[soup]

I'd bet that her telling you she's too busy is a shit test. Don't buy into her frame. You might want to try Agree and Amplify on her. Maybe you can subtextually call her out on being so "busy" by teasing her about it. Next time you talk to her and she's like "blah blah blah i'm so busy," with a sarcastic smirk you can reply "I'm sure one of your interns can pencil me in somewhere." Or something like that.

The point is that you have to let her know that you see through her bullshit. Maybe she really is busy, but I think it's better to take the risk and call her bluff. Otherwise you can join the long line of rejected guys who couldn't pass her shit test.

[CJ]

(01-09-2012 06:28 PM)basil Wrote:  

Hey guys,
Recently come across this interesting woman, shes very motivated, hustling got a LOT going on in her life. Oh shes also a smoking hot model.
The beauty thing doesn't phase me, its common.

What I haven't really had to deal with before is this girl really has no spare time. Shes got a 9-5 kinda career going on, then has like 3 side businesses and bunch of other projects.

Item #1. You've already invested too much of your energy into this, and regardless of you saying beauty is common, you're still over-valuing her career success.

Quote:

She honestly keeps trying to talk me out of seeing her. Telling me her busy life has resulted in past relationships breaking down and all kinds of shit to make me change my mind.

This is a MAJOR red flag. IMO, this isn't a shit test and she's trying to let you down nice instead of flat-out ignoring you.

Quote:

Now I know what your thinking, I need to build attraction, show value. But there is only so much you can do via texts and what not. I need to get one on one face time.

Here's what I'm actually thinking:

1. This is unlikely to happen, so you need to not give a fuck about what the outcome is from here on.
2. You said you met her at an event last week, how many times have you exchanged text messages since?

If you haven't already spent too much time in 'text-message hell', and she hasn't repeatedly rejected your offers to meet up, during your next text message exchange, I'd end with, "I know I can't compete with everything you have going on, but hit me up if you ever want to take a break and grab a drink."

I wouldn't just come out with guns blazing from the get on this, start off texting whatever you normally do, for me it's just, "What's up?" and then hit her with that after she inevitably tells you how busy she is (again).

She'll know that's her last chance to go out with you, if she wants to see you again she'll make time. If not, you can move on knowing you exhausted your options.

[Mujeriego]

I'll second soup on this one. I dated a girl just like this and she wasn't nearly as busy as she claimed; it was part of the image she wanted to project. Those side business are most likely hot air too. Bottom line: if a girl is interested she'll make time to see you.

[basil]

Cheers for the advice guys, some solid stuff from all of you. Yes I was sweating this girl, I knew it was a bad thing but saying next aint easy when i compare her to whats come previously and what is likely to come next. I don't think there is any shame in saying I'm punching well above my weight, though I wont tell her that. I'm incredibly picky in what I look for in terms of a girls personality and whats going on in her life. Finding that with someone who is stunning and interested in me is rare.

Pretty much all of you made the point that maybe shes not as busy as she made things seem, that was spot on. I got her on the phone today said what are you up to next few days, picked a gap and said were grabbing coffee and crepes at this awesome place i know. She had already mentioned she was on her third cup for the day and id been busting her ass previously about being a skinny ass ex-model to which she insisted she loved to eat, so using that as a date seemed a good way make sure she didn't weasel out (being able to say well you do need your coffee and or i think your full of shit about eating pancakes and whatnot). So yeah she has a lot of different things that she is doing, but when she was saying things previously like "i really haven't even get 2 minutes to myself" she was obviously talking shit.

So were on for later in the week. I'm confident from there I can make things work. My text and phone game is usually fairly solid, however most girls Ive seen recently were from okcupid & POF - I had a pretty good routine bouncing them off that and into text and meet-up. Just a bit out of my comfort zone on this and i needed the tough love. Thanks again guys.

[satanova77]

You already got good advice here Basil. I have been dealing with a similiar chick for past few months.

She is using basics of game to have you play by her rules and saying her time is valuable than yours. You have to do exact opposite of what she wants you to do and ignore anything she has about her schedule.

The chick I am talking about is very successful in her career, goes to charity balls, hot, local united way young leader president, plays softball league and some other bullshit volunteer crap on weekends and would take her sweet ass time responding to my meetup propositions.....I told her one time i am a married man with kid, travel every week for work with a high stress job, workout 10 hours a week, have investment properties to manage...so please dont tell me about your busy schedule till you have some real responsiblites in life...

After I told her that I got bang and now she is a little manipulated kitty in my hands...

Dont listen to your heart...listen to your brain....

[Roosh]

Two possibilities:

1. She eternally goes without sex because of her busy work schedule.
2. She's stringing you along for attention, making herself seem like a challenge so you feed her ego with repeated attempts.

[xmlenigma]

(01-10-2012 09:04 AM)satanova77 Wrote:  

You already got good advice here Basil. I have been dealing with a similiar chick for past few months.

She is using basics of game to have you play by her rules and saying her time is valuable than yours. You have to do exact opposite of what she wants you to do and ignore anything she has about her schedule.

The chick I am talking about is very successful in her career, goes to charity balls, hot, local united way young leader president, plays softball league and some other bullshit volunteer crap on weekends and would take her sweet ass time responding to my meetup propositions.....I told her one time i am a married man with kid, travel every week for work with a high stress job, workout 10 hours a week, have investment properties to manage...so please dont tell me about your busy schedule till you have some real responsiblites in life...

After I told her that I got bang and now she is a little manipulated kitty in my hands...

Dont listen to your heart...listen to your brain....

Reminds me of something similar that I did.

I was travelling all the time across the US for my work and would "run into" this HBTallwBoots at parties & events etc. We'd have short encounters and I very sincerely & firmly said to her, I want to see you, where we are not just running into each other.

She told me, I was always gone & busy. etc. Sometimes she had stuff etc. True logistical issues. But, logistics aside.. INTENT matters.

One club party where she dance dirty with me for a bit and went back to her friends. End of the party as the club emptied, I softly took her away from her group for a minute and held both her hands, in front of me and looked straight into her eyes... Firm, Relaxed, Sincere, Strong.

"Look, I know I'm busy, but if I want to see you, I'll make time. Question do you want to see me or not. If not, then lets chuck these games and we can delete numbers from each others phones".

Next weekend, late night around 2 am as I was being dropped after a dinner at a friends, she calls.. and some token flirting & conversation and then she drives 30/40 miles and comes over for a coffee

I realized something, the POWER of STRONG CLEAR INTENT. If you stop playing games, be NATURAL & REAL.. and so will she have to be.

[basil]

(01-10-2012 12:42 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Two possibilities:

1. She eternally goes without sex because of her busy work schedule.
2. She's stringing you along for attention, making herself seem like a challenge so you feed her ego with repeated attempts.

My mind first went to 1, I fell into trap of asking about her life (we didn't really cover much about who we were at the event, it was mostly just bullshit and game so I wanted to find out if she was worth meting up with) and she said relationships were neither a priority or something she had time for. Mentioned two last exs who basically split with her because they couldn't handle it.
There may be an element of truth in there, but yeah its seems she was mostly feeding her ego, I validated her initially by complimenting her on what she had going on and she paid me the same compliment.

(01-10-2012 02:18 PM)xmlenigma Wrote:  

I realized something, the POWER of STRONG CLEAR INTENT. If you stop playing games, be NATURAL & REAL.. and so will she have to be.

That is exactly it, we were too busy ego stroking and it took me saying hey lets cut this shit, I KNOW you have time lets get together and find out.

She texted me this morning with some shit about 'I hope it works out between us but if not I think we could be great friends, have a lot in common'. I replied by saying 'I already have friends and we have a lot in common and if I just wanted the company I'd get a dog. Don't think you can weasel out of this.' She sent back 'Ok xx'.

[Blackhawk]

Roosh excellently advises when learning game to go to places not near where you live or work and open women you don't know. Picking up randoms from clubs and cafes. That way your mistakes won't hang around you.

This is advanced game: Women already in your social circle, that if you fuck up opening, you'll have to face later and take shit for your flame out. Women that after the attraction has worn off and the passion gone, you'll still keep bumping into afterwards. The rewards are the same: the bang, at much higher risk and for a much higher PITA cost after its over.

For this, Krauser's mental game is the better match. The core of it in some ways is "I'm attracted to you now, but I may not remember you much longer, there's so many other cool things going on in my life to distract me. Act now, or its your loss."

You're creating a face saving limited window of opportunity. If she turns you down, next time you see her you've already forgotten about it and you've already gone on to five other incredible things.

But even Krauser day games randoms off the street instead of going after already-knowns. Because of the "How many times do I have to see you if I screw up" cost afterwards of gaming your already-knowns in your social circle.

For the risk vs reward, and cost, it makes much more sense to stay outside your social circles.

I struggle with this too. Bunch of orbiters in my social circle throwing their lures at me, and instead I go to the fresh faces I know nothing about, rather than the ones that have been orbiting me that I know and see at event after event. Hassle factor and pain is just too high for the already-knowns.

[CJ]

Coffee and crepes eh? This ends one of two ways, and neither one is positive...

I'd never go on a coffee date, unless I were in Amsterdam; then again maybe Australia is different too.

[TheAntiWhiteKnight138]

^^^ I'm with CJ on this one, OP I think you're valuing her looks a little more than you should be. And is it just me or does listening to women yack about their "careers" for hours make you want to hurl??

Question I always ask myself when I start to put pussy on a pedestal..............Am I going to marry this one??? Answer is always a resounding no. Put a couple of drinks in her and gauge whether or not she'll put out.

[JofSuperman]

If she's a model, you have to play to that angle.

Models love anything that will potentially help their career. Whether it's a fashion magazine, photographer, designer etc.

Throwing in some lies can help with this.

[iknowexactly]

Janka quote:

1) Difficult women remain difficult.

Other quote from a chick but I don't remember who, only applies sometimes.

2) When people tell you who they are, believe them the first time.