[matt1996]

I was thinking about this last night when i couldn't fall asleep. Most of us started our red pill journey after a first love or after a first girlfriend breakup that put us in a state of confusion and desperation that lead us down the path of finding answers and understanding what mistakes to avoid the next time. Some went the LTR route, while others went the route of fucking as many women as possible, racking up the notch count to fill the void.

Since taking the red pill and seeing things differently, for each year learning more and more, through reading, researching and infield real-life experiences, i started to understand it more clear and well enough that i could educate others about it. After becoming red pill i've gotten rid of 90% of my friends and toxic people in my life and started befriending like-minded people. "naturals" or people that have an idea about things, people not fully in denial at least. And i've tried to push some red pill truths and discussions with some of those friends.

Unfortunately, they don't seem to give a fuck about it. Either not interested, or not capable of understanding it. "Nah man, women are not THAT fucked up, not every girl is like that, you've had bad experiences" kind of answers. Blue pill answers. After awhile i stopped trying to introduce my friends to red pill as they are way too stuck up in their own blue pill ideologies. I realized something very important. You cant force it onto someone. One needs to seek it, one needs to be ready for it, and only then will they open up and understand things like you do.

I've always been the lesser good looking of my friends when we went out, but still pulled the most. They would always ask me what the hell im doing to get these girls? They dont want to learn the process, they want to have the final product. They don't want to learn and understand, they just want it without any effort. They are stuck in the looks are everything in game. I've given up on educating them since it's like talking to deaf ears. It's such a shame, because i wish i've had friends that i could discuss such things with. I only have one guy that is willing to listen and learn, and he's a "natural" so not very far away. Today this guy is my best friend.

Is it actually a good thing only a minority of men nowadays are red pilled? I'd think around 5% of the world's men are red pilled. We have a "tight-knit" community mostly gathering on the internet to share knowledge, red pill truths and experiences with each other, trying to improve our lives in every way possible, physically, mentally, financially etc. And ahead of 95% of the population in terms of thinking and female logic, how the world works etc. Is it good all of this downfall is happening, social media chaos, girls slutting it up, feminism trying to change the world, media trying to redefine what it means to be masculine nowadays?

I've had a lot of girls past year and a half tell me how different i am from other guys. How im the only one they can't read no matter how much they try. How i trigger feelings in them they've never had before for anyone. Because i stopped validating girls, being needy over texts, started implementing strong frame, not taking bullshit, using dread to my advantage, and having an abundance mentality where i can leave literally any second. Never investing more in a girl than she does in me. Always keeping her chasing. Everything i've learned from this forum and from reading a bunch of red pill books and ACTUALLY putting it to use in practice.

So my question is, is it an advantage for us guys in game to have more beta males/blue pilled guys in the game so you'll always be seen as the top% for the girls that date you. She will always compare you to someone else and have a hard time finding someone with your knowledge/game. Hard to find other guys that trigger the same feelings in her that you do. So you will always have girls coming back to you and chasing your validation. Girls will see you as alpha the way you carry yourself and hold a strong frame. You will never end up as an orbiter since you will never allow that. If the top 20% of guys get the top 80% of women, what about the top 5% red pilled guys? Do they get the top of the top?

[nirala]

It is an advantage if you're happy and satisfied with the current state of affairs. If you're old fashioned and wish the society and women to not have gone down the way they have, then it's a disadvantage. Only way to prevent further degradation is to get more and more red pilled. And not only that but to restore the society to a point where there is some balance. So many promiscuous men aren't exactly good. It would be good to have a society with traditional family structure and where women aren't so loose and also men aren't as promiscuous.

Today there is no balance. So many men are Incels whereas some are sleeping with so many women. Women are hypergamous. But no one is happy. Because none of this actually makes people happy. As Roosh stated in one of his blogs, none of this PUA movement etc, is an action but a reaction to women's changed attitudes. Women made the first move when the neglected the family values and traditional roles. Men just wanted to get laid and developed methods to do so. Who didn't do so became Incels. But however much women claim to be happy with their successful careers and riding the cock carousel, they aren't. They are actually miserable, but they realize how miserable they are only when they hit the wall. None of this should happen. And only when men from all walks of life stand and take action, can the society be saved from complete imbalance.

Few Red Pilled men can maybe advantage themselves with it, but think about the future. What if you have children, your nieces and nephews, your little brother or sister end up in a society that is full of these beta blue pill Incels and hypergamous women. I don't think it's advantageous unless you're okay to watch this world burn.

[The Catalyst]

Betas are good, bluepillers are bad.

[kinjutsu]

Currently we have an over abundance of bluepill betas.
The reason why we have some many attention seeking instagram thots, e-girls, twitch streamers etc is because of blue pill beta males/white knights/overall weak dudes with no spines.

Beta's are fine because their mind isn't fully blue pill. Back in the 1930's even the physically weakest guys weren't blue pilled like some of the most "alpha" guys on twitter.

[jacknap]

Red pill betas is preferable to blue pill betas.

A red pill beta I think understands how the world works so won't hold it against you as an alpha knowing that they would do the same thing in your position.

A blue pill beta is the type that would try to get violent / jealous rage because girls are princess and men are evil.

[RatInTheWoods]

Betas are the drones that keep the lights on, build the houses and generally run civilisation while women are eating, praying and loving.

We'd be fucked without the hapless Betas, doing what they do best.

Without lambs, the lions would starve.

[JoeSomebody]

Is it an advantage having more beta males and blue pill men in our society?

Yes and No. Let me explain....

Why having more blue pillers is good:

In terms of strictly PERSONAL gains, it is an advantage to be a red piller when there is a plethora of beta males and blue pillers. You stand out, not just with women but with the general populace as well. This can be good or bad depending on how you look at it. I'd argue that there is very little bad, but a ton of good. Flakey people and some friends will quickly vanish from your life either by you giving them the axe or they will axe themselves. They become a non-issue. You have far less negative influences and blue-pilled horse shit thinking around you when these people go bye-bye. One downfall of it is that as a result you can potentially become more isolated and incredibly choosey with who you associate with. Your circle will become smaller, but it will also become more "real". 5 red pilled friends who all have your back and are like-minded....or 20 blue-pilled "friends" who don't? You already know the answer. People, especially men who don't subscribe to the NPC bullshit, will love you and want to be around you. My local gym is loaded with red-pilled, in-shape men and young adults who are great to be around. At times, gym sessions can turn into podcasts between sets. It's great and being that there are almost no women at this gym, it's a breathe of fresh air. For some guys you can tell it's a much needed break from the PC world and work environment where they have to keep everything in. Like-mindedness really is incredible when it comes to men with other men.

When it comes to women, the fact that you are a 5%er in a sea of 95%ers, has more upswing than downswing. You will tap into women's biological hardwiring when you act like a man should act, and not some joke. I have a friend in England who works in law enforcement and he's killing it with the girls at work. Main reason according to him: "Mate, these other lads I work with are fucking melts". Says it all right there. Yea it helps that he's a 6'3 former Uni rugby player and good-looking, but his MINDSET in correct, on women and on the world. In terms of personal gains, he fact that he's surrounded by melts helps him immensely and he's able to capitalize on this. However, there is some drawback with women being that you are a red-pilled man. Main reason being is that her NPC programming and social conditioning is going to tell her to stay the fuck away from you. Her pussy wants you, she craves what you are are what you stand for, but you do not represent what her SHAPED view is on how a male should be in the year 2019. This sends all sorts of mixed signals to her brain and you might be too much for her to handle. Generally speaking though, if she's able to absorb the initial red-pilled punch to the gut, she might fall head over heels for you. I had this happen with my-ex. She even texted me out of the blue a few months ago saying: "I always hear your voice in my head when I'm reminded on a daily basis of how many chumpy men roam this earth".

Why having more blue-pillers is bad:

As for the good of SOCIETY as a whole, it's bad. Very bad. If there wasn't so many of them, we wouldn't be in the state of decay we are in today. We all know how women and society are in this day in age. No one in this forum is under any illusions. However, what percentage of the way women are today is due to blue-pillers/beta males/white knights? An OVERWHELMING majority of why women and society both are in the state they are in, is precisely due to these types of people. As a matter of fact, you can put a vast majority of the cultural decay down to the blue-pilelrs, beta males, and white knights. They far outnumber us, so it's no coincidence why we are in the mess we are in currently. Even if 50% of men were red-pilled, this forum might not exist as our society might not be this fucked up.

Blue-pillers mostly aid your personal gains these days because the playing field is that much more pathetic. Having even an iota of masculinity and red-pilled thinking will put you well ahead of the pack. This is good from an individual standpoint. From a societal standpoint, these people are a scourge and only have us swirling further down the toilet bowl.

[nek]

(04-14-2019 02:44 PM)kinjutsu Wrote:  

Currently we have an over abundance of bluepill betas.
The reason why we have some many attention seeking instagram thots, e-girls, twitch streamers etc is because of blue pill beta males/white knights/overall weak dudes with no spines.

Beta's are fine because their mind isn't fully blue pill. Back in the 1930's even the physically weakest guys weren't blue pilled like some of the most "alpha" guys on twitter.

Most of today's problems are simply the result of cowardice. Nothing more. Lesson to you younger guys...no matter how smart, hardworking, compassionate you are, if you're a coward, your life will suck, and you'll deserve it.

[KMK]

(04-14-2019 02:46 PM)jacknap Wrote:  

A red pill beta I think understands how the world works so won't hold it against you as an alpha knowing that they would do the same thing in your position.

A blue pill beta is the type that would try to get violent / jealous rage because girls are princess and men are evil.

Other way around. A blue pill beta is blissfully ignorant. A red pill beta knows what he's missing out on and is much more likely to be spending most of his life quietly seething but taking a few opportunities to lash out from the shadows, so to speak. Or in very rare cases go ER and destroy his own life.

Blue pill social programming exists for a reason.

[Swordfish1010]

Yes, less competition. Girls are undersexed.

[RatInTheWoods]

(04-14-2019 09:53 PM)JoeSomebody Wrote:  

Yea it helps that he's a 6'3 former Uni rugby player and good-looking,

[ChefAllDay]

(04-14-2019 04:12 PM)RatInTheWoods Wrote:  

Betas are the drones that keep the lights on, build the houses and generally run civilisation while women are eating, praying and loving.

We'd be fucked without the hapless Betas, doing what they do best.

Without lambs, the lions would starve.

This what pretty much exactly what I was going to respond with. As a whole we would be better off if our civilizations was way more red-pilled. But even then the more beta of the red-pilled men would be the ones keeping the cogs of the machine turning.

The only difference is they would go home from work, kiss their wife then smack her on the ass as soon as she turned away. He would proceed out to his backyard to play catch with one of his sons. His wife or one of his daughters would fetch him a beer and he would smile and be the king of his little domain.

[KeepMovingForward]

Having blue pill men is bad. They live in a false reality, and because of their delusion they are vulnerable to deception and exploitation, particularly by women.


Having Betas is a very good thing. Dutiful Betas and Deltas make the world go round. The game community often has a very narrow view of Beta as the clueless guy who just doesn't get women, and is eternally frustrated with them because of his lack of success. It's actually not true, the Beta usually does just fine with women, he just doesn't get the first pass at top tier women, who favor alphas and sigmas.

[KMK]

(04-15-2019 08:42 AM)ChefAllDay Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 04:12 PM)RatInTheWoods Wrote:  

Betas are the drones that keep the lights on, build the houses and generally run civilisation while women are eating, praying and loving.

We'd be fucked without the hapless Betas, doing what they do best.

Without lambs, the lions would starve.

This what pretty much exactly what I was going to respond with. As a whole we would be better off if our civilizations was way more red-pilled. But even then the more beta of the red-pilled men would be the ones keeping the cogs of the machine turning.

The only difference is they would go home from work, kiss their wife then smack her on the ass as soon as she turned away. He would proceed out to his backyard to play catch with one of his sons. His wife or one of his daughters would fetch him a beer and he would smile and be the king of his little domain.

Enforced monogamy for all is totally unsustainable for any civilization with equal gender ratios, since there are so many undesirable women, a decent minority of women who are infertile by circumstance, and a decent minority of men who are high IQ cads that can repeatedly slip past any social mores that try to rein them in.

2014 manosphere understood this. 2019 manosphere is drunk on religious koolaid and will jump down the throat of anyone who brings that up, with reactions ranging from "that can't be true, my holy book says monogamy for all is the way things have to be!" to "shhhh, not so fucking loud, this subject matter has to be taboo."

Under modernist values anyone can run game and have some success in the sexual market, even if it doesn't lead to marriage and a family.
Under traditional values a large percentage of men are left with nothing. For life. No way out. That segment of men is a cancer that will destroy everything eventually. Meat grinder wars and dangerous hard labor jobs were the chemo for that cancer, but we don't have those anymore.

[Graft]

Definitely a disadvantage.

In a red pill society 28-32 y/o broads are trash.

In this society women are shooting for successful and handsome men to pick them up because they know there's enough blue pill guys who will scoop them when they are fat jaded and old.

If every guy in the US thought like me then all women would be mad scrambling to get engaged before their 25th birthday and saving up 5k for a fresh set of knockers.

[JoeSomebody]

Well said Graft. You made me chuckle at the 5k for a fresh set of knockers.

[Elmore]

A healthy disparity between alpha and betas is probably naturally occurring, and beneficial. Too many alphas = too much conflict, too many chiefs not enough indians...

Blue pilled are deluded, weak and malleable by malign forces. Nothing good about them. I suppose if you were being base and entirely selfish and shallow you might think it leverages you advantage in that you might 'stand out'. However i'd argue the opposite is true. Blue pilled men are easy prey for women emotionally. The low hanging fruit of modern man, always ready to compliment, placate and indulge. So a societal standard of weak, malleable men is just going to create more psychotic women IMHO.

Even if they would be better off being with a strong red pilled man, many would choose the 'easy option' of a placating blue pill male, in the same way many choose shit food, not working out and spending all day on their phones.

Ultimately being red pilled can end up feeling isolated and depressed. I am pessimistic about society and the future of the West. This no doubt feeds into my interactions, and from time to time i come off as 'negative' to a lot of blue-pilled people. But then a lot of times what they call 'negative' is frankly the red pill. Although i dont doubt i sometimes drift into genuine unhealthy negativity too. It's hard not to at times.

IMHO the red pill is not an either or. It's something that should be indulged to a degree in moderation. I've made that mistake before and frankly it does draw you into a negative frame. How could it not.

So yeah, if society was healthier and less toxic, we'd all likely be a lot more chipper and things would flow easier all round. I cant see how the delusion and blue-pilled masses are anything but disasterous, especially when you consider where things may well lead in the coming years...

[Quizzical_2]

Although no one can "enforce" monogamy, this is pretty besides the point. You can't "enforce" a no killing rule either - so I guess go crazy? Let animals be animals, I suppose.

As for the question itself, on a practical level, the more beta men around you, the better chances you (the red pilled man) have with chicks who just want a alpha guy. (Subconciously or not) You'll stick out like a sore thumb to the girls who are accustomed to only interacting with weak willed men.

On a societal level, weak willed blue pillers are going to destroy society and run it into the ground. These cucks are the ones who elect the Hilaries of the world - the feminists and Marxists.

[AntoniusofEfa]

Monogamous relationships are the basis for a functioning society as we know it. Men are generally less motivated to work and maintain peace if they know that they are not getting a piece of the pussy pie. Having nature do what it wants (give 80% of female to 20% of men) is in my eyes like going into the tropical forest naked, and without any vaccines. Survival of the fittest is not what gave us electricity, internet, or a (relatively) stable state of world peace we have at the moment.

[nek]

Beta yes, bluepill no.