[Enigma]

Since I've joined, I've noticed numerous threads and discussions about becoming a bartender and other aspects of the food and beverage industry. I want to share the knowledge and personal experiences gained from working in restaurants full-time for a few years to give guys the low down: the good, the bad, the do's, and the don't's.

This information will obviously not be useful to everyone but should at very least help cut down on such threads. Also, working in a restaurant can be a decent option for people with little experience in other fields and college students or other people who value a flexible work schedule and minimal commitment to their job. The average player can benefit from a better understanding of the operations of the restaurants and bars they frequent.

I have worked most job positions in a restaurant, from busser, to bartender, to dishwasher, to line cook. I've worked everywhere from sub shops to fine dining, small mom-and-pop joints to the world's largest full-service restaurant company. I've worked with everyone from guys on work release to nationally recognized and award winning chefs. I also know some of the main things managers look for from applicants, straight from the horses mouth.

I did all of this in and around one of the most well-respected culinary cities in the country. That being said, the information in this guide may be incomplete or even incorrect based on your area/restaurant. Please feel free to share any input.

Here's your first lesson in restaurant worker speak. F&B = food and beverage. Usually refers to restaurant and bar workers. Can also include fast food, hotel employees, and other members of the "service" industry. F&B workers often share a kind of fraternal connection with others in their field.

More F&B lingo:

Front-of-the-house or "FOH": This refers to those restaurant employees who work "out front" i.e. with the customers or "guests". This includes hosts, bartenders, etc.

Back-of-the-house or "BOH": This refers to those restaurant employees who work "in back" i.e. in the kitchen. This includes cooks, dishwashers, etc.

This guide will deal mostly with information pertaining to FOH. This is the higher paying area (from a more entry level perspective) and where I have the most experience.

Advantages of working F&B (FOH):

1. Higher paying than many other non-degree jobs and strong work-to-pay ratio: With only a few years experience, I was averaging anywhere from $20-30/hr at my last job. $10/hr is very doable as a host. There are bartenders that pull my weekly earnings in a good night at the right spot.

2. Always hiring and jobs are relatively easy to get: There will always be a demand for full-service restaurant employees. This is something that can not be outsourced. Eating out may decline slightly in many areas during a down economy but there are still restaurants popping up left and right in my city. Also, turnover is high compared to other industries. There's almost always someone who just quit or got fired. I've known numerous people with one or more degrees who were still serving tables.

3. Extreme schedule flexibility (with the right gig): Some people only work nights while in school, others have "real jobs" during the week and only work weekends (the "money" shifts), some people only work days shifts during the week, etc. This can be a great job if you're in school or have various side hustles. I would say dinner shifts are usually more profitable but there are plenty of spots where the opposite is true. At one point, I was day trading and then going to work after the markets closed.

4. Access to women: Many of your fellow FOH employees will be women. Depending on the spot, many of them will be in their late teens-early 20s. Most of them are sluts. Half of the people that eat at the restaurant will be women. Some will be attractive and you have a built in excuse to talk to them.

5. Parties/social life, etc.: People in F&B like to party. They go out, they do drugs, they fuck. I tried not to get too caught up in this aspect (except the fucking, of course) because I had no desire to spend all the money I made working in one bar at another bar and get stuck in this perpetual cycle like some of these fools but the opportunities are there if you so choose to pursue them. Also, like I mentioned, F&B has a fraternal aspect to it. You know that tipping bartenders well helps right?

Well, knowing you're F&B means they assume you're going to tip well before you even do and also separates you from Joe Random in their eyes off the bat. They know you understand what they deal with and will usually be more comfortable with you right off the bat. This can be a great way to help "lock down" a place if you're not quite on G or McQueen's level yet.

Do not get the wrong impression from this post. I absolutely despise serving tables now. Bartending is more bearable but still not something I really want to do anymore. So without further ado,

Disadvantages of working F&B (FOH):

1. "Serving" people: As a man, my natural inclination is not to serve. As a young guy still getting their shit together, it pays the bills, but I'm no longer working in a restaurant and hopefully I never go back.

2. Constant talking: Some people may have less of a problem with this than I do. One of the reasons I first wanted to serve tables is because I'm a natural introvert. It helped in the long run but I would be mentally exhausted after a serving shift. Sure, it's great to have a job where you can socialize until you're having a day where you really just want to sit back and scheme but you are required to keep running your mouth. It got boring "meeting" new people, especially since many of them were assholes. Also, you're going to have to sell shit if you want to get the really good jobs and you'll be pitching to 100s of people per day.

3. Kissing ass: This is something I generally refused to do. I'm not going to act friendly with people who are rude to me. If you ask for something in a blatantly rude way, you will be lucky to get it by the end of your meal. Depending on who you are and your general competence, this may get you in trouble. Being a fairly attractive, in-shape, likeable guy helped me immensely in this industry. Some women just want to see if you'll put up with their bullshit. If you don't bite, they start purring like kittens.

4. Stress: This job can be extremely stressful. Even the most miniscule mistake can create a domino effect that fucks up your whole night (and $$$$$). When you work somewhere that is extremely busy and you're getting slammed non-stop for 4-10+ hours straight, it can really suck. I experienced this moreso because I'm somewhat of a perfectionist.

If you play sports you can also relate to this...when you first start playing a sport or join an organization or more to another level (Peewee to JV to Varisty, etc.), everything moves so fast. You can feel overwhelmed at times. Eventually, the "game" slows down and it becomes easy. But shitty customers or managers can still stress you out.

Also, the unpredictable money at certain places can suck. Fortunately, I'm good at saving so I always had something to fall back on and didn't have to worry too much about this.

5. Status: Bartenders have decent status and I found that working in higher quality restaurants wasn't as bad but telling someone you are a waiter at Applebee's doesn't exactly impress them

FOH job positions:


- Bar back ($)
- Bartender ($$$)
- Busser ($)
- Cocktail Server ($$)
- Food Runner ($)
- Food Expediter or "Expo" ($)
- Host ($)
- Server (Waiter/Waitress) ($$)
- Server Assistant or "SA" ($)
- To-Go specialist ($)

*$ - the more dollar signs, the more money these positions make on average

Note: I don't believe any restaurant has all of those positions. Some positions can be combined, some can be eliminated.

Job Descriptions:

1. Host - Greets guest's at the door and seats them. Manages wait list. Some places will require hosts to do any or all of the following: bus/clean tables, move/separate/combine tables, answer phones, take to-go orders, provide "open counts" to kitchen (tells the kitchen the number of seated guests who have not ordered, giving them ana idea of what volume to expect in the near future)

Requirements - Entry-level. Any idiot can host. There are definitely places where it's harder than others but most of the guys could get hired and excel here with no experience.

Approximate pay - $8-$15/hour.

2. Busser - Clear tables of dirty dishes, clean tables, "reset" tables, take out trash, refill ice bins, roll silverware. These guys are basically the servers bitch and do most of the dirty work. These guys can actually do pretty well in the right place but they have one of the worst jobs.

Requirements - Entry-level. I've met some borderline retarded cats who were great bussers. If you're a hard worker and in decent shape, you will likely shit on most of the bussers you work with.

Approximate pay - $10-20/hour

3. Server Assistant (SA) - This is basically a smarter, less dirty busser. Usually have similar duties but can also be required to greet guests at the table, get drinks, provide bread service, etc. This is usually a position at higher-end spots.

Requirements - Mid-level. You can get this job without experience but you will interact more with guests and need a higher skill level overall so many places like to see that you have some experience.

Approximate pay - Equal or slightly higher than bussers.

4. Bar back - Similar to a server assistant for bartenders. Cleans, stocks, and otherwise mainstains the bar. Sometimes makes drinks and bullshits with bar guests. Can be shitty but it's a good position to work up to bartender from.

Requirements - Entry-level. Usually don't need experience to get this job but you will need some intelligence to move up depending on where you work. I knew a former bar manager who got stuck bar backing at this spot I worked at briefly.

Approximate pay - Depends. This is one of the few positions I've never worked. You can make good money certain places but might be closer to an SA/Busser's pay at another.

5. Food Runner - Runs food, gets stuff for tables (silverware, condiments, etc.) if needed, random busywork like rolling silverware or food prep.

Requirements - Entry-level. You can be a dumb ass.

Approximate pay - $8-15/hour

6. Expeditor (Expo) - The buffer between the cooks and the table/servers. Arranges orders, ensures food gets to the table, adds minor things like garnishes and manages plate presentation. This position will sometimes be combined with food runner.

Requirements - Mid-level. This job can actually be very difficult and really sucks in my opinion. The whole restaurant will crash and burn without a good expo and you don't get paid enough for that responsibility. You can get some of these jobs without experience but you need a passing level of intelligence. For instance, some places uses managers or sous chefs as expos. High-end places will definitely require experience.

Approximate pay - $10-$15/hour

7. To-go specialist - Answers phone, takes to-go orders over the phone and in person, expos to-go orders, sometimes bring orders outside, takes payments, maintains a cash drawer. Not all restaurants have a specific position for this. It can be allocated to the host or bartender.

Requirements - Mid-level. This was my first FOH job but the level of responsibility will vary depending on the spot. They make good money at certain spots but you will need experience to get those jobs.

Approximate pay - $10-$20+/hour; even though I list their hourly as equal, this position makes more than bussers on average and is preferable in my opinion.

8. Server - Takes orders, sells shit, brings and refills drinks, takes payments, and generally does whatever else a table wants. Responsibilities vary greatly from place to place. I've worked places where servers have to bus their own tables, run their own food, roll silverware, and do an hour of sidework after their shift. I've worked placed where you don't have to do anything but take care of your guests.

Requirements - Mid-level. You can get a serving job without experience but it probably won't be a good one and it definitely helps to at least have some kind of restaurant experience. There are plenty of idiots who can serve but the best ones are usually fairly intelligent/talented, knowledgeable, and decent salesman.

Approximate pay - Varies greatly. Anywhere from $8-30+/hour. $10 sucks. $15 is decent. $20 and above is good. This is based on averages because you will always have nights where you make more than others. You can make $50 on an 8 hour shift or $200 in 5. I've had shifts where I literally only made $5 in tips but the last place I worked, I rarely walked out without $100 and would often make $200-300.

9. Cocktail server - These are almost exclusively girls and work mostly in a bar environment. Very similar to a server but they don't work with food as much.

Requirements - Similar to servers.

Approximate pay - Varies, again. Often higher than a normal servers because they're attractive girls getting surrounded by drunkards.

10. Bartender - Makes drinks, bullshit with guests, take food orders, maintain bar. The responsibilities here can vary greatly just like servers. Some places only have a service bar so you'll be making drinks rung in by servers for their tables and taking to-go orders. You might have to clean and inventory your whole bar at the end of the night, you might have a bar back that does all of that for you.

Requirements - High-level. If you get a bartending job without experience and a very good connect, it is a shitty job. If you do get lucky and bullshit your way into a decent gig, it will likely blow up in your face. Every good bartending job is either very busy or very high-end and you will get eaten alive without experience. When you have a full bar, 10 tickets hanging out of your printer, a group of servers at the end of the bar glaring at you and talking shit because you're taking forever with their drinks, and some dipshit is demanding a Moscow Mule or some other crazy fucking drink that you have absolutely know clue how to make, you will know why.

Bartenders are usually some of the most experienced people in the restaurant or bar. The last high-end spot I worked at, the bartenders were guys 30+ who had been doing that shit forever. One cat was a licensed sommelier. Another had won awards from liquor companies for drinks he had created.

I'm not trying to discourage someone who actually wants to be a bartender or make it seems like rocket science. There are still plenty of doofuses that do it. But this isn't something you just decide "oh, bartending seems fun", pick up on the side, and a week later you're Tom Cruise in Cocktail bathing in cash and doing blow off a stripper's asshole in the walk-in cooler.

You can definitely move up faster than the average person if you learn to push the issue and use leverage. Start out in another position or at a lower end bar and you can bullshit your way back there before long. Get some experience making tons of drinks quickly and learn the recipes and methods and you can turn that into a better gig. Bullshitting your way into a lower end bar position and turning that experience into a higher paying bar position will be much easier.

Approximate pay: Varies GREATLY. Usually, bartenders are some of the highest paid people in the restaurant. That being said, there are jobs where you can make $500-1000 in a good night. There are other places where you'll make $100 or even less.

*Those bar certificates that you can get by taking classes are generally useless.
**If you have big tits and wear low-cut shirts, ignore everything I just said about bartending because you will get a job at a lower-end bar regardless and nobody will care how much you suck


Getting a job:

1. Dress professionally: You don't have to go all out here. A clean button-up, some slacks or chinos, and a decent pair of shoes will be good enough for most places. I've seen way too many dumb asses applying for jobs in shorts and a t-shirt, though.

2. Apply between 2 p.m. and 4 p.m. on a weekday: Tuesday through Thursday is ideal. Some places prefer you don't apply on Monday, many prefer that you avoid Friday. DO NOT turn in an application at any other time and ESPECIALLY not on the weekends, unless specifically stated by management. This period between the lunch and dinner rush is when the vast majority of restaurants accept applications and hold interviews.

*Some restaurants/bars do not open until 4 or later. Knock on the door. Someone will let you in.

3. Be discerning about the experience you list: If you don't have restaurant experience, list what you do have experience in with a preference for related fields (customer service, etc.). The nicer and more respected the place, the better. Managers (especially at nicer spots) will give more weight to experience at Big Baller Troll Bar & Grill than to Applebee's experience. DO NOT list a job unless you worked there AT LEAST 6 months, preferably a year. I would hope this would be common sense to the fellas on the forum but I want to explicitly clear about this.

*Consider lying on your application if you're having a hard time getting hired. Most places don't check. References you have to be a little more careful with. Be smart about it though. Exaggerate, don't completely fabricate. You will be trained when you start but, for instance, if you get a bartending job and you have never bartended, this will be painfully obvious 5 minutes into your first shift.

4. Give the application DIRECTLY to a manager and push for an insta-interview: Don't get your application shuffled into a stack, especially if your experience/resume is anything short of outstanding. Whether you bring in a previously filled out application or you sit and complete on when you get there, ask if their is a manager you can speak with. I would suggest talking to either a hostess or the bartender if they don't seem busy. Most servers won't give two fucks about you.

You want the manager to meet you and see that you're a cool guy who is dressed professionally. Many will sit you down for an interview on the spot. Sometimes you will be hired then and there.

5. If you do not already have the job, go back IN PERSON to follow up: Do not call on the phone. Go back to the restaurant, during the same times, a few days to a week later. "I wanted to follow up on an application I turned in, is there a manager I can speak to?" Be as persistent as possible without being a jackass. The people that canvas the neighborhood with applications never to be heard from again do not get jobs.

If the manager told you they would call you back within a certain period of time or you have a 1st or 2nd interview scheduled, do not go back before that obviously. But until they specifically tell you you're not getting a job, keep trying.

Optional:

- Check Craigslist or otherwise find out who is hiring: Most busier places are always accepting applications but knowing what places are looking to filll positions immediately is always good. This will save you time and effort. Decent places will occasionally advertise openings on CL.

- Having an "in": Knowing someone who works at a particular spot and can vouch for you is very helpful but not necessary. Managers will listen to their good employees if they recommend someone.

- Provide a resume: I never bothered with this but I suppose it can't hurt. You'll still be required to fill out an application though.

Working your way up:

1. Get your foot in the door: If you have no experience, host, busser, bar back, or to-go are your friends. If you want to serve immediately, accept that you're likely gonna start out at a lesser restaurant. Even if you do have experience, if you want to work a particular gig, consider taking what they'll give you to get in there.

2. Work hard and smart: Easy. Do what's asked of you and do it right. You will be one of the smartest people in the average restaurant.

3. Request a promotion: A few months in, ask to be moved up. If you have been handling your business, this may or may not work. At the very least get crosstrained into another position to make yourself more marketable. You're more valuable if you have experience as a host AND busser even though neither of those positions is better than the other.

*Remember when I talked about exaggerating on your application? So, you worked at a spot for six months as a busser. You get trained serving. Now you add server next to this restaurant on your resume and it looks like you were working there as a server for six months

4. Leverage your experience: If you don't get the promotion or you simply outgrow the place you're at, start applying elsewhere. This is one of the few industries that you can walk in an interview on the spot. Well-dressed, professional, sociable, and persistent with a passable resume gets you a job.

5. Push the issue but avoid burning bridges: If you want to move up quickly, you will have to bounce around but remember that if you leave a job before 6 months to a year you have are forfeiting that time when it comes to your resume. Trust me, I've walked out of jobs in the middle of the shift but only because the job sucked that bad and I knew I wouldn't need to list that job on my resume. On the other hand, I know my resume is strong enough to pay the bills in a pinch and I can still be rehired at certain decent paying spots without a problem.

To give you an example, this was my trajectory:

- First job at a corporate chain (job #1) as a to-go specialist; cross-trained on host immediately
- Cross-trained on expo a couple months in
- After about four months I was pushing to serve
- After six months (total since starting) and not being made a server, I got a job at a busier corporate chain (job #2) as a busser and put in my two weeks at job #1
- Three months in I asked to serve
- A month later, I applied at a less busy restaurant (job #3) as a server and was hired
- Worked both jobs but was eventually taken off the schedule at job #2 because I was only working once or twice per week (still rehirable/no bridges burned)
- After a few months serving at job #3, I went back to job #2 and used my newly acquired serving experience and good name to get on there as a server making more money
- Worked both jobs until I was eventually taken off the schedule at job #3 because I was only working there once or twice a week and was generally a dick when I was there
- Got a serving job at another corporate chain (job #4) in a better area
- Worked both jobs about equally because job #4 sucked ass
- Leveraged job #4 by telling job #3 I would come back full-time if they made me bartender
- They refused so I found yet another serving job at a privately-owned fine-dining spot (job #5) and quit job #4 without notice
- job #5 was an overall disaster and I eventually decided I would see how hard it would be for me to get fired; didn't take long, actually
- in the meantime I had left job #2 and started at job #6 at a privately owned restaurant (for a brief period I had 3 different serving jobs)
- job #6 wasn't that great either but I convinced them to train me behind the bar but they didn't get much bar business
- I stuck around for about six months total before starting job #7 at another privately owned restaurant where I was pulling $800-1000

In summary, in about 2-3 years I went from no experience to one of the more sought after and high paying jobs around and basically tripled my income. That's despite the fact that I wasted about six months with two worthless restaurants. I know this can be replicated because I'm not even particularly outgoing and bullshitted most of my menu knowledge.

Corporate vs. Privately-owned -

This is essentially government job vs. private-sector. One is a little more secure but the other tends to have a higher pay ceiling. They're both owned by scumbags but the private owners are much more out in the open about it. It can be nice working at a place without as much structure but the lack of professionalism and shadiness can wear on you after a while.

Fine-dining vs. Turn-and-burn (high volume):

They both have their advantages. I liked fine-dining because you are dealing with a higher quality of people, you are getting tipped appropriately, and making more money per table. However, you need a higher attention to detail, be more knowledgeable, and can't be as much of an asshole. High-volume, lower end spots are good because you can mostly bullshit your way through it all and get away with more but it becomes a grind and you're often dealing with a bunch of rednecks and dumbasses.

TL;DR tips for players just trying to smash some waitresses

- they're almost all sluts
- the hostesses are the easiest/dumbest and usually more attractive anyways
- they're open to being gamed if you're not "creepy"
- if you're attractive, they will tell the other girls about you and they will all sneak a peek; many are boy crazy
- they flirt to make money, obviously, but they care about dick just as much as money so don't assume they're trying to play you if your game is actually good; this goes more for waitresses at regular restaurants, cocktail servers in bars and more hardened
- many of them will be grabbing a drink after their shift anyways
- go when it's slower; even vetted bar sluts will be dying to talk to you if it's dead...get a table by the hostess stand when it's slow and game away

[Beyond Borders]

Great post. I used to work hospitality - coffee shops and delis and then after high school serving and finally bartending (in restaurants, bars, and hip hop clubs). Never started as a busser anywhere, but if I was looking to get my foot in the door I'd jump in there and move up quick.

I think the most enjoyable of all was bartending in restaurants, though it doesn't pay as well as tending in the late-night party spots. More laid-back pace, customers are more chill and intelligent (and less drunk), and there's more of a focus on high-quality drinks. And plenty of good grub. And bartenders in these types of places tend to get more respect than waiters, from both the customers and the staff.

These jobs are no joke - I've worked my ass of doing manual labor before, but I'd say no job has ever taxed me as much as trying to hold down a busy restaurant or bar during a rush. The mental strain of hyper-multitasking in a fast-paced environment like that is a lot more intense than is easy to explain to someone who's never done it. And if you're really zooming, it wears you out physically too. By the time you get home, you're drained.

But I miss it sometimes too. It's a cool lifestyle, overall. You're eating good, you're showing people a good time, practicing your social skills, and flirting with girls. Always a few lookers among the staff. Sometimes I actually think it'd be fun to go do it seasonally somewhere. At one restaurant I worked in Santa Cruz, there were two men in their early 50s who had been working there for decades. They'd travel the world in their off-time and show up in the spring to work the busy season.

Quote:

2. Work hard and smart: Easy. Do what's asked of you and do it right. You will be one of the smartest people in the average restaurant.

This is so true. It's really easy to become the "go-to" guy and move up quick in a restaurant. Most of the other employees have zero ambition, need to be micro-managed just to do the run-of-the-mill stuff that comes with every shift, and aren't very bright overall. They just want to collect their paycheck and run back to their real lives, which typically means college or the 24/7 party-schedule of a young 20-something.

A lot of the people in this industry are really fun though too - people who flock to the industry tend to have great social skills, be somewhat attractive, and like to entertain and party. I worked a couple hospitality jobs down in Santa Cruz for a while - one on the boardwalk - and we'd get off our shift and all head straight to Happy Hour. Good times. Brings some nostalgia.

I think a Roosher could do a lot worse than moving somewhere like Napa Valley and spending 10 years in the industry, if not making a cool career out of it. Tons of hot young women in Napa too that have moved there for this very reason. It's a haven for old people but hit the bars around 10:30 or 11 as all the fancy restaurants start closing down and the lizzard potential is off the hook.

[Enigma]

(10-13-2013 11:37 PM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  

Great post. I used to work hospitality - coffee shops and delis and then after high school serving and finally bartending (in restaurants, bars, and hip hop clubs). Never started as a busser anywhere, but if I was looking to get my foot in the door I'd jump in there and move up quick.

Bussing isn't all bad compared to plenty of other shit you could be doing. I was averaging like $10-12 per hour but there are spots where you can do better.

Quote:

I think the most enjoyable of all was bartending in restaurants, though it doesn't pay as well as tending in the late-night party spots. More laid-back pace, customers are more chill and intelligent (and less drunk), and there's more of a focus on high-quality drinks. And plenty of good grub. And bartenders in these types of places tend to get more respect than waiters, from both the customers and the staff.

Bartending in general can be fun.

Quote:

These jobs are no joke - I've worked my ass of doing manual labor before, but I'd say no job has ever taxed me as much as trying to hold down a busy restaurant or bar during a rush. The mental strain of hyper-multitasking in a fast-paced environment like that is a lot more intense than is easy to explain to someone who's never done it. And if you're really zooming, it wears you out physically too. By the time you get home, you're drained.

Very true. There are probably few jobs that compare to the pace of an extremely busy restaurant. Combine that with the fact that you're constantly on your feet and your pay depends on your performance, it can get crazy. I've seen plenty of people lose their shit

Quote:

But I miss it sometimes too. It's a cool lifestyle, overall. You're eating good, you're showing people a good time, practicing your social skills, and flirting with girls. Always a few lookers among the staff. Sometimes I actually think it'd be fun to go do it seasonally somewhere. At one restaurant I worked in Santa Cruz, there were two men in their early 50s who had been working there for decades. They'd travel the world in their off-time and show up in the spring to work the busy season.

I've read about guys with bartending experience picking up gigs under the table at hostels and such. It can be a pretty marketable skill if you know what you're doing.

There was a site I came across once that offered a bunch of seasonal jobs with accommodation at national parks and ski resorts and whatnot. Many of them were hospitality related and you'd actually be working in a restaurant, etc. I know people like to avoid the winter but I always though it'd be cool to work at a ski resort for a season, hitting the slopes for free and stacking bread then head off for somewhere tropical.

Quote:

This is so true. It's really easy to become the "go-to" guy and move up quick in a restaurant. Most of the other employees have zero ambition, need to be micro-managed just to do the run-of-the-mill stuff that comes with every shift, and aren't very bright overall. They just want to collect their paycheck and run back to their real lives, which typically means college or the 24/7 party-schedule of a young 20-something.

Yeah, dude. You'll find some really knowledgeable and professional cats who treat is as a serious career in the higher-end spots but it's not hard to beat the average with minor effort.

I had to do an "audition" at the last place I worked and I was stressing because I didn't know what they were looking for. I just treated it like a simple "follow" shift and everyone was like "OMG you're doing so good!"

I'll start a job that fucking sucks and there will be people who have been working there for years when they could walk across the street and get a job making more money and doing less work. Many of these people have lack even the most basic sense of drive.

Quote:

A lot of the people in this industry are really fun though too - people who flock to the industry tend to have great social skills, be somewhat attractive, and like to entertain and party. I worked a couple hospitality jobs down in Santa Cruz for a while - one on the boardwalk - and we'd get off our shift and all head straight to Happy Hour. Good times. Brings some nostalgia.

True. Definitely some cool people in the right spots but also plenty of scumbag losers along the way. It can be really fun though when you find the right environment for you.

Quote:

I think a Roosher could do a lot worse than moving somewhere like Napa Valley and spending 10 years in the industry, if not making a cool career out of it. Tons of hot young women in Napa too that have moved there for this very reason. It's a haven for old people but hit the bars around 10:30 or 11 as all the fancy restaurants start closing down and the lizzard potential is off the hook.

That would be dope. Like you mentioned earlier, you eat and drink good and are always surrounded by women. Free or discounted meals every day. One place I worked I would literally come in, order some french toast or an omelette, work for a while, order a sandwich or salad. I would eat two or three meals per day there and only end up spending $5 or $10 at most for really good quality food.

Tastings are the best though.

[Capitán Peligroso]

Great information, solid advice. +1

[Merenguero]

Excellent original post. I strongly agree with most of its content. Besides practicing law, every job I have ever had has been in a restaurant. There are therefore some things that I would like to add.

Expediting and food running can be the same job. In a large kitchen, sometimes among expeditors, they decide who will stay in the kitchen for the night and who will be running the food. The reason for this is that some people are better at carrying trays and other people are faster at organizing the dinners and getting them ready to be served. I have worked in places, however, where food running and expediting were two entirely separate jobs. The amount which an expeditor/food runner earns is generally slightly less than the amount which a busser earns. At least in New Jersey, expeditor/food runners earn at least minimum wage plus tips. The amount of tips is of course a lower percentage than what a busser earns, but the busser also earns less than minimum wage, at least in larger restaurants. The main advantage to working as an expeditor/food runner is that those people typically finish earlier than all other restaurant staff with the exception of the hostesses. Cooks obviously cannot leave until the last dinner is served and they typically have a ton of extra work that they have to do before they leave. Servers have to stay until their last table pays their check and often have a considerable amount of sidework to do before they can leave. Bussers are often the last to leave as they have to stay until after the last table leaves, then have to perform such duties as sweeping. Expeditors/food runners are often out of there as soon as the last dinner is served and they perform a minimal amount of sidework. It never seemed to be nearly as much sidework as the servers and bussers had to do.

As far as meeting women on the job, the possibility usually only exists for bartenders and servers. The obvious reason for that is that those are the main two positions where there is a great deal of interaction with customers. I remember there was this one guy who worked with me as a busser. He was a 16 or 17 year old high school kid. We worked at what was then the second highest grossing restaurant in the United States (It may still be). Every time he would see an above-average girl in the place, which was approximately every five minutes, he would drop a piece of paper with his number in front of her and say, "You dropped something." I have no idea of what, if any, success he had doing this. I'm sure he had some positive results. Later in the summer, he was fired (being fired at this particular restaurant basically meant a five-day unpaid vacation) under some pretext, but I'm pretty sure it was because of the numbers. At the Jersey Shore and in Miami, I never notice a large number of quality women eating out alone. It seems to be much more common in New York and in Southern California.

In my experience, you definitely need to know someone, or even multiple people, in order to have a chance of working at many of the top restaurants. I person with little or no experience can have an edge over a person with extensive experience in many cases if he knows someone.

[BeerandFlannel]

I currently bartend in a local microbrewery. I had never worked in the industry before, but it was my standard first date place and I knew the manager. It's a great "work through grad school" job. I meet a lot of interesting people, see a lot of free concerts, and meet the occasional girl. The women who visit microbreweries aren't the most attractive as a rule, but that's why I sign up to work shows!

[Christian McQueen]

Great data sheet.

+1 OP.

[Cattle Rustler]

(10-14-2013 07:01 PM)BeerandFlannel Wrote:  

I currently bartend in a local microbrewery. I had never worked in the industry before, but it was my standard first date place and I knew the manager. It's a great "work through grad school" job. I meet a lot of interesting people, see a lot of free concerts, and meet the occasional girl. The women who visit microbreweries aren't the most attractive as a rule, but that's why I sign up to work shows!

I never thought about this but you're on the spot.

Microbrewery girls are smarter, cause less drama, and are more well off than the regular girl. Sure, they might not be wine and champagne bimbos but they're pretty good.

[Enigma]

(10-14-2013 06:58 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

Excellent original post. I strongly agree with most of its content. Besides practicing law, every job I have ever had has been in a restaurant. There are therefore some things that I would like to add.

Expediting and food running can be the same job. In a large kitchen, sometimes among expeditors, they decide who will stay in the kitchen for the night and who will be running the food. The reason for this is that some people are better at carrying trays and other people are faster at organizing the dinners and getting them ready to be served. I have worked in places, however, where food running and expediting were two entirely separate jobs. The amount which an expeditor/food runner earns is generally slightly less than the amount which a busser earns. At least in New Jersey, expeditor/food runners earn at least minimum wage plus tips. The amount of tips is of course a lower percentage than what a busser earns, but the busser also earns less than minimum wage, at least in larger restaurants. The main advantage to working as an expeditor/food runner is that those people typically finish earlier than all other restaurant staff with the exception of the hostesses. Cooks obviously cannot leave until the last dinner is served and they typically have a ton of extra work that they have to do before they leave. Servers have to stay until their last table pays their check and often have a considerable amount of sidework to do before they can leave. Bussers are often the last to leave as they have to stay until after the last table leaves, then have to perform such duties as sweeping. Expeditors/food runners are often out of there as soon as the last dinner is served and they perform a minimal amount of sidework. It never seemed to be nearly as much sidework as the servers and bussers had to do.

Great point that I only very partially touched on. People are "cut" or get off work in a staggered fashion depending on how busy it is and when they came on. Food runners and hosts have very little sidework and get out quickly. When I was busser, I had to do all kinds of cleaning, including mopping the grimey ass floors. Serving at the same spot I had the least sidework of anywhere...it would take like 10 minutes. Then there's the possibility people sit at the table talking for an hour after you close

Bartender's sidework is probably the worst if there's no barback. Fortunately, you can start breaking things down early if it's not busy.

Quote:

As far as meeting women on the job, the possibility usually only exists for bartenders and servers. The obvious reason for that is that those are the main two positions where there is a great deal of interaction with customers. I remember there was this one guy who worked with me as a busser. He was a 16 or 17 year old high school kid. We worked at what was then the second highest grossing restaurant in the United States (It may still be). Every time he would see an above-average girl in the place, which was approximately every five minutes, he would drop a piece of paper with his number in front of her and say, "You dropped something." I have no idea of what, if any, success he had doing this. I'm sure he had some positive results. Later in the summer, he was fired (being fired at this particular restaurant basically meant a five-day unpaid vacation) under some pretext, but I'm pretty sure it was because of the numbers. At the Jersey Shore and in Miami, I never notice a large number of quality women eating out alone. It seems to be much more common in New York and in Southern California.

That is hilarious. I honestly never did that well with picking up customers. I value steady money more than a single pussy so I was always wary of getting canned for crossing the line. Also, I got many of my best tips from women by being an asshole

I know guys who did alright though.

You rarely get lucky enough to get attractive women without boyfriends with them, like you mentioned.

It's easy to fuck your coworkers though and it's not really discouraged like most jobs. Everyone has fucked someone and there's usually a couple guys running through every girl in the place.

Quote:

In my experience, you definitely need to know someone, or even multiple people, in order to have a chance of working at many of the top restaurants. I person with little or no experience can have an edge over a person with extensive experience in many cases if he knows someone.

Knowing someone helps but it's definitely possible without. If you get that insta-interview, you just have to do well with that and have a passable resume. There are some places that are only going to hire certain positions from within though, which is why I suggested just getting your foot in the door if the spot is worth it.

[Merenguero]

(10-14-2013 08:13 PM)Enigma Wrote:  

It's easy to fuck your coworkers though and it's not really discouraged like most jobs. Everyone has fucked someone and there's usually a couple guys running through every girl in the place.

I used to work with a guy at the same place I mentioned who supposedly went through pretty much every girl we worked with. There were literally a hundred girls who worked there. This guy was average-looking at best, had average at best social skills, and looked underage, although he was about twenty. It goes to show you how easy it can for some guys who work in the restaurant business. I still see him once in a while in Jersey Shore bars when I go back. He's probably still doing the same thing. For some reason, every time he sees me, he hands me the beer he is drinking. He's the only person I know who does that.

[Edmund Dantes]

I really appreciate this thread. I'm looking for a new prep cook job and I want to get a barbacking job as well. Found an ad on Craigslist saying they'd train a bartender if the right applicant showed up. I hope to God my wordsmithing skills would get me a "stage." If the hiring person is a female, she's probably wet after reading my cover letter. I'VE BEEN TO BARS SINCE I WAS FUCKING 17! HOW MANY OTHER MUTHA FUCKAS CAN SAY THAT?! GIVE ME A FUCKING CHANCE SO I CAN MAKE SOME FUCKING MONEY!

No meltdown here guys. Just drinking a mixture of Pacifico, Shock Top, and Newcastle. I may have to finish what's left of the wine.

Thanks Enigma!

[Tengen]

Bumping this thread because i recently quit my wine-related desk job and am now working at a bar/bistro kind of place. It's fascinating that I have all this wine knowledge from my previous job but i'm lacking the basics of how to handle and serve customers in this one. Hoping that i'll pick things up as we move along. The guys in the kitchen are cool, always playing techno music and all smiles.