Well said Samseau.
Deb, you're a wealthy foreigner in a Third World country. Come to America.
Deb, you're a wealthy foreigner in a Third World country. Come to America.
After a Year In Field, some Revelations about Day Game
I've recently started day gaming more systematically and will offer some extended thoughts if I get to 100 approaches. So far I can say that this year I've started to think more and more about a broader definition of game to include things like other skills, logistics, looks, money, lifestyle, fishbowl, inner game issues etc etc. Partly due to day gaming, I also see less and less of a need for ANY alcohol in night game now. I think day game can be good for you even if it doesn't yield direct results immediately.
On the emotionally draining aspect: Personally, I feel a sense of relief even when I get rejected because then I don't have to go home wondering what could have been, beating myself about not approaching. I saw a girl and I approached her, I did my best. Since there was nothing else I could have done I don't feel remorse. So it's almost the contrary of emotionally draining. Just having the courage to approach (not least in day time) is an important reason for me getting into game.
The only irritating part right now is having to deal with bitchiness here in Scandinavia compared to foreign girls who treated me incredibly well.
This is not to put down Deb Auchery or anything, but wasn't most of his girls in the Ukraine 7s? And I think he's claimed to be higher than a 7 himself right? On average, I personally approach girls who are 2 points higher than mysef on the attractiveness scale. Getting a date in 10% of cases isn't really that bad when you think about it, although I admit it's easy to become disillusioned. One has got to account for one's own attractiveness relative to that of the girls when judging one's ROI or success rates.
On the emotionally draining aspect: Personally, I feel a sense of relief even when I get rejected because then I don't have to go home wondering what could have been, beating myself about not approaching. I saw a girl and I approached her, I did my best. Since there was nothing else I could have done I don't feel remorse. So it's almost the contrary of emotionally draining. Just having the courage to approach (not least in day time) is an important reason for me getting into game.
The only irritating part right now is having to deal with bitchiness here in Scandinavia compared to foreign girls who treated me incredibly well.
This is not to put down Deb Auchery or anything, but wasn't most of his girls in the Ukraine 7s? And I think he's claimed to be higher than a 7 himself right? On average, I personally approach girls who are 2 points higher than mysef on the attractiveness scale. Getting a date in 10% of cases isn't really that bad when you think about it, although I admit it's easy to become disillusioned. One has got to account for one's own attractiveness relative to that of the girls when judging one's ROI or success rates.
Quote: (07-04-2012 03:52 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:
Well said Samseau.
Deb, you're a wealthy foreigner in a Third World country. Come to America.
Sounds good, you come here and I will go there. It will be the pussy equivalent of that film "Trading Places" with Eddie Murphy
I have to say day game in this part of the world is an absolute joy for me personally, the boost it gives to my already inflated Ego is immense, even if nothing happens with them in the end. It has a profound on my mental wellbeing. I don't feel like i'm ageing despite being 36 years old, the feeling I get when I walk out on the streets is akin to waking up every morning to do something you enjoy like play Golf - I walk out onto the main square, into a wilderness of legs, bosoms, high heels and smiles.
I look at a girl, she smiles at me, I stop her and say "Hey, what's your name" the rest is poetry in motion.
It seems that I brag a lot, and maybe I do sometimes. But it's hard not to sing when you're winning ok I might be a decent looking guy, but these feelings are not restricted to me, my friends are living the dream too, many of them are very average looking guys, they all have girlfriends(apart from me) and have managed to get a girl that they are more than happy with.
I should really start a dating agency or start doing pussy tours or something.
Quote: (07-04-2012 03:48 PM)Samseau Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 02:34 PM)MikeCF Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 02:07 PM)Samseau Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 01:46 PM)MikeCF Wrote:
I don't have an emotional response to rejection any more.
You need to toughen up.
You're defining emotions too narrowly.
For example, if you go out and talk to 100 people, you're probably going to be tired.
It's not like lifting weights, which is physically exhausting.
It's not like reading 1000 pages, which is mentally exhausting.
The only other word to describe the kind of weariness approaching 100 strangers brings is "emotionally".
I used to approach game like a job. Put my hours in. It was emotionally draining. Rejection stung. I felt anxiety before approaching.
Now it's a joke to me.
After a while you reprogram you brain. You just stop feeling certain things.
Or at least that happened to me. Callused.
Well, the big advantage I had going into the game was the lack of approach anxiety.
Strangers cause me zero stress, always have since I was a kid.
But I'm not talking about anxiety. I'm talking about exhaustion.
Going up to girl after girl, talking about the same fucking things, dealing with the same objections, going on the same kinds of dates...
Dude it's a job, and it's damn exhausting.
That's why I use dance game, cuz it's just so much more fun. Even if I strike out after some dance floor game, I still feel good afterwards. Like after leaving the gym.
But striking out after doing 20 approaches during the day, and the only thing you're thinking about is... "God I hate talking to these girls, I just want to fuck them not talk to them".
You can rationally force yourself to push through stress, but that doesn't make it go away. It simply isn't enjoyable to go out and talk to the most boring creatures on the planet.
I've done door to door sales. It's exactly the same as doing day game.
Toughening up makes your game better, keeps you in a better state.
But it doesn't change the fact that day game is fucking boring, doesn't change the fact that it feels like a job.
It's the trade-off a man must accept when doing game.
I agree with Mike in that after many approaches in day game and experience, you don't feel traditional emotion i.e. anxiety - it's no longer on your mind. However it definitely is mentally draining.
Any time I hop onto the subway now, I spot a girl in the carriage casually sit next to her and robotically proceed into 'Excuse me how long does it take to get to...' then we have a mundane conversation where I drop some hints about the interesting, cool person I am to elicit interest from her and hopefully get her number and take her out on a date. I've done it so many times, my brain has written the script and like a computer program it makes software updates every so often but that's it.
Quote:Quote:
After a while you reprogram you brain. You just stop feeling certain things.
What you thought before doesn't even register.
It's amazing what your brains becomes with a little determination and you expose it to the environment you want it to be exposed to, you can mold it into what you want it to be.
Quote:Quote:
"God I hate talking to these girls, I just want to fuck them not talk to them".
Yep.
I remember when I first started learning day game a few years ago and I would specifically go out on Saturdays and Sundays when I was off from work in order to just do 10 approaches a day.
It was tough as balls and very mentally draining. Some days I hated it. Once I had the number in my head I had to reach it because I know I needed to improve and the end result for me - i.e. banging quality women and being able to pick up women in different environments (aside from bars, clubs) is what kept the fire burning.
I needed the experience and it was a steep learning curve, but without that I wouldn't have the level I have now.
Quote: (07-04-2012 04:00 PM)solo Wrote:
This is not to put down Deb Auchery or anything, but wasn't most of his girls in the Ukraine 7s? And I think he's claimed to be higher than a 7 himself right? On average, I personally approach girls who are 2 points higher than mysef on the attractiveness scale. Getting a date in 10% of cases isn't really that bad when you think about it, although I admit it's easy to become disillusioned. One has got to account for one's own attractiveness relative to that of the girls when judging one's ROI or success rates.
I see where you are coming from, admittedly many girls I have banged have been 7's and 8's.
But.....many of these girls are like 18 or 19(some are 16 and 17), they are sweet, feminine, and a joy to experience. Some are even virgins.
There is an endless pool of these girls available to me and others.
The top tier is hard to find in Lvov, the 9's have all gone to Kiev or left the country altogether.
I get lazy, I bang the ones that are fluttering their lashes at me, and condemn the 9's that are showing me the cheek. I am so spoilt that if a girl rejects me that is it, she doesn't get another chance, in many ways I'm the bitch in Ukraine. More often that not this doesn't do me favours, but sometimes these girls like being ignored to hell, and I get phone calls, texts, and emails out of the blue.
Like recently, I met one 17yr old girl in Kiev, she rejected my advances, didn't let me kiss her or anything. I leave Kiev and barely talk to her after that, then she keeps messaging me like she is obsessed. I offered to take her on holiday somewhere, she accepted, but I don't think I will.
Anyway dont want to get too much off topic, cant remember what my original point was. I'm drinking Czech beer, today is a special day.
Quote: (07-04-2012 01:23 PM)Giovonny Wrote:
Walking around the city for hours day gaming can be a waste of time.
But, day gaming as you are going about your normal business is a more productive option.
Be ready as soon as you walk out your front door. Bus, train, subway, coffee shop, cafe, restaurant, work, lunch break, smoke break, gym, grocery store, mall, sidewalk. You don't have to make time for day game. Just be ready to talk during the day.
I admit, you have to talk to alot of girls to get laid, but, the more you do it the better you get and its alot of fun. (for me)
If you feel some type of emotional cost from rejection then you are taking it to serious. Have fun with it and develop thicker skin. When my dad died I got emotional, when a girl rejects me, it doesn't even register on my emotional radar.
Yes with day game to make it more of a fruitful invesment - i.e. time spent vs results you always have to be ready.
I was riding the bus the other day and spotted a girl sitting in front of me. I saw she had a CV in her hand and it had a Spanish name. So I got on my phone and pretended to have a Spanish conversation. I mentioned Colombia once or twice and she turned round in shock.
I say good bye to my 'friend' then ask her how long to such and such a stop and she says 'I speak Spanish too.' Oh noooooo really?
I managed to convince her to get off the bus and come to a bar with me. We had a drink, however I felt like I was acting on stage and performing for an audience of 1 i.e. me. I wasn't interested and again, it was a mundane conversation where I gave stock answers so I could get to the end of it in order to get the bang. But in the end I made my excuses and left.
I think sometimes I get more thrills out of doing things like that during the day, i.e. the hunt rather than the conquest itself.
dk902, are you based in the US? How many approaches per number, date and lay? Just curious about the kinda numbers the American day gamers here are posting up.
Deb you are a good looking guy. No hate slay on slayer.
But realize, if you are average looking it is a numbers game!
But realize, if you are average looking it is a numbers game!
Quote: (07-04-2012 04:19 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 04:00 PM)solo Wrote:
This is not to put down Deb Auchery or anything, but wasn't most of his girls in the Ukraine 7s? And I think he's claimed to be higher than a 7 himself right? On average, I personally approach girls who are 2 points higher than mysef on the attractiveness scale. Getting a date in 10% of cases isn't really that bad when you think about it, although I admit it's easy to become disillusioned. One has got to account for one's own attractiveness relative to that of the girls when judging one's ROI or success rates.
I see where you are coming from, admittedly many girls I have banged have been 7's and 8's.
But.....many of these girls are like 18 or 19(some are 16 and 17), they are sweet, feminine, and a joy to experience. Some are even virgins.
There is an endless pool of these girls available to me and others.
The top tier is hard to find in Lvov, the 9's have all gone to Kiev or left the country altogether.
I get lazy, I bang the ones that are fluttering their lashes at me, and condemn the 9's that are showing me the cheek. I am so spoilt that if a girl rejects me that is it, she doesn't get another chance, in many ways I'm the bitch in Ukraine. More often that not this doesn't do me favours, but sometimes these girls like being ignored to hell, and I get phone calls, texts, and emails out of the blue.
Like recently, I met one 17yr old girl in Kiev, she rejected my advances, didn't let me kiss her or anything. I leave Kiev and barely talk to her after that, then she keeps messaging me like she is obsessed. I offered to take her on holiday somewhere, she accepted, but I don't think I will.
Anyway dont want to get too much off topic, cant remember what my original point was. I'm drinking Czech beer, today is a special day.
But Westcoast, don't you think that if you are running a numbers game, you could be consistently trying the wrong approach all day but not realise it, then come away feeling worse than when you started.
It's a bit like doing telephone sales, your pitch is shit, but you don't realise it and continue all day to no avail. Ok if you have been successful with your day game approach, ie. you didn't get the number, but you had a chat with her and she was a really nice girl, or perhaps she had a boyfriend. Then by all means keep using what ever worked for you. If not, then it's a death sentence.
Numbers game, as we should know, only works with day game.
It's a bit like doing telephone sales, your pitch is shit, but you don't realise it and continue all day to no avail. Ok if you have been successful with your day game approach, ie. you didn't get the number, but you had a chat with her and she was a really nice girl, or perhaps she had a boyfriend. Then by all means keep using what ever worked for you. If not, then it's a death sentence.
Numbers game, as we should know, only works with day game.
I see where you are going. The point is if you are a "6" you need to talk to 25 7's to pull a 7 if you are a 8+ which sounds like you, you' only need to talk to a couple. I can pull a 6 in minutes.
What I mean by numbers game is if u are looking above your look profile you'll get rejected more than not.
And yes if your game is whack, you need to figure it out, this is why I NEVER take game advice from dudes better looking than me. If I see a 2 with a 7 I'll listen up.
What I mean by numbers game is if u are looking above your look profile you'll get rejected more than not.
And yes if your game is whack, you need to figure it out, this is why I NEVER take game advice from dudes better looking than me. If I see a 2 with a 7 I'll listen up.
Quote: (07-04-2012 04:38 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:
But Westcoast, don't you think that if you are running a numbers game, you could be consistently trying the wrong approach all day but not realise it, then come away feeling worse than when you started.
It's a bit like doing telephone sales, your pitch is shit, but you don't realise it and continue all day to no avail. Ok if you have been successful with your day game approach, ie. you didn't get the number, but you had a chat with her and she was a really nice girl, or perhaps she had a boyfriend. Then by all means keep using what ever worked for you. If not, then it's a death sentence.
Numbers game, as we should know, only works with day game.
Quote: (07-04-2012 02:57 PM)haywire Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 01:39 PM)Samseau Wrote:
Almost impossible to get much better odds in the USA... save for maybe NYC
Janka operates from NYC and his success rate, in his own words from his book, is 11%.
Janka is industrial. He just collects numbers by the shitloads and lets basic statistics sort out who he has sex with. He's not overly bothered by women's reactions / reasons for giving the number / level of interest / reasons for flaking. Like Flint said, women are unpredictable. The only information you really have is that she was willing to give you her number.
Most naturals simply don't care if women reject them. They realise it's just part of the process of finding a girl you "click" with. A PUA on the other hand has spent years learning how to do the perfect approach, they tend to take it very personally if they get rejected.
Quote: (07-04-2012 06:57 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 02:57 PM)haywire Wrote:
Quote: (07-04-2012 01:39 PM)Samseau Wrote:
Almost impossible to get much better odds in the USA... save for maybe NYC
Janka operates from NYC and his success rate, in his own words from his book, is 11%.
Janka is industrial. He just collects numbers by the shitloads and lets basic statistics sort out who he has sex with. He's not overly bothered by women's reactions / reasons for giving the number / level of interest / reasons for flaking. Like Flint said, women are unpredictable. The only information you really have is that she was willing to give you her number.
Most naturals simply don't care if women reject them. They realise it's just part of the process of finding a girl you "click" with. A PUA on the other hand has spent years learning how to do the perfect approach, they tend to take it very personally if they get rejected.
I think you'll find that naturals care just as much about being rejected as anyone else. It's a bruising hit to their ego.
To me, day game is probably the best skill you can ever learn to develop, because aside from learning to pick up girls, you're essentially learning how to quickly connect with people from cold.
A skill like that is indespensible and is hardly ever honed outside a sales environment.
The only gripe about it, is that it's hard - Noone likes the idea of getting harshly rejected and shot down. It's the reason why most people favour warm social circle game because the element of the unknown is pretty much non existent because everyone's warm to you from the beginning.
I'm lucky enough to have both the social circle via my salsa club and the ability to approach cold. But if i had to choose one or the other, i would always pick cold approach hands down. You simply have far more choice with women than if you solely relied on your warm social circle.
The most obvious point also is that your social group will not always be there with you when you go abroad or travel elsewhere and will have to rely on your verbal skills. So being able to develop and have a good rap is hardly ever a bad thing.
I think there's an effective feedback loop with day game and night game.
Club game helped me become better at opening, non-verbals, kino, escalation, extraction, logistics, cock-block handling, making guy friends etc.
Day game helped me with opening, AA, tranisitioning, qualifying, and basic conversation and rapport skills.
So, I guess both is important. But also, with club game you can open alot more in a shorter time. So it could be a better use of time if your a busy guy as well.
The problem with day game is that even if you are low value, people will be polite to you anyway as long as you're polite. So you're not going to learn anything from day game. Whereas in night game, girls will only be polite to you if you demonstrate high value, and you'll quickly learn how to do that.
A skill like that is indespensible and is hardly ever honed outside a sales environment.
The only gripe about it, is that it's hard - Noone likes the idea of getting harshly rejected and shot down. It's the reason why most people favour warm social circle game because the element of the unknown is pretty much non existent because everyone's warm to you from the beginning.
I'm lucky enough to have both the social circle via my salsa club and the ability to approach cold. But if i had to choose one or the other, i would always pick cold approach hands down. You simply have far more choice with women than if you solely relied on your warm social circle.
The most obvious point also is that your social group will not always be there with you when you go abroad or travel elsewhere and will have to rely on your verbal skills. So being able to develop and have a good rap is hardly ever a bad thing.
I think there's an effective feedback loop with day game and night game.
Club game helped me become better at opening, non-verbals, kino, escalation, extraction, logistics, cock-block handling, making guy friends etc.
Day game helped me with opening, AA, tranisitioning, qualifying, and basic conversation and rapport skills.
So, I guess both is important. But also, with club game you can open alot more in a shorter time. So it could be a better use of time if your a busy guy as well.
The problem with day game is that even if you are low value, people will be polite to you anyway as long as you're polite. So you're not going to learn anything from day game. Whereas in night game, girls will only be polite to you if you demonstrate high value, and you'll quickly learn how to do that.
Day game should not be that hard folks. If it is emotionally draining for you, you are caring way too much about it or just something isn't clicking.
And as stated and to correct the original poster, the beauty of day game isn't in going out specifcally during the day for several hours to talk to girls (which you can definitely do, but dont waste time on it as this guy seems to be) BUT that you can do it/practice it while you're just running errands. Going to the gym. Going to work. Heading out to meet friends. Hell heading out on a date. ANYWHERE. Plus, I like the fact that usually you will find people with their shields DOWN and it is much easier to connect with them, than the bs you'll get going out at night.
And again, as stated, if your results are positive (or maybe u said dates, im not sure) only ONE of TEN times-I think you need to work on other things first and then day game/success will flow much easier from that. I don't care about the USA thing, its a pretty ridiculous excuse if you ask me (yes its not easy here as other countries, but adapt or die gentlemen-sink or swim)-you just have to get your sh** together first. Also, if you're good/decent at all-eye contact will be huge and all it takes is a few iois from her body language and if you can read them well you will be good to go/make a move..../she'll practically be begging for you to approach her. Just saying/my general experience after working on it in DC.
I did also like the fact that the original posta' said that if you're good in day game you'll get much better results elsewhere. TOO TRUE. If you can connect with a girl during the day, you'll be able to connect with her ANYWHERE. (IN my opinion/style) Its all about the connections you make with em gentlemen. Their emotions. Connect with that and do it on a DEEP (emotional) level-and she will NOT forget you easily.
Game on gentlemen
And as stated and to correct the original poster, the beauty of day game isn't in going out specifcally during the day for several hours to talk to girls (which you can definitely do, but dont waste time on it as this guy seems to be) BUT that you can do it/practice it while you're just running errands. Going to the gym. Going to work. Heading out to meet friends. Hell heading out on a date. ANYWHERE. Plus, I like the fact that usually you will find people with their shields DOWN and it is much easier to connect with them, than the bs you'll get going out at night.
And again, as stated, if your results are positive (or maybe u said dates, im not sure) only ONE of TEN times-I think you need to work on other things first and then day game/success will flow much easier from that. I don't care about the USA thing, its a pretty ridiculous excuse if you ask me (yes its not easy here as other countries, but adapt or die gentlemen-sink or swim)-you just have to get your sh** together first. Also, if you're good/decent at all-eye contact will be huge and all it takes is a few iois from her body language and if you can read them well you will be good to go/make a move..../she'll practically be begging for you to approach her. Just saying/my general experience after working on it in DC.
I did also like the fact that the original posta' said that if you're good in day game you'll get much better results elsewhere. TOO TRUE. If you can connect with a girl during the day, you'll be able to connect with her ANYWHERE. (IN my opinion/style) Its all about the connections you make with em gentlemen. Their emotions. Connect with that and do it on a DEEP (emotional) level-and she will NOT forget you easily.
Game on gentlemen
1) what city are you in?
2) how are you managing to stay in *any* city and have enough time every day to go hunt for women for what seems to be weeks on end?
Can you teach the rest of us how to make enough money so that we can spend our days hollering at bitches?
3) Approaching all the time without result sucks.
Perhaps you should think about all the pieces of how you're trying to run game.
4) why are you pushing for #'s? Does no one remember the mini-date?
5) if it takes several hours to do 5 approaches, you're in the wrong area for day game. Peep some of the Simple Pick Up vids, they always go to target RICH environments.
6) If it's been so fruitless, why do you keep doing it?
7) LOL @ women automatically ruling you out cause it's the day time. That sounds like trolling. Same can be said for meeting some random dude @ a night club. If you believe that women's social circles are already closed, I can't see why you would continue.
8) Lol @ #'s. FAST SEDUCTION. Mf'ers talking about the finer points phone game vs text game. How about trying to fuck the same night? and when that fails, ON TO THE NEXT ONE.
9) and if you're constantly getting flaky #'s, there's a problem in your game. You're not building up enough attraction or rapport.
10) and lol @ chicks being able to size you up. She's more worried about how she's coming off to you. Even if she's not, there's nothing you can do about it, aside from spend another night at home watching tube porn.
This whole post is borderline trolling.
Just the concept of staying in the city center all day, with a bunch of friends, to hit on girls sounds like something out of a game manual.
Most dudes don't do 9 am to 5 pm day game. I can see that if you're on Spring Break or Holiday somewhere, but common sense will tell you that you're not going to see a good concentration of chicks until lunch time in most places.
Weekend? Malls? Shopping areas? Whole Foods? Game on. That's right back to High School for a lot of us. And there's nothing odd about that at all.
Most of us work during the day, or go to school, and when we come across a hot chick on her way back from lunch, maybe in the elevator, on the street, in line @ the post office, that's when you break out the Elderly Chat and get it popping.
But if you're roaming the streets with a hard on asking chicks about where's the pet store, you might not get the results you're seeking.
WIA
2) how are you managing to stay in *any* city and have enough time every day to go hunt for women for what seems to be weeks on end?
Can you teach the rest of us how to make enough money so that we can spend our days hollering at bitches?
3) Approaching all the time without result sucks.
Perhaps you should think about all the pieces of how you're trying to run game.
4) why are you pushing for #'s? Does no one remember the mini-date?
5) if it takes several hours to do 5 approaches, you're in the wrong area for day game. Peep some of the Simple Pick Up vids, they always go to target RICH environments.
6) If it's been so fruitless, why do you keep doing it?
7) LOL @ women automatically ruling you out cause it's the day time. That sounds like trolling. Same can be said for meeting some random dude @ a night club. If you believe that women's social circles are already closed, I can't see why you would continue.
8) Lol @ #'s. FAST SEDUCTION. Mf'ers talking about the finer points phone game vs text game. How about trying to fuck the same night? and when that fails, ON TO THE NEXT ONE.
9) and if you're constantly getting flaky #'s, there's a problem in your game. You're not building up enough attraction or rapport.
10) and lol @ chicks being able to size you up. She's more worried about how she's coming off to you. Even if she's not, there's nothing you can do about it, aside from spend another night at home watching tube porn.
This whole post is borderline trolling.
Just the concept of staying in the city center all day, with a bunch of friends, to hit on girls sounds like something out of a game manual.
Most dudes don't do 9 am to 5 pm day game. I can see that if you're on Spring Break or Holiday somewhere, but common sense will tell you that you're not going to see a good concentration of chicks until lunch time in most places.
Weekend? Malls? Shopping areas? Whole Foods? Game on. That's right back to High School for a lot of us. And there's nothing odd about that at all.
Most of us work during the day, or go to school, and when we come across a hot chick on her way back from lunch, maybe in the elevator, on the street, in line @ the post office, that's when you break out the Elderly Chat and get it popping.
But if you're roaming the streets with a hard on asking chicks about where's the pet store, you might not get the results you're seeking.
WIA
I disagree with this.
OP makes it sound like day game is a chore, like cold calling. It shouldn't be. I typically work from a cafe, so if a pretty girl shows up, the game is on. If she doesn't, no loss; I get more done.
OP makes it sound like day game is a chore, like cold calling. It shouldn't be. I typically work from a cafe, so if a pretty girl shows up, the game is on. If she doesn't, no loss; I get more done.
This thread is pretty amusing to me because just after writing my original reply right at the beginning of this thread I was heading out for a coffee date with a girl I met from day game just over a week ago. On the date I read her coffee beans and I told her she would be kissing an Englishman today, she told me this is very unlikely. An hour later we were caught in a thunderstorm and ended up kissing under a tree.
Because she was so wet she invited herself back to my place to use the bathroom and within an hour she was naked on my bed so all in all today has been a pretty good day.
In regards to some of the comments I think 1 in 10 is great for getting a date, it's not hard to make 10 approaches every day and if you can achieve this consistently I don't believe you need to get much better than this, you will literally have an endless supply of women as long as you apply yourself.
As for Deb I like some of the stuff you write basically because you're a Brit so you have that natural taking the piss sense of humour but I also agree with Roosh that you do seem to enjoy most of your time on here simply boasting about your conquests without providing any useful info or empathy for guys who are in less advantageous positions.
Because she was so wet she invited herself back to my place to use the bathroom and within an hour she was naked on my bed so all in all today has been a pretty good day.
In regards to some of the comments I think 1 in 10 is great for getting a date, it's not hard to make 10 approaches every day and if you can achieve this consistently I don't believe you need to get much better than this, you will literally have an endless supply of women as long as you apply yourself.
As for Deb I like some of the stuff you write basically because you're a Brit so you have that natural taking the piss sense of humour but I also agree with Roosh that you do seem to enjoy most of your time on here simply boasting about your conquests without providing any useful info or empathy for guys who are in less advantageous positions.
WestIndianArchie,
1) Have you ever made a concerted effort to run day game?
2) Have you ever quantified your approaches? Numbers? Dates? Lays?
A lot of guys sit around theorizing on the internet about how things ought to be. Only guys who've spent time in the trenches and quantified their approach/number/date/lay ratio will understand how inefficient it is, especially in the US given the flakiness of American girls and their "stranger danger creeper" paranoia.
Paul Janka has an 11% number-to-bang conversion - a tall Harvard grad with model looks who teaches day game for a living.
1) Have you ever made a concerted effort to run day game?
2) Have you ever quantified your approaches? Numbers? Dates? Lays?
A lot of guys sit around theorizing on the internet about how things ought to be. Only guys who've spent time in the trenches and quantified their approach/number/date/lay ratio will understand how inefficient it is, especially in the US given the flakiness of American girls and their "stranger danger creeper" paranoia.
Paul Janka has an 11% number-to-bang conversion - a tall Harvard grad with model looks who teaches day game for a living.
You ain't answer my main question about where you are, and how you can do day game all day.
I can't even imagine that.
1) No concerted effort to run day game, because i've always had a job or school for the past 20 years. I don't deny your #'s and your lack of success. Maybe day game is harder than night game. I'm no day game apologist.
But you ain't really provided that much information on how you're running your game.
Sounds like you're in some big city, hanging out with your wings, and hitting on chicks all day.
Who does that?
Who can afford to do that?
That's what I want to know. Find me a way to make a 3G's a week so that I can hang out in some city square some place. I'll verify your stats!
Guys that use day game in the real world are going for 30 second to 5 minute impressions that might lead to something. Unless of course you're on extended holiday, or it's the weekend, or you're a student and she's a student at your at the same coffee shop.
In my world, a day game encounter is not a heavy emotional investment game, like during night game where you find yourself sitting with a semi-drunk bitch for 90 minutes at some bar some place, only to have her hating ass girlfriends pull her from the stool. "SHE'S LEAVING".
2) Quantify my results? I had a game journal when I first got into the game, but never quantified my results. I'm more than comfortable with my notch count and conversion rate.
But that's not the gist of my post.
Why are you doing day game if it pains you so?
Most dudes, I imagine, aren't solely doing day game. In fact m-f/9-5 day game is damn near impossible unless you're in college or unemployed or fabulously wealthy.
And I know who Paul Janka is. I remember when he came out, I remember the. Dr Phil episode. If you were in the "community" back then, they said he looked like a taller JFK Jr, and he was getting such great results because he was a good looking guy. (community has always had non-believers)
This discussion isn't about 10%, it's about why do *you* Juan Antonio continue to do something that's you feel is not working for you.
You wouldn't have made this post if you were happy with the "reality" like Paul Janka is.
And I know cats that do much better than 10%, but then again they're from Brooklyn and street hollers are common in NYC. Maybe they aren't in the village that you're in right now.
If you're hanging out in front of FIT trying to pounce on design chicks and fashion models, maybe you need to change your whole steez.
You ain't really said much about how you're doing the approaches, where you are, what kind of chicks are you looking for, what you look like, whether or not your wing helps you.
The whole thing sounds like a troll.
I can't even imagine that.
1) No concerted effort to run day game, because i've always had a job or school for the past 20 years. I don't deny your #'s and your lack of success. Maybe day game is harder than night game. I'm no day game apologist.
But you ain't really provided that much information on how you're running your game.
Sounds like you're in some big city, hanging out with your wings, and hitting on chicks all day.
Who does that?
Who can afford to do that?
That's what I want to know. Find me a way to make a 3G's a week so that I can hang out in some city square some place. I'll verify your stats!
Guys that use day game in the real world are going for 30 second to 5 minute impressions that might lead to something. Unless of course you're on extended holiday, or it's the weekend, or you're a student and she's a student at your at the same coffee shop.
In my world, a day game encounter is not a heavy emotional investment game, like during night game where you find yourself sitting with a semi-drunk bitch for 90 minutes at some bar some place, only to have her hating ass girlfriends pull her from the stool. "SHE'S LEAVING".
2) Quantify my results? I had a game journal when I first got into the game, but never quantified my results. I'm more than comfortable with my notch count and conversion rate.
But that's not the gist of my post.
Why are you doing day game if it pains you so?
Most dudes, I imagine, aren't solely doing day game. In fact m-f/9-5 day game is damn near impossible unless you're in college or unemployed or fabulously wealthy.
And I know who Paul Janka is. I remember when he came out, I remember the. Dr Phil episode. If you were in the "community" back then, they said he looked like a taller JFK Jr, and he was getting such great results because he was a good looking guy. (community has always had non-believers)
This discussion isn't about 10%, it's about why do *you* Juan Antonio continue to do something that's you feel is not working for you.
You wouldn't have made this post if you were happy with the "reality" like Paul Janka is.
And I know cats that do much better than 10%, but then again they're from Brooklyn and street hollers are common in NYC. Maybe they aren't in the village that you're in right now.
If you're hanging out in front of FIT trying to pounce on design chicks and fashion models, maybe you need to change your whole steez.
You ain't really said much about how you're doing the approaches, where you are, what kind of chicks are you looking for, what you look like, whether or not your wing helps you.
The whole thing sounds like a troll.
Quote: (07-04-2012 10:20 PM)Juan Antonio Wrote:
WestIndianArchie,
1) Have you ever made a concerted effort to run day game?
2) Have you ever quantified your approaches? Numbers? Dates? Lays?
A lot of guys sit around theorizing on the internet about how things ought to be. Only guys who've spent time in the trenches and quantified their approach/number/date/lay ratio will understand how inefficient it is, especially in the US given the flakiness of American girls and their "stranger danger creeper" paranoia.
Paul Janka has an 11% number-to-bang conversion - a tall Harvard grad with model looks who teaches day game for a living.
agree with OP and it matches my experience.
daygame is fuckin tough!
everyone who says sth else is either full of shit or has male model looks.
i get about the same ratio, one date out of 10 COLD approaches.
last year it was even worse one date out of 20 approaches.
so OP iim with you on this, ppl saying daygame is easy adn you should do better are either full of shit or really good looking and/or in a good environment for them (my day2 rate doubled when i moved to another country for a cpl of month so environment plays a big role too).
and yes its emotionally taxing when you get shot down over and over and over again. i had days where i did 10 approaches and didnt eve nget a number. that shit can wear you down!
nightgame is way way easier than day game. chicks are drunk and actually looking for dick. and youre not some weird guy hitting on them in the streets.
my last lay from daygame took me about 150 approaches.
last lay from nightgame was less than 20 approaches.
daygame is fuckin tough!
everyone who says sth else is either full of shit or has male model looks.
i get about the same ratio, one date out of 10 COLD approaches.
last year it was even worse one date out of 20 approaches.
so OP iim with you on this, ppl saying daygame is easy adn you should do better are either full of shit or really good looking and/or in a good environment for them (my day2 rate doubled when i moved to another country for a cpl of month so environment plays a big role too).
and yes its emotionally taxing when you get shot down over and over and over again. i had days where i did 10 approaches and didnt eve nget a number. that shit can wear you down!
nightgame is way way easier than day game. chicks are drunk and actually looking for dick. and youre not some weird guy hitting on them in the streets.
my last lay from daygame took me about 150 approaches.
last lay from nightgame was less than 20 approaches.
I can relate to the OP.
I find any approach to be work and require effort. Back in high school I had social anxiety so bad that I couldn't even make eye contact with people.
Despite a vast improvement, I still have to put in effort to get into approaching. On the other hand, I can read a molecular physiology text one time through and get an A on the exam without trouble.
We all have strengths and weaknesses, but effort always produces results... sometimes faster, sometimes slower.
I myself am going to day game right now. Keep on going OP and don't compare yourself to people getting super high success rates. Imagine all the people who aren't even approaching at all or are getting 1/20 or 1/30 results.
I opened a set with a new wingman yesterday and things were going well... until I tried to introduce him and he couldn't even say his name!
I find any approach to be work and require effort. Back in high school I had social anxiety so bad that I couldn't even make eye contact with people.
Despite a vast improvement, I still have to put in effort to get into approaching. On the other hand, I can read a molecular physiology text one time through and get an A on the exam without trouble.
We all have strengths and weaknesses, but effort always produces results... sometimes faster, sometimes slower.
I myself am going to day game right now. Keep on going OP and don't compare yourself to people getting super high success rates. Imagine all the people who aren't even approaching at all or are getting 1/20 or 1/30 results.
I opened a set with a new wingman yesterday and things were going well... until I tried to introduce him and he couldn't even say his name!
For day game youy need some serious balls.You also need speed because you have maximum 5 minutes to create an impression.The most difficult type of day game is when you try to stop girls walking in the street.Moving targets are always the most difficult.Although it may seem weird there can be cockblock in day game especially by other women who try to not let you approach.Also by men who can turn intimidating.
Day game is very exciting gives new dimensions and is sometimes very rewarding.A lot depends on the place you happen to be in.By day game I got much better quality than in clubs or internet.From all the countries I have visited only Greece is really tough for day game.If you practice in Greece all other places are piece of cake you do not encounter the number of obstacles present here.
Day game is very exciting gives new dimensions and is sometimes very rewarding.A lot depends on the place you happen to be in.By day game I got much better quality than in clubs or internet.From all the countries I have visited only Greece is really tough for day game.If you practice in Greece all other places are piece of cake you do not encounter the number of obstacles present here.
Quote: (07-05-2012 04:35 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:
For day game youy need some serious balls.You also need speed because you have maximum 5 minutes to create an impression.The most difficult type of day game is when you try to stop girls walking in the street.Moving targets are always the most difficult.Although it may seem weird there can be cockblock in day game especially by other women who try to not let you approach.Also by men who can turn intimidating.
Day game is very exciting gives new dimensions and is sometimes very rewarding.A lot depends on the place you happen to be in.By day game I got much better quality than in clubs or internet.From all the countries I have visited only Greece is really tough for day game.If you practice in Greece all other places are piece of cake you do not encounter the number of obstacles present here.
When I was living in the UK I would only talk to girls in the street at night if I had a couple of drinks in me. Since I moved to E Europe it has become one of my favourite past-times. Saying that though, in Serbia where I spend the majority of my time, it was fucking difficult, you might get a smile while she's walking off but that's it.
Ukraine is a different kettle of fish, I can't imagine anywhere that it could work so well.
Another country I have done well in is Hungary
Just got 2 contact info from 2 approaches i did. 1 in the street, another was a 2 set in the park. Still going for more approaches. the key is keeping it brief but still getting to know each other a bit. we'll see what the flake rate is after contacting them, most girls are polite and give numbers, even in the USA. the tougher part is translating it to meets.
Quote: (07-05-2012 05:26 AM)Spartan Wrote:
Just got 2 contact info from 2 approaches i did. 1 in the street, another was a 2 set in the park. Still going for more approaches. the key is keeping it brief but still getting to know each other a bit. we'll see what the flake rate is after contacting them, most girls are polite and give numbers, even in the USA. the tougher part is translating it to meets.
Agree with your philosophy.
I've been flaked by girls with whom I've had 2 hour+ instant dates with off cold approach. I also just banged a girl with whom my initial interaction was probably 8 minutes at the most. What does that tell you? There's no strong correlation between amount of time spent in set and flake ratio beyond the 10 min mark. Whether you spend 3 min or 30 min BSing, you're still "random creeper" from the street. Now did I wish I had spent those 2 hours approaching more girls?
In my experience there's a point of diminishing returns, when the marginal utility of spending any more time in set is negligible and you're better off using that time to approach more girls. After all, if you believe most of your numbers will flake anyhow, why waste so much time in any one interaction? Find a target-rich spot, approach and number-close more girls in the hopes of finding one that will bite, and use your mass texting magic to make it happen.
One last random thought. PJ says he averages 1-2 mins a number close, and he gets 40 a week. At an 11% ratio that's 4 lays for 40-80 mins work in set. Not bad at all.
Great thing about day game in the US is it conditions you to detach all emotions and expectations from outcome. Such a cold, steely frame will help you immensely with night game when you feel nothing about plowing through 10 birds before settling on the one looking for dick.
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