[thegreenman]

...we have the idea of finding a nice girl, cute, not necessarily the absolute perfect 100% match, but a good person, who likes me, and is kind and nurturing and compassionate and can hold an intellectual conversation and is curious about the world and wants to go hiking with me and wants me to teach her things and looks up to me and knows how to be a good wife, and wants to be a wife, and wants to be my wife, and marry her, and have a couple of kids and some pets.

That doesn't sound like a bad idea. I could go for that. Right now. RIGHT NOW. If that option was available now, I'd choose it. I'd let go of the second scenario, and stop waiting around for the first, and go with the flow, and marry such a girl. It would be awesome.

But I... like... don't know how to do that. How do I get someone to marry me? How do I choose who I want to get to marry me in the first place? Where do I go looking? How do I recognize her?

Let's say I make a list of criteria:
-Cute (I can enjoy looking at her face for long periods of time)
-Physically fit (fits the description of "hot")
-Little (I'm only 5'2", and I find myself most attracted to very tiny petite girls)
-A good kind person with a good heart and cares about others
-Young (the two girls I fucked were 31 and 29 when we did it, so I've never fucked a girl under 29 and dammit if I'm gonna get off this mortal coil without doing so)
-Enjoys and appreciates nature (she doesn't have to be a super avid hiker like me, but at least she should know not to wear 4-inch platform shoes for a hike up the mountain, as one girl recently showed up with)

And maybe a few other criteria.

So let's say I meet a girl, I vet her for these qualities, and she passes them all.

THEN what?

Do I like, bring her a rose or something?

[thegreenman]

And also I should add that I have not yet found someone who matches my criteria.

I have not found one girl (other than Russian girl and rich girl) who were willing to participate in my favorite activity (hiking in nature) with me. Not one. In all this time, I've been hiking with exactly two female persons. Oh, and I forgot 4-inch heel girl. So that's three.

The Chinese chick I talked about in my post, the one with whom I have the two common interests of rice and fish, she would make a good wife. When I injured my hand, she came over and did my laundry for me. BY HAND. Scrubbing in my shower. I kid you not. That's wifey gold right there!

But we connect. On. NOTHING.

How can I possibly see myself marrying someone with whom I connect on NOTHING?

WHY her? Why not any of the 5000 other girls at the nearby university who are just as hot, just as young, just as traditional and good-wifey? How can I possibly follow through on a sustained, serious courtship with one particular person in this situation?

[thegreenman]

Booshala,

Thanks for your honesty. I don't resent your candor at all.

Like I said, the moral questions were challenging.

I felt bad about it.

But you know what I would have felt even WORSE about? Turning her down. After a decade and a half of never hearing the words "I love you" from anyone (not even rich girl or Filipina girl said those words), and then suddenly hearing them from someone for the first time EVER, I would have never been able to look myself in a mirror if I had turned her down. For the rest of my life, I'd be thinking "what if", and kicking myself and probably shooting heroin to mask the pain of inconsolable regret.

I knew I would regret it no matter which option I chose, but I knew that one of them would result in 10,000 times more regret than the other, so I chose the one that would cause less.

I knew it could have been pedestalization and one-itis. I knew I might eventually get flak from my ROK buddies for it. But I'm glad that's all I'm getting, instead of a question haunting me for the rest of my days of why I didn't get with the only girl in 15 years to say "I love you."

So at the very least, I made it out of this challenge with the smallest amount of regret possible. On some level, I've made my peace with that.

[Ringo]

You are a top 1% overthinker, it's very clear from your writing and behavior.

As such, you are overthinking your relationship status.

In terms of sexual life, you are at teenage level, simply because of your lack of experience.

It seems like you are obsessing over marriage. Are you? Why?

If your "non-prostitute notch count stands at 2, in terms of coitus, and 4 in terms of non-coital sexual relationships", you are simply not ready to get married. At least considering that you don't want to get tossed on your head by your girl and/or 21st century dating.

This thread has a lot of parallels with Rex's, the difference being that you are desperately overactive and he is mostly passive.

[AceP]

(01-12-2017 01:56 PM)thegreenman Wrote:  

How do I get someone to marry me?

Let's say I make a list of criteria: ETC

What people here is saying is right. It doesn't matter what your background is.
If you are serious with all that. Show us a video of you doing your thing.

And you DON'T think about marriage before you even like, can enjoy a moment together. Go to a karaoke or something. Don't even think about marriage. Unless you've done a few activities together and you really want each other in your life then you can propose. But don't even think about "finding the perfect one to get married with" when you're still a 28yo VIRGIN

You first goal should actually be, how to NOT be a virgin

[AceP]

For comparison mate,

I've studied (in theory) game for 3-4 years. Only been activity applying it for...5 months actively-ish. And I've got results, safe to say I have a 90% success rate in opening girls for numbers or insta-date. Translating to a over 60% at least.

I did everything without a mentor too. I study everything online, and self-practice. To be fair, I'm probably 8 in terms of attractiveness, I'm a musician/trader, workout 2x a week, confident with my finances. And my biggest problem is STILL approach anxiety even tho I ALREADY KNOW there's almost no way an attractive young successful guy gets rejected (assume I opened nicely)

But if you've been doing this for like 10years with ZERO approach anxiety. Hell. I think your techniques are wrong.

Post that video and we'll review your technique, or better get a 1-1 coach

[Comte De St. Germain]

^First:

Second: Read the fucking thread and time stamps. He turned his life around and this thread is full of gold. If you're looking to show off atleast have the decency to read what's been said.

Third: Back to you. If you're so good start a thread in the game forum. Show us what you got. Even the legendary G-Manifesto only swooped 5% of the girls he successfully opened. 60% and odds are you're banging way below your level or are banging hookers. Chop up some game drop some knowledge in the myriad of recurring game threads(If you don't want to start a thread post in the Moma and Rudebwoy podcast thread or Player's Lounge if you plan to post).

[ksbms]

(01-14-2017 01:02 PM)AceP Wrote:  

For comparison mate,

I've studied (in theory) game for 3-4 years. Only been activity applying it for...5 months actively-ish. And I've got results, safe to say I have a 90% success rate in opening girls for numbers or insta-date. Translating to a over 60% at least.

I did everything without a mentor too. I study everything online, and self-practice. To be fair, I'm probably 8 in terms of attractiveness, I'm a musician/trader, workout 2x a week, confident with my finances. And my biggest problem is STILL approach anxiety even tho I ALREADY KNOW there's almost no way an attractive young successful guy gets rejected (assume I opened nicely)

But if you've been doing this for like 10years with ZERO approach anxiety. Hell. I think your techniques are wrong.

Post that video and we'll review your technique, or better get a 1-1 coach

Are you saying you're success ratio from open to sex is 2 out of 3 girls? I guess Mick Jagger would be jealous...

[Paeter]

Well... at least you got to fuck the Russian girl. That's a memory and experience you can hold on to. I know the deep pain of wanting someone you love and not getting it.

I dated a girl for 4 years, i loved her like crazy, she told me she wanted me, that she loved me like she never loved anyone, I just wanted her, and she never fucked me. Then she left me and had a new boyfriend in under a month. So at least you got to fuck her. Savour that.

Your 3000 approaches and semi-success has really inspired me. If you can do it, what are my excuses? If I could even fuck one girl eventually, I'd be floating on clouds.

There is just one last thing. Look up "Conquering The Dire Need For Love" by Albert Ellis. I think it might help you out.

[Hazaer]

Having read and tried practising verbal game for a while now, I find that girls react well to it but girls also in most cases actively seek out guys who are passive and do not seem to have game at all. I mean these guys are just talking within themselves or just dont seem very active in any conversations with girls but they dig them. But in my experience, I take the effort to open, bring up interesting conversation topics but at the end of it all, they ask who I am and they say 'nice talking to you, but we gotta leave' and leave me a number that is bound to flake. Its true that they are impressed but there are guys out there where girls gravitate to naturally.

I am wondering is there something non-verbal in these guys' behaviour that naturally attracts girls to them wherever they go without them knowing. I know that the cornerstone of game is talking but it is frustrating that after all that talking that the gamer does, it is still a numbers game while there are other guys who dont appear to approach or pursue girls.

I sometimes wonder if approaching and going through all the material with a girl by way of talking in the end makes her feel overwhelmed or makes it seem everything is artificial to her or makes us look too desperate that although they know that we are interesting people, they just dont feel that X factor to take it to the next level.

I understand that some guys have looks that attract girls to them but this forum preaches that looks are not enough to seal the deal but evidence I see suggests these guys dont even seem to isolate her to establish any kind of connection. Its pretty much talking random stuff which the girls are rather happy to endure.

Does any of the members have an idea of why this is happening? It feels that the old adage that you didn't actually choose the girl, the girl chose you' is very much true despite game.

I do not believe that game does not work but there is something else that is present in some guys that allows them to completely skip beginning and middle game and I am sure that there are some guys like this in the forum.

Thanks for sharing your opinions and experiences.

[RexImperator]

Quote:

This thread has a lot of parallels with Rex's, the difference being that you are desperately overactive and he is mostly passive.

My situation was quite different. Instead of lots and lots of approaches, I almost never asked any girls out.

[subterfuge]

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

I understand that some guys have looks that attract girls to them

I think you answered your own question

I'm no game denier (an average looking guy with aweful social skills (no game) would get very few lays whilst an average looking guy with good game could get a lot more), BUT being extremely handsome changes 'the game' completely. Some of my better looking friends used to get laid non stop without ever approaching and whilst lacking even an ounce of apparent charisma (which is kind of what game really is)

[Alche]

Quote:

I dated a girl for 4 years, i loved her like crazy, she told me she wanted me, that she loved me like she never loved anyone, I just wanted her, and she never fucked me.

WTF?

[Skank_Hunt]

I know a lot of time has passed since the OP, but something struck me which could still be applicable today.

Transition from "aloof, cocky" guy to actually escalating. Going from aloof disinterest which gets girls interested in the first place (push), then trying to escalate on them when in private.

1. The "art" of "Push-Pull" is underrated. It's a delicate balance because you can't remain in "push" mode forever. Being cocky/funny/aloof/charismatic and teasing the girl is great for initial attraction, and if the initial approach is filmed it sure looks great for the camera, but translating that initial interest to a lay is another thing entirely.

2. You have to be able to "Pull" while remaining cool/charismatic. This is more difficult than it sounds because girls are used to intense interest from a lot of men and may lose interest when they know the "unattainable" cool guy is now suddenly interested in them. This is where the old Mystery teachings about Qualification (male to female interest) comes in. It has to be a genuine compliment/statement of reasons why you like her, and it has to still come from a place of judgment, sort of like when a father is proud of his daughter. There is a slight warmth to the compliment, but not too much. Ideally it would be something which the girl has never heard before, and which she takes great pride in. It's harder to dig for viable reasons why you might like her if she is just a hot airhead.

3. If you can't do the verbal "Pull" thing very well, then use the interest she has in you as bait to bring her to your place and just fucking go for it. Tuthmosis' first date bangs recipe is tried and tested. If she is surprised, lacks comfort, does not know why you want to bang her etc., then token statements like "because you are nice" while at the same time escalating aggressively can work. Sometimes there's not enough comfort and little you can do about it, but trying to escalate sure beats being the really cool guy who actually never gets laid. Source: I've fucking been there. You have to get your logistics in order, stop overthinking and escalate.

OP you still overthink, have too many stringent criteria, and all this rigidity gets in the way of just being cool and learning to take a girl home and escalate. It's nervewracking the first few times, heck it's never easy especially if you get a girl home you really want to bang, but if you can approach without anxiety, get initial interest from college chicks with canned cocky/funny lines, then the problem is the rest of your game, the part that takes the longest time but not spoken about as much. More materials are focused on the approach and looking "cool" vs the less glamorous, "dirty" aspects of game: logistics and escalation.

I feel like you would benefit from some of the stuff good looking loser puts out. It involves less overthinking and encourages simplicity and practicality. Yes, some of it is oversimplifying things at times, but it could help you.

Finally it's your choice but you might want to think twice about getting the "perfect girl" who meets your criteria and just go for some bangs and more casual mini relationships instead. I don't think you could have a truly healthy relationship without knocking the women off the pedestal.

Hazaer: Yes, I believe that there are certain men certain women gravitate towards and there's not much other men who don't fulfil those criteria can do about it. The more passive men may often be in their social circle, so their "game" consists of what the girls know about them rather than anything they can actively spit in a bar vs a man doing cold approach, totally different. Other men can be more passive because they have a "look" that a certain group of girls like (a lot of the time related to exes, I find), so for these men it's a case of maybe asking basic questions, getting to know the girl casually and having the logistics and ability to escalate. Sometimes the whole high energy, funny, sociable guy in cold approach can come across as a brief form of entertainment, as if you're a magician. You may get some superficial positive reactions but is it truly creating attraction and interest in you as a human being and potential mate, or are you just being a dancing monkey? It's hard in cold approach because you do have to be active to a certain extent, but I have learned to tone the energy down and ask personal questions ASAP, get the girl talking about herself. The more she invests in the conversation the more likely she will want to continue. If a girl starts to tell you about deep things that are really important to her, you're either in or she just loves to talk about herself. Some girls will never reveal things to guys they're not interested in, other girls will just see it as a therapy session and have no intention sexually. The only way you find out is by taking her home and escalating. So this is not a foolproof strategy either but it's better than being a dancing monkey and getting only fake phone numbers.

Game guides give men the feeling that they can control a lot more than they can actually control. You cannot control if a girl only likes X type of guy because her first boyfriend in highschool was that type, you cannot control if a girl has offers of dick coming out of her ears and is so fed up of incoming dicks that she will do no more than entertain your initial spiel.

The only way of overcoming timewasters is to get logistics sorted and escalate, and when you get good at that you get better at predicting which ones are timewasters and which prospects are more likely to give you some return on your investment. Cut off the nowhere prospects as early as possible. They were never going to fuck you, for whatever out of a thousand reasons (some to do with you, many not). And whatever you do, don't do as the OP and "date" a girl for 4 fucking years and never get the bang.

Women are not psychic but they can see things in men that even we cannot see in ourselves. We might think X man has no apparent charisma, but women may well be seeing something else. In social circles they will have information about him, but purely in cold approach, they only have his vibe to go on. It's very possible that OP's overthinking, ridigity and general weird vibe can be perceived by some women to a certain extent. I've seen average looking guys with great casual vibe + great ability to escalate knock very good looking guys out of the park. Overthinking and ridigity are the enemies of smooth escalation. These qualities when apparent in your vibe also repel women, so it's no wonder guys like this struggle so much.

I used to struggle with it a lot and it still comes back to bite me. None of us are immune. But I am telling you the day I started converting "attraction" to BANGS was when I told my brain to shut the fuck up, listen to their shit for a while, bring them home and escalate. Once you've banged them well, you can then dictate to them the terms of the relationship. Before the bang, you have no leverage whatsoever. So if you're looking for a LTR, it starts with the bang.

[Tigre]

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

Does any of the members have an idea of why this is happening? It feels that the old adage that you didn't actually choose the girl, the girl chose you' is very much true despite game.

Your SMV is probably not great.

Guys that get attention from women probably have a great lifestyle and social circle.

http://www.returnofkings.com/999/passive...ctive-game

[Merenguero]

(01-14-2017 06:10 PM)ksbms Wrote:  

(01-14-2017 01:02 PM)AceP Wrote:  

For comparison mate,

I've studied (in theory) game for 3-4 years. Only been activity applying it for...5 months actively-ish. And I've got results, safe to say I have a 90% success rate in opening girls for numbers or insta-date. Translating to a over 60% at least.

I did everything without a mentor too. I study everything online, and self-practice. To be fair, I'm probably 8 in terms of attractiveness, I'm a musician/trader, workout 2x a week, confident with my finances. And my biggest problem is STILL approach anxiety even tho I ALREADY KNOW there's almost no way an attractive young successful guy gets rejected (assume I opened nicely)

But if you've been doing this for like 10years with ZERO approach anxiety. Hell. I think your techniques are wrong.

Post that video and we'll review your technique, or better get a 1-1 coach

Are you saying you're success ratio from open to sex is 2 out of 3 girls? I guess Mick Jagger would be jealous...

I don't doubt it. I'm at about one in three all while making serious mistakes, barely approaching, and having high standards. I guarantee you there are tons of guys who do better than me.

[Giovonny]

I am the "virgin whisperer"!

I guide and coach sexually marginalized males toward a new pussy paradigm.

thegreenman and I skyped and spoke on the phone a few years ago... Glad I was able to help him.

I dedicated my life to getting sex so I have a lot of experience to offer newbies.

--

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

is there something non-verbal in these guys' behavior that naturally attracts girls

Of course. Look, perceived status, body language, vibe, perceived socio-economic level, swag factor, attractiveness, tribe, etc.

Any and all of these things can attract a women without the man even having to open his mouth!

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

I sometimes wonder if approaching and going through all the material with a girl by way of talking in the end makes her feel overwhelmed

Yes! Girls can be bored by too much talking!

When a novice talks to girls, the talk is often logical -- Non-emotive conversation is boring to a woman!

Listening can actually be a better option because it allows her to feel and express emotion.. Maybe asking The Right Question is a better tool for the novice.. ?

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

this forum preaches that looks are not enough to seal the deal
[/quote

Looks are not enough to seal the deal BUT they are enough to swing the door open.

It's always a balance of look, personality, and niche. Try to improve all three.

The OP in this thread moved from the USA to China because it made him better looking. (in the eyes of chinese women/compared to american women

[quote='Hazaer' pid='1497034' dateline='1485682973']
Do any of the members have an idea of why this is happening?

Women are into looks and status.

[Giovonny]

Correction:

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

this forum preaches that looks are not enough to seal the deal

Looks are not enough to seal the deal BUT they are enough to swing the door open.

It's always a balance of look, personality, and niche. Try to improve all three.

The OP in this thread moved from the USA to China because it made him better looking. (in the eyes of chinese women/compared to american women

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

Do any of the members have an idea of why this is happening?

Women are into looks and status.

[redbeard]

re: listening, asking the right question. This clip is comedy but whenever I find myself talking too much I think back to it.

I think one of my problems is that girls give lame ass answers and I don't know how to deal.

"What are you up to today?"
"Ohhh work and stuff."
"..........that sounds boring."

I digress. Sometimes I'm too serious. It's not what you say but how you say it.

[Hazaer]

(01-29-2017 12:12 PM)Tigre Wrote:  

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

Does any of the members have an idea of why this is happening? It feels that the old adage that you didn't actually choose the girl, the girl chose you' is very much true despite game.

Your SMV is probably not great.

Guys that get attention from women probably have a great lifestyle and social circle.

http://www.returnofkings.com/999/passive...ctive-game

I am not sure what a 'great lifestyle' for a student entails. It typically consists of going to school, do some gym and getting drunk with friends. I would like to hear your ideas.

Yes, my social circle is lacking. As an 'out of towner', I hang out with others who are the typical betas due to the tight social circle in a very small city. Sometimes, I figure that at least communicating and rolling with these guys is better in improving my communication skills and practicing to being the live of the group rather than going alone and be seen as a potential creep by girls.

[Hazaer]

(01-29-2017 06:48 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

Correction:

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

this forum preaches that looks are not enough to seal the deal

Looks are not enough to seal the deal BUT they are enough to swing the door open.

It's always a balance of look, personality, and niche. Try to improve all three.

The OP in this thread moved from the USA to China because it made him better looking. (in the eyes of chinese women/compared to american women

(01-29-2017 04:42 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

Do any of the members have an idea of why this is happening?

Women are into looks and status.

Ignoring looks because of its subjective nature, let us deal with the other 2. For personality, the guys getting laid are those who dont speak much, quite laid back and engage girls in pretty standard conversation. Most of the times, the girls take the initiative both verbal and physical. This is the part that puzzles me.

Not sure what you mean by niche but in my area, it is predominantly white and I am coloured and I do get the looks just like most other guys but I dont see any guy doing any approaches or talking stuff to get her excited or spitting any kind of game, both day and night. The once in a blue moon guy who does that does get warm reception and maybe gets a number which might flake while the other 99% guys who are getting laid do so without the effort. That is why I am curious to know if Active Game actually helps, in a big way(like 60-80% of the time) because the time and effort investment for such game is high.

When you say status, are you talking friend circle? From what I see, it looks like social game is all you need to get laid even if you might be average looks wise and have zero game because that is what I am seeing. This is something that might hit guys who moved to a new city that has tight social circles very hard.

[Neo]

I can't believe I missed this thread. I've been spending most of my time on the politics/lifestyle forums. Thegreenman props to you my friend.

[CaliGuy]

Took me a while but I read over this entire thread.

Honestly, I don't like it.

The only way for Thegreenman to succeed was to move out of the U.S.?

That's not good at all. Leaving the country should not be the answer.

[thegreenman]

(02-12-2017 08:19 PM)Neo Wrote:  

I can't believe I missed this thread. I've been spending most of my time on the politics/lifestyle forums. Thegreenman props to you my friend.

Thank you!

[thegreenman]

(02-13-2017 03:46 PM)CaliGuy Wrote:  

Took me a while but I read over this entire thread.

Honestly, I don't like it.

The only way for Thegreenman to succeed was to move out of the U.S.?

That's not good at all. Leaving the country should not be the answer.

I agree with you. Expatriation *should* not be the answer. But sometimes the things that shouldn't be the answer, are. I tried everything. If I had left before trying everything, then you'd be totally right. Expatriation should be a last resort - and for me, it was.