[Dalaran1991]

I started working a junior manager position a few weeks ago. After doing my balance book, I’ll have 500 euros each month for saving.

Thanks to the contract I’ll have at least 4 months of work, so that will translate to 2000 euros saving. Make it 1500 since Christmas is coming.

If I keep the job for a year steady that would mean 5-6k per year more or less.
Still young and don’t plan to get married soon.

What can I do with this little saving? It’s not a lot to go into investment unless I save up a whole year. And I’m still inexperienced top try anything risky, especially considering the situation in France right now.

Should I just save it up till I have enough, then buy gold/dollars and consider something big? Or is there small types of investment/side hustle I could do?

[deuce]

Do you have an emergency fund? When I first started making decent money, I sucked it up for a year or so and just shoveled cash into my savings account. Sort of a "shit hits the fan" fund.

I waited until there was about $15K USD in my savings and then started investing. Having that liquid cash there just in case the contract gets shut down tomorrow (I work in a lucrative but volatile industry) really helped my peace of mind, knowing I can live for several months on that sum.

The amount you might want in there may be different and I know some will say that money is being wasted just sitting there but it's the decision I've made.

[lavidaloca]

I'd do an emergency fund. This is something I didn't do and when I started my business it became an additional stressor as I constantly invested more each time I saved up $3-$5k.

I'd save up $5k to have as an emergency fund and for peace of mind. The value of the peace of mind isn't quantifiable.

After that begin investing.

[Direct or subtle]

Problem is, you'll be paid in Euros.

Don't keep those Euros in some local bank account. Keep US dollars or some other strong, promising currency.

The euro has lost 25% of its value against the dollar in the last 18 months. And events like Paris attacks don't alleviate the pressure on the Euro, quite the contrary...

[the Thing]

If you don't have any job prospects after this one, use it to create yourself a few. Start a small ecommerce gig, buy a professional photo shoot, even get yourself a new suit to wear to interviews. Chase bigger money with small money.

That being said, I would blow it rolling like a motherfucker in Russia.

Airfare there and back, 300-400 EUR. Apartment on St. Petersburg Nevsky prospect, 50-60 EUR a day. Get your clothes tailored there, it's cheap. Go to a dentist and get your teeth cleaned. Buy a few clothes. Kill whatever's left with chicks on dates.

2k EUR is way too small to be of any use investing. If you find a low risk investment and make 10% a year on it (which would be incredible) you have 2200 EUR. If you're junior and fresh out of college in Europe you net that much in 3-4 weeks max. If you're fired, that'll pay your rent and other living expenses for maybe a month and a half.

Money is best spent to keep your inner game high and your confidence strong. You could still be a junior manager in a year saving nickels and dimes, or you could keep a high level of life satisfaction, channel it to grinding out a consulting gig and make 5 times what you're making right now.

On the thread "Become a python developer in 30 days" that guy went from making 2k to 6.5k in I think a year. Abundance mentality in personal finance posits that there's more money than you could ever earn in your whole life.
Wallstreetplayboys has great articles about how saving nickels and dimes is womanly, and how you should always be chasing bigger fish to fry instead of trying to hold on to the smaller fish.

[brob]

If you want to invest in stocks, the app Robinhood is great for young investors who don't have much capital but want some skin in the game. There are no trading costs or maintenance costs so your principal won't get eaten up by fees.

[Isaac Jordan]

I'll second the emergency/fuck you fund.

You never know when an opportunity is going to arise, and having 6-12 months worth of living expenses in the bank, liquid, allows you the freedom and maneuverability to take the kind of risks required to achieve greatness.

I can actually speak from experience on this. I took a cushy corporate gig right after university graduation, but I knew it wasn't going to last. I didn't have any entrepreneurial ideas at the time, but I knew that if I was patient, something would eventually come across my path, and I'd need to be ready for it when it did.

Two years into the job, that's exactly what happened. I was given the opportunity to lead the sales force of a tiny startup, and I immediately quit my corporate job to take it. At that time, I had been putting about $1k/month into a savings account, even though I knew inflation would slowly chip away at it.

The new company was focused on providing complex business solutions that required buy-in from all parts of the prospect organization (i.e. accounting, marketing, HR, operations, etc. all had to be on the same page), so it wasn't as simple as convincing one person to buy something, and the sales cycle was MUCH longer than I expected. It took me nearly a year to make my first big sale.

During that time, I wasn't just paying for my living expenses-I was also bankrolling our marketing efforts. Living at home helped to mitigate some of those costs, but all told I still spent over $15k before I was able to stop the bleeding.

While I'm sure I could have borrowed the money somehow, just having a year's worth of expenses in the bank gave me the courage to quit my corporate job and take a huge risk-one which has so far drastically improved my life and business acumen (even if I'm still waiting to see if we make it big or not). That alone made it a good decision, regardless of the eventual return on investment.

It's easy to look at interest rates and average returns and the like, but it's hard to calculate the benefits of investing in yourself and your future. With the small amount of money you've got coming in, I'd say short-term flexibility and peace of mind and a long-term ability to chase your dreams are a much better return than anything you might achieve through the stock market.

[Dalaran1991]

Thanks guys, I also think having a fuck you money fund would be a good idea.

However given how haywire things have been lately is it safe to put money in a bank account? If for some reasons shit goes down and you no longer have access to your bank account that would be a problem. Should I just buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?

[the Thing]

If you decide to go that route, you should dollar cost average into Vanguard's S&P 500 ETF (VOO) index fund. E.g. Buy X amount of dollars worth of VOO every month. That way you're at least protected against inflation.

[Ray Carlton]

I agree with the other posters here: Build up an emergency fund.

The size of it should be 2 times your monthly earnings.

Why that?

I came to this conclusion based on my own situation. When I get fired today, they company would still need to pay my 2 full salaries. In addition, I have two full salaries with my emergency fund.

This give me 4 months time for finding a new job - without cutting back on my lifestyle at all.

However, in a situation without a job, I would of course cut back on my spending. Based on my emergency fund savings and spending habits, I could probably be 5 - 6 months without a job and wouldn't need to worry about it.

I am convinced that I can easily find a new job within 6 months. In this case, a much bigger emergency fund doesn't make much sense for me.

How much money can you still save within one year in this scenario?

As other have pointed out, investing doesn't make much sense. Of course, it is not the dumbest idea, but the returns are not there. You invest 2000 Euro, what can you get? Maybe 6 - 10% percent in return.

200 Euros more at year-end are nice, but not a game changer.

If you want to play around with money and invest. Try Bitcoin. I invested 2000 last summer and sold them last week for 3000. This is not a bad return.

Invest in yourself (suit, books, travel).
Try Bitcon for fun, but be willing to lose it all.
Invest money in your own startup.

This is the way I handle it, as a young professional.

Ray

[samsamsam]

Seems like emergency fund and fuck you fund is sort of being mixed up here. Here is my understanding and how people I know use it.

Emergency fund is just that in case of emergencies like getting fired, injured etc. It is usually suggested to be 6 months by personal advisers last time I checked.

A fuck you fund is different, it just means you get to live life on your terms. Basically, you could retire at any given moment.

OP, if you wanna hustle on the side, but side people need to sell quickly for cash, then just flip it. Sounds easier than it is because you burn time trying to find these deals, but I have found stuff over the years online through Craigslist.

[Peregrine]

(11-16-2015 02:15 PM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Thanks guys, I also think having a fuck you money fund would be a good idea.

However given how haywire things have been lately is it safe to put money in a bank account? If for some reasons shit goes down and you no longer have access to your bank account that would be a problem. Should I just buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?

Rest assured, banks are quite safe. Though it never hurts to have a few hundred or so in cash at home.

[Cheetah]

(11-16-2015 02:15 PM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Thanks guys, I also think having a fuck you money fund would be a good idea.

However given how haywire things have been lately is it safe to put money in a bank account? If for some reasons shit goes down and you no longer have access to your bank account that would be a problem. Should I just buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?

Are banks in Vietnam safe? Maybe store half of it or at least a part of it there?

If you live in Europe relying on USD too much might not be a good idea. Do banks have accounts with SDR (special drawing rights, a bag of different currencies)?

[Direct or subtle]

(11-16-2015 02:15 PM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Thanks guys, I also think having a fuck you money fund would be a good idea.

However given how haywire things have been lately is it safe to put money in a bank account? If for some reasons shit goes down and you no longer have access to your bank account that would be a problem. Should I just buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?

Yes, it's the simplest and safest way indeed : "buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?" (hide them well in your flat!)

Just note that, using "global fight against terrorism" as a pretext, France has implemented a new law, 6 months ago.. and as a result if you buy more than 1000 USD in Paris, you will have to show your ID card and be registered...

Just don't buy your USD in an airport or bank, rates suck at such places, you'll need to go change next to the Sentier, in central Paris. For good xchange rates I mean.

[Cheetah]

^^^^

Maybe it would be good for Dalaran to be registered and entered into a terrorism watch list. That might give him an easier time for visa and gaining French citizenship?!

[Direct or subtle]

(11-16-2015 10:01 PM)Cheetah Wrote:  

^^^^

Maybe it would be good for Dalaran to be registered and entered into a terrorism watch list. That might give him an easier time for visa and gaining French citizenship?!

Don't you worry, posting on RooshV forum should be more than enough to get him on some watch list. After all, red-pill manosphere is the Devil, just as much as ISIS. If not more, if not more!

[zatara]

2000 is really not enough to be worried about seriously investing it, especially if you're on a temporary contract and likely to be spending it when you finish up in the job. I'd just leave it in a easily accessed savings account in a bank until your contract is up, then spend it on a month in Asia or a few weeks in South America or wherever else tickles your fancy.

[the Thing]

(11-17-2015 08:05 AM)zatara Wrote:  

2000 is really not enough to be worried about seriously investing it, especially if you're on a temporary contract and likely to be spending it when you finish up in the job. I'd just leave it in a easily accessed savings account in a bank until your contract is up, then spend it on a month in Asia or a few weeks in South America or wherever else tickles your fancy.

This. I'm surprised that in Roosh V Forum where we discuss travelling halfway across the world to bang chicks, nobody is advising this dude to blow the money on chicks, get psyched, come back home and grind a better job.

[Dalaran1991]

(11-17-2015 08:13 AM)the Thing Wrote:  

(11-17-2015 08:05 AM)zatara Wrote:  

2000 is really not enough to be worried about seriously investing it, especially if you're on a temporary contract and likely to be spending it when you finish up in the job. I'd just leave it in a easily accessed savings account in a bank until your contract is up, then spend it on a month in Asia or a few weeks in South America or wherever else tickles your fancy.

This. I'm surprised that in Roosh V Forum where we discuss travelling halfway across the world to bang chicks, nobody is advising this dude to blow the money on chicks, get psyched, come back home and grind a better job.

I'm doing fine girls wise in Paris so I'm more concerned about securing my career right now. Sure a trip to pussy paradise wouldn't hurt but frankly given how things are I'm more worried about securing a safety fund so I wont get caught with my pants down if shit hits the fan.

[zatara]

(11-17-2015 02:07 PM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

I'm doing fine girls wise in Paris so I'm more concerned about securing my career right now. Sure a trip to pussy paradise wouldn't hurt but frankly given how things are I'm more worried about securing a safety fund so I wont get caught with my pants down if shit hits the fan.

Extensive long haul travel isn't just about girls - it's really something everyone should do to expand their horizons culturally, socially etc. I think when you're 70 years old and looking back at your life you'd be far more likely to appreciate that time you spent a month traveling Asia (or wherever) when you were 24 years old on that 2000eur than the alternative of being able to retire 6 months earlier in your late 60s on that 2000eur (and its compound interest). The window for long-term travel in your 20s closes surprisingly fast once you enter the career world...

If you think you're likely to be in a starvation situation once your temporary contract is up then yeah maybe keep it for a rainy day/rent fund though. Your best bet here would still be a savings account however if you believe there's a significant chance of you needing access to the funds in the short/medium term. A savings account should give you around 2% yearly return on investment with absolutely no risk, very little effort on your part, and very liquid access. The alternatives will require a lot more research and effort on your part, may limit your liquidity, and will open you to far more risk. You're also going to take a pounding on any EUR>USD>EUR FOREX exchange, or share trading, fees. This will likely erase any profit on any short term investment if you do make any - if not potentially knock you into negative returns..

I also wouldn't be worrying about losing access to banks and trying to physically hoard dollar bills under your mattress or anything, that's tinfoil hat territory. BNP Paribas (assuming you're in France, so using the largest bank there as a relevant example) got through the bad days of the worst of the credit crunch relatively unscathed, and is in an even less risky financial situation these days due to ongoing improvements in leverage ratios. Short of thermonuclear war breaking out it's unlikely to go anywhere in the near future.

[WestIndianArchie]

1).Emergency/ savings
2) Debt
3) Stocks/bonds
4) Skills/experiences/additional education

Cash money gives you a lot of breathing room.
Debt sticks around and erodes your power.
Ideally your faith in the market will be rewarded

Investing in yourself,( language, cooking, music, some other skill ) allows you to grow as a person

[StrikeBack]

Emergency / savings is the go for this.

Also, if I were your age again, I'd ask myself exactly why Im only saving 500 a month on a junior manager position's salary. Back then I was pissing money away on a lot of nonsense without questioning why...

[Direct or subtle]

If Dalaran1991 has followed my advice and bought US dollars two days ago, then he has now increased his savings by almost one percent. In just two days,.. because the Euro has lost 1% between the 16th and now...

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=E...SD&view=1W

[travolta]

(11-16-2015 02:15 PM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Thanks guys, I also think having a fuck you money fund would be a good idea.

However given how haywire things have been lately is it safe to put money in a bank account? If for some reasons shit goes down and you no longer have access to your bank account that would be a problem. Should I just buy dollar every 2-3 months and store it somewhere?

This is a legitimate concern. You can buy silver and gold and store it overseas. If your funds get locked in your bank account then your metals will be safe somewhere else.

[dispenser]

At that level, the best return you can get is from investing in yourself.

-Good mattress and blackout blinds
-Organic meat and veg
-A brown and black pair of casual leather shoes or boots, and a brown and black pair of dress shoes. Good shoes upgrade even the worst outfits. Budapest is known for its fine shoemakers e.g. Vass, but also no-name local shops.
-Two or three made to measure shirts. At least one white.
-Wool coat for winter, and a mac (i.e. a trenchcoat without bells and whistles) for summer. Needn't be tailor-made but could benefit from it.
-Grey or navy suit. Consider going to Italy to get one made. Naples or thereabouts.

-Private class in something that will improve your life directly: cooking, language, a technical subject related to your career e.g. coding, etc.

I realise this stuff doesn't chime with your mood at the moment, but the fundamentals of life never change. Eat well, sleep well, dress well.

From a practical point of view, the shoes and shirts would improve your interview odds for future jobs, and also make you look more managerial for your current job.
The shirts should last a few years, the shoes and coats a decade at least, and a suit would last the same if you got a bespoke one. They're a bargain if you think in the long term.
And they're also portable enough to flee Europe with, if it comes to that.