[robreke]

Say you have a great place lined up with good logistics - a 5 minute walk from your pad.

You're texting the girl the day of the date and she asks if it's okay to meet in another part of town (presumably more convenient for her)

Assume she's hot. She still wants to meet. Work with her? Refuse to budge? Somewhere in the middle? How do you proceed?

[TSC2295]

If it's still convenient to get to and not some place that I hated, I wouldn't care too much and would go along with it.

[WestIndianArchie]

(05-09-2015 03:01 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Say you have a great place lined up with good logistics - a 5 minute walk from your pad.

You're texting the girl the day of the date and she asks if it's okay to meet in another part of town (presumably more convenient for her)

Assume she's hot. She still wants to meet. Work with her? Refuse to budge? Somewhere in the middle? How do you proceed?

If she's doing this for convenience, she's some what setting a precedent. I can only see you when it's convenient to me. A lot of hardliners would just balk at that idea. Team Conversion doesn't care. As long as I can get you alone, it's curtains.

If she's doing it for defense, i.e. she's not really feeling you, but not sure if she doesn't feel you, but what's an easy out if the date doesn't go right - that's really when have to be on your best game.

This quasi gets into the idea of "bringing your "A" game" and whether or not you always bring your A game, what is overgaming, and other matters for the keyboard sages.

But if she's just a regular chick who's just into herself and is doing it for convenience, your regular charm, provocative statements, questions, flirting, touch, et cetera is all you need. Her geographical issue is just a formality.

If she's on defense, you really have to rebuild your case as to why she should be sleeping with you @ 9:00 pm instead of looking @ the dessert menu. You can't play it nearly as "cool", you have to really actively engage her mind and body, to such an extent that time flies away from her perspective. Where you might make her laugh on Type A date, you want her sides to split and wine to come out of her nose on a Type B date. Bolder and bigger, more fireworks, more action.

Overall these are your options
1) Stand Firm - insist on meeting at your place, risk losing the shot because of your stubbornness, but set the tone for the interaction and rest of the relationship

2) It'll be worth it but make it sound like it's going to be worth it. - I.E I had something special planned.

3) Reschedule - Similar to the Stand firm - "I had something special planned, but if you can't make it, we'll just have to meet again." - and then use that opportunity to get on other broads, but leaving the door open for this one, and she's no notice that your time is valuable

4) Counter Offer - If this is a matter of convenience,
a) different time that night,
b) different venue, but closer to your original venue (which is close to your spot)

5) Agree - and trust that you have the ability to overcome any of her objections to fast sex.

In your shoes, I'm most likely to agree and I would assume that it's not convenience but ambivalence. So I'd go to her place and then proceed to go in as deep and hard and as powerful as I could.

I would make whatever the activity you have planned as atypical as possible.

So if you're meeting for drinks and it's just an exchange of biographical information, spots of humor, spots of "awe", a few brilliant insights, touches, and glances (which is typically all you need in a lot of cases) - then the drinks date would transition to pool/shuffle board, karaoke, dancing...or something much more active and physical and prone to crack her world view.

A lot of the game is getting her off of her predetermined script. So you can't just play your role as normal, you have to improvise.

WIA

[robreke]

(05-09-2015 04:17 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

(05-09-2015 03:01 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Say you have a great place lined up with good logistics - a 5 minute walk from your pad.

You're texting the girl the day of the date and she asks if it's okay to meet in another part of town (presumably more convenient for her)

Assume she's hot. She still wants to meet. Work with her? Refuse to budge? Somewhere in the middle? How do you proceed?

If she's doing this for convenience, she's some what setting a precedent. I can only see you when it's convenient to me. A lot of hardliners would just balk at that idea. Team Conversion doesn't care. As long as I can get you alone, it's curtains.

If she's doing it for defense, i.e. she's not really feeling you, but not sure if she doesn't feel you, but what's an easy out if the date doesn't go right - that's really when have to be on your best game.

This quasi gets into the idea of "bringing your "A" game" and whether or not you always bring your A game, what is overgaming, and other matters for the keyboard sages.

But if she's just a regular chick who's just into herself and is doing it for convenience, your regular charm, provocative statements, questions, flirting, touch, et cetera is all you need. Her geographical issue is just a formality.

If she's on defense, you really have to rebuild your case as to why she should be sleeping with you @ 9:00 pm instead of looking @ the dessert menu. You can't play it nearly as "cool", you have to really actively engage her mind and body, to such an extent that time flies away from her perspective. Where you might make her laugh on Type A date, you want her sides to split and wine to come out of her nose on a Type B date. Bolder and bigger, more fireworks, more action.

Overall these are your options
1) Stand Firm - insist on meeting at your place, risk losing the shot because of your stubbornness, but set the tone for the interaction and rest of the relationship

2) It'll be worth it but make it sound like it's going to be worth it. - I.E I had something special planned.

3) Reschedule - Similar to the Stand firm - "I had something special planned, but if you can't make it, we'll just have to meet again." - and then use that opportunity to get on other broads, but leaving the door open for this one, and she's no notice that your time is valuable

4) Counter Offer - If this is a matter of convenience,
a) different time that night,
b) different venue, but closer to your original venue (which is close to your spot)

5) Agree - and trust that you have the ability to overcome any of her objections to fast sex.

In your shoes, I'm most likely to agree and I would assume that it's not convenience but ambivalence. So I'd go to her place and then proceed to go in as deep and hard and as powerful as I could.

I would make whatever the activity you have planned as atypical as possible.

So if you're meeting for drinks and it's just an exchange of biographical information, spots of humor, spots of "awe", a few brilliant insights, touches, and glances (which is typically all you need in a lot of cases) - then the drinks date would transition to pool/shuffle board, karaoke, dancing...or something much more active and physical and prone to crack her world view.

A lot of the game is getting her off of her predetermined script. So you can't just play your role as normal, you have to improvise.

WIA

^ Nice breakdown with different motives WIA. I like this thread in general because I and I'm sure others, have this happen.

For the particular girl in question, I agreed to a location "near down town" as she put it. However I qualified it:

Me : Sure, the xyz bar is close to where I'll be (not really true). Lets start there at 730.

Bottom line texts went back and forth. I could see the direction it was going so I lined up another girl at 830.

The girl in question cancels but I really think it was a matter of inconvenience with her which was one of your scenarios. She sent a very long text explaining she'd been buying stuff for her parents all day at Costco and her aunt's family showed up for mother's day today, etc. She asked to meet tomorrow and when I took a while to text back...even sent a picture of her aunt's family at the house (as proof I guess ) saying "lol aren't they cute though?"

Told her I'd let her know details of the date tomorrow.

So...tomorrow, I think I'm going to try to get her back to my original, logistically superior, venue to meet.

[monster]

Could be a for a good reason.

Maybe the place you suggested is where her ex hangs out. She doesn't want that. You don't want that.

Why not go with the flow. If the place sucks, say let's get outta here and go to place XYZ.

[Vincent Chase]

This is a hard one. The best thing to do is screen for logistics.

Does she live close to this bar? Does she live with friends? If you don't have answers to these questions I wouldn't bother meeting her somewhere more "convenient" for her sake or in the middle (which really doesn't suit either logistics).

If you can't get answers to those questions or sexualise enough before the date on potential for whether she might be DTF I genuinely wouldn't bother with it from a perspective of sex. If you want potentially something longer term and willing to be patient over a few dates then go ahead. I wouldn't bother myself. I would tell her "this place is good, trust me" or try rescheduling.

[rcraig33hb]

I've had this happen only once! The girl was Russian, very sexy and smart. She knew what she was doing. I like to be in control always...i give her credit for what she did.

I later found out she was a serial dater. She flipped my script to something in her favor, chose the location and also a venue that she liked. The location was a spot in Yorkville in downtown Toronto...that explained a lot. I normally would have stopped this but went along to observe her "game". She was really good.

Lesson Learned? Hell yes! If on a first date, if a girl is not cool enough to even let the man take full control then that to me is more of a yellow flag if anything and just proceed with caution.

[wagmydog]

I just next them. it's just a taste of more to come. she's telling you that she doesn't give a shit about your time and/or convenience. in my experience girls who did this always either flaked in the end, or if they did show up they were such cunts that there was no sex nor second date.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

Propose a compromise: Offer to pay for her taxi and she should come over to your place, because it's much better.
"Counteroffer - you come to my much better place and I take care of your cab fare. Deal?"

Usually it's a push of frame - the probability that it's not is low - some real reason.
In poorer countries it is often based on the fact that she must take bus, drive long hours etc. - is a big hindrance.

I know that we have a hesitation to pay for things here and it is a correct choice - still paying for her transportation closer to your sex-lair and paying for drinks to let go of her inhibitions are good exceptions.

[Basil Ransom]

Step 1: Clarify

She hits you with the request to change spots. You respond with

"Oh did something come up?"

Subtext: "You should have a good reason to change the date location, otherwise why would you?"

Step 2: Concede or Reschedule
If she offers a legitimate logistical excuse for shifting the date location (maybe her car is broken, she can't get to your area at the original time, etc), accommodate her logistics by going to her or altering the meeting time.

If she has no good excuse, say "oh we can just do a different day." You can then shore up your case by promising a specific fun date venue, near your house, naturally.

Subtext: "If you don't abide by our original agreement, I don't want to meet."

If she still tries to cajole you into meeting up by her, and she strikes you as very DTF, go for it - you might even test this by offering to meet her at her place, at least to start off the date. Otherwise, next her - she is going to drink on your dime and nothing more.

Changing the date setup (aside from a minor delay) the day of the date is an arrogant power move that's unacceptable without a solid logistical excuse. What's more, a girl who pulls it probably isn't DTF for you, unless she's just extremely lazy.

[The Wire]

(05-09-2015 03:01 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Assume she's hot. She still wants to meet. Work with her? Refuse to budge? Somewhere in the middle? How do you proceed?

Depends. I had one girl who basically refused to do the drive to my chosen spot and she really wanted me at her town(she refused to drink and drive...even 2 drinks). I agreed, the bar was near her apartment and she invited back to her place that night so you never really know. You don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face. If she has a legit reason i'd accommodate her but if she's doing it for compliance I would simple ask to reschedule that way you are doing it on your terms.

[The Wire]

robreke, can you clarify that she agreed to meet you at your location and then renege later on? Or did she just counter offer you that day with her spot?

[robreke]

Here's what's going down text wise now: I hit her up today and said "drinks at 7.30?"

She responded an hour later: Would 8 be cool? And at the xyz bar? ( xyz bar being the bar I agreed to change to yesterday from my original spot. I picked xyz because it was closer to down town....but it was because she said she preferred downtown)

I'm thinking of either just saying okay....as I've got nothing to do tonight or saying " let's do 8.15 at ABC bar. Best drinks in town. Deal?" (ABC bar being the one close to my pad)

[robreke]

(05-10-2015 03:57 PM)The Wire Wrote:  

robreke, can you clarify that she agreed to meet you at your location and then renege later on? Or did she just counter offer you that day with her spot?

I offered to meet her at my spot and she counter offered with: "Can we meet further south? " meaning something down town instead of uptown.

[slothpiece]

Bumping this thread since it rears its ugly head from time to time. There are some golden nuggets in here. I think I used to think DC had fewer attractive women. But when I am networking out the ass every week, I meet an early 20s 8 at least once every week. Getting them to commit to anything has been a chore. So I am often direct at the venue and suggest more insta venue changes to get a feel on their DTF vibe. Not a lot different than before, but I think I am going to state my intent more. Let's get out of here doesn't appear to be working for me as it used to. So I am working more on the rapport when I didn't care if I skipped it right to the close. Aside from this approach, we sometimes have to settle for a business card exchange to follow up on a meet one on one. And when you see more than once that a new girl you don't know very well tries to switch the venue last minute or says anything like it's not convenient for her, then I just go with Basil's advice to say another time and move on to others to maintain frame and to continue serving your abundance mentality.

[Mess O.]

I find that I'm running into this issue quite often, especially this shit where the girl latches onto a place, literally in her neighborhood - but 25 miles from mine. Fuck that. My most recent date, where she actually traveled that type of distance to see me - hell, that disaster may very well garner its own thread.

[Steelex]

IMO, Whether or not you fuck her is usually decided more before the date than during the date. If she's making a change, it's to accommodate what is probably going to happen.

Atleast that's my opinion. Most of my dates that ended in sex had a distinct vibe from the start. I could just tell that one way or the other we were going to fuck.

[RatInTheWoods]

Maybe she is setting the frame for the purposes of her logistics, she is close to her pad and ready to go for the kill.....

[kaotic]

Glad this post got bumped.

(04-29-2017 02:33 PM)Mess O. Wrote:  

I find that I'm running into this issue quite often, especially this shit where the girl latches onto a place, literally in her neighborhood - but 25 miles from mine. Fuck that. My most recent date, where she actually traveled that type of distance to see me - hell, that disaster may very well garner its own thread.

Females want comfort they want familiar OR at the most, halfway to them.

I never meet up with girls at their home base unless I know the girl is DTF or there is a high chance (see below).

Here's my rules:

1. Try to make them meet you at your local venues that you take dates to. Typically cheaper for you if you know the bartenders, adds SMV if their are other cuties there, build better relations with locals, bartenders, etc.

2. If they are hesistant, bullshit it, say you're driving the opposite way heading home.

EX: "Hey, I'm driving up from X (a city in the opposite direction) beacuse of work. Would you mind meet me at Y(Your city) - it'd help me out alot. I'll even give you a tour of the town" - doesn't have to be the exact wording.

I can't tell you how many times it's worked and the girl ends up coming my way, I've had a girl come get banged by me first date from over 75 miles away !

3. If local isn't possible, have her meet near your work IF it's halfway in between or near her. You should have some venues locked down local to work for dates and know the bartenders decently. I have 2 I go to less than 5 miles from work.

EX: "Hey I'll be running a bit late, how about we meet at X bar (near work, near her) and we can grab a drink there, I'll get ready after the gym, and meet you there" - once again you don't need to use this exact line, but you get the idea.

This gets them out of their comfort zone and home base.

I've done this plenty and scored a few first date bangs in my car this way. Bitches love excitement.

4. Don't got to them unless they're inviting you over to their pad. UNLESS you have a pretty strong gut feeling that they're down to fuck. As in sexting, nudes, hinting at banging, or they invite you over, etc.

One thing to note is you don't want to scare the cat, so this would be my last option with a girl worth driving for.

(04-29-2017 03:08 PM)Steelex Wrote:  

IMO, Whether or not you fuck her is usually decided more before the date than during the date. If she's making a change, it's to accommodate what is probably going to happen.

Atleast that's my opinion. Most of my dates that ended in sex had a distinct vibe from the start. I could just tell that one way or the other we were going to fuck.

Cosign with Steelex, usually a chick's made up her mind that she wants to bang you before meeting up. At the bare minimum is entertaining the thought in her head.

It's on you to help convince her she was right.

You get a gut feeling, especially when chatting her up, you look at her body language, how she talks to you, how she stares at you.

Almost every single date that I banged that same night started out with some key factors:

-She was enthusiastic
-She was shy and opened up and was warm
-She kept drinking with me
-She didn't mind anywhere we went
-She took the bait suggesting movies, collections, etc.

[Steelex]

Kaotic is on point.

The ones that want it don't make it too much of a hassle. Maybe she wants to fuck at her place cause she feels safer there. Who fuckin knows.

IMO, intra-date strategy is overrated. Stick to the basics. Chill, drink a bit, go to the house, get it in.

Maybe I'm quick to give up, but I have found that most any resistance except last minute resistance is a sign that it ain't gonna happen. Not worth my time, cause I've been down that road 100 times before and 9/10 it ends shitty.

She should act like you're Ryan Reynolds.

[Vincent Chase]

Part of the excitement for women is to go to a guy's place, check it out and in her mind "whatever happens happens". Most mid 20s women have been to dozens and dozens of guys places, like a dog observing and sniffing around trying to see what the guy is really about, she doesn't fuck all of them but she does fuck some of them.

I definitely agree with Kaotic that you should only go to her's if she's clearly down to fuck. In bigger cities this is quite unlikely as she's usually sharing with flatmates and so on, not many girls live by themselves. Why would I invest more than her (by going out of my way) to meet her? I actually did that once and there turned out to be no logistics to bang (always check before the date if you do this, turns out she lived with her mum) and she asked me why I went all the way there to see her even though she invited me. Logistics is a man's responsibility, and if you fuck it up it's your fault and they may even call you out on it especially if they're interested.

I can count in one hand the number of women who invited me to theirs or close to their place and we sealed the deal. I would need many hands for the number of her coming to me or a few minutes away.

The general rule is to meet as close as possible to where you have logistics. Failing that you would need very good reasons (she's as close as possible as DTF as you can get etc) to do anything else.

[Beirut]

I am with WIA on this one. The OP says first date. So i will assume you dont really have much of an upper hand in the relationship.
If its someone you have communicated with a long time, then sometimes you have the dynamic where you are dominant and tell her what to do.
But if you dont really know eachother yet, you dont have the attraction built up enough to do that.

Getting into a lengthy tug of war over location and logistics isnt very productive at this stage. I usually dont sweat the logistics/timing issues, the priority is getting her on the date now. You can establish the vibe and dynamic there.

I dont see a FLUID way to argue and stand your ground on this if she insists. It can often degrade into a vibe killer. Unless the girl is already a bit weak in her frame.

[Pointer]

No offence but that's some terrible advice: turning down a date if she's not DTF. This shit might work in North America where girls go on dates for sport but some of the best girls I've dated took at least 2-3 dates to seal the deal.
On the first date I don't stick to one location, I like to bounce between venues: 2 bars, a coffee shop then a bar or either of those followed by a walk around the city. Restaurants and other places where you have to sit face to face interview style are a no go. If she suggests a restaurant then say you just finished eating, how about a drink instead ? Nothing stops you from meeting at her suggested venue than bouncing to a second location closer to your place.

[Gmac]

Just say no.

[kaotic]

(05-01-2017 07:38 AM)Pointer Wrote:  

No offence but that's some terrible advice: turning down a date if she's not DTF. This shit might work in North America where girls go on dates for sport but some of the best girls I've dated took at least 2-3 dates to seal the deal.
On the first date I don't stick to one location, I like to bounce between venues: 2 bars, a coffee shop then a bar or either of those followed by a walk around the city. Restaurants and other places where you have to sit face to face interview style are a no go. If she suggests a restaurant then say you just finished eating, how about a drink instead ? Nothing stops you from meeting at her suggested venue than bouncing to a second location closer to your place.

So you're suggesting 3 venues than a walk ?

That's a waste of time and money, I can understand hopping 2-3 bars.

You sit face to face or side by side at a bar, same thing except you aren't eating but drinking.

Maybe in a metro or large city you can meet near her place then go to yours sure, but in a suburban or small town setting it might be difficult.

It's not terrible advice to turn down a girl if she isn't DTF, if that's your main goal, and you have plenty of OPTIONS, then you can choose who you go on a date with that night and find the girl with the highest probability that you can fuck.