[Special1]

I have been improving my game and success with women over the last 2 years significantly and it is also visible to others. I build a lot of muscle, I drink less alcohol, have more sex and more sex partners etc

But I noticed that I am being excluded from guy friends in my broader social circle. People I used to hang out with are ignoring me, not letting me know if certain things/events happen. If they go out and they want to meet girls, I more and more find out afterwards etc.

The other day I though it was incredibly obvious. A colleague/friend and I agreed to meet around 9 and go to a after-work drinks event in the city. It was 9:15 and he hasn't called/texted and did not reply to my message or call. So of course, i went without him. Arriving there at 21:45, i see him standing with two girls from outside. I called him again, just to see and of course he took the phone out of his pants, saw it and put it back into his jeans without answering. Obviously, I went in, did not let him now i found out and talked to all the girls that evening.

But this is just one example, i do notice this with other friends and I start to feel that this becomes a barrier in growing my social circle as I don't feel to be part of it anymore and I feel/know that some people don't want me to be part of it. This then makes meeting new women naturally more difficult and I have to rely more on day/street game and tinder shit.

Anyone with similar experience? How do you guys handle this?

[Saweeep]

Find new friends.

[Saga]

I honestly don't understand how any grown man could act that way...if one of my friends upped his game and left me in the dust I'd be the first to give him props, then I'd follow his lead so I could get on his level.

I'd say give them a few weeks to snap out of it and if they haven't changed take CrashBangWallop's advice.

[Parlay44]

A man's game and a woman's looks are graded on a curve. It makes sense to eliminate the competition.

I think you've gotten to the point where you need to start branching off and start your own crew. A rat pack of more enlightened and like-minded gentlemen.

[Natural Nomad]

I don't know how far along you are in terms of skill with women but there are 2 answers I'd give depending on what kind of guy you are.

1. Don't let it get to you man. Take it as a definite answer you are changing. If you are happier and have more women available to you then be happy and keep experimenting/ improving. People will be jealous and you have to accept that as you change as a man so will your friends. There are probably few people who witness your personal transformation and remain unfazed by the drastic changes. Keep at it.

2. Don't be afraid to look inward and analyse if you are acting like a clownish pua tool. I know some guys act really strangely when they first start learning game and this is normal. Most guys get away from those behaviors quickly. Don't let it bother you too much. Keep at it.

EDIT: I saw you said 2 years so being a clown probably (or hopefully) isn't your issue. Keep at it.

[Gyaleth]

I've been in the exact place and I can infer that this is one of the consequences of self-improvement. When you develop new habits, when you take a different approach to life, you'll inevitably get the feeling of being excluded from a group you used to hang out with, and this usually boils down to one simple reason: You're simply not the same guy they've met, you've changed. It doesn't matter if you've changed for better or for worse, you're now a stranger to these people.

Finding new friends is always an option, but the way I handled it was simply not giving a shit about friends anymore. Maybe you have the benefit of living in a place where you can meet like-minded individuals who are familiar to the red-pill and game, however that's not my case. I'm a total loner when it comes to knowing about these concepts in the city I live in, so I found solitude to be my best bet.

[samsamsam]

Maybe re-define what you consider a friend.

Honestly, most people you know are just acquaintances.

That dude probably wouldn't help you out in a jam, so that means he isn't your friend.

Anyone that tells me they have tons of friends, I just basically think, they haven't had many deep relationships with people.

[Special1]

(02-07-2015 03:35 PM)Gyaleth Wrote:  

I've been in the exact place and I can infer that this is one of the consequences of self-improvement. When you develop new habits, when you take a different approach to life, you'll inevitably get the feeling of being excluded from a group you used to hang out with, and this usually boils down to one simple reason: You're simply not the same guy they've met, you've changed. It doesn't matter if you've changed for better or for worse, you're now a stranger to these people.

Finding new friends is always an option, but the way I handled it was simply not giving a shit about friends anymore. Maybe you have the benefit of living in a place where you can meet like-minded individuals who are familiar to the red-pill and game, however that's not my case. I'm a total loner when it comes to knowing about these concepts in the city I live in, so I found solitude to be my best bet.

how do you deal with the solitude?
I live in a small city and have not met any red pill familiar people. I might move to a bigger city. If not, i might have to deal with it.

[Saladin]

These guys are not your friends.

Right now all the guys I hang out with are cool as fuck, and only encourage me. I do the same to them. I'd say most of my good friends are red pillers.

Even the guys who aren't red pillers are generally positive and cool to hang out with.

[GenghisKhan]

I've heard your side of the story, and I wish I could hear your friends'.

It's just either they are jealous or maybe, you've turned into a douchebag and wouldn't stop bragging about it.

[Gyaleth]

(02-07-2015 03:46 PM)Special1 Wrote:  

(02-07-2015 03:35 PM)Gyaleth Wrote:  

I've been in the exact place and I can infer that this is one of the consequences of self-improvement. When you develop new habits, when you take a different approach to life, you'll inevitably get the feeling of being excluded from a group you used to hang out with, and this usually boils down to one simple reason: You're simply not the same guy they've met, you've changed. It doesn't matter if you've changed for better or for worse, you're now a stranger to these people.

Finding new friends is always an option, but the way I handled it was simply not giving a shit about friends anymore. Maybe you have the benefit of living in a place where you can meet like-minded individuals who are familiar to the red-pill and game, however that's not my case. I'm a total loner when it comes to knowing about these concepts in the city I live in, so I found solitude to be my best bet.

how do you deal with the solitude?
I live in a small city and have not met any red pill familiar people. I might move to a bigger city. If not, i might have to deal with it.

You can deal with solitude by focusing your energy on hobbies and endeavors that enrich your life like composing music, breaking a plateau at the gym, traveling, anything that channels the need for social interaction into self-improvement.

Dealing with solitude also depends on what kind of guy you are, not anyone can do it. I've always been an introvert so it wasn't that much of a problem to me. Based on who you are you may consider the possibility of making friends with men who, while not explicitly red-pill, share a related mentality. If you move to a bigger city you're most likely to find people with the same ideals as yours. Therefore, if you have the resources to do it I'd suggest you to proceed with that option.

[Tactician]

Quote:

You force many to think differently about you; that, charge they
heavily to your account. You came near to them, and yet went
past: for that they never forgive you.

- Thus Spoke Zarathusthra

If this is a case of crabs in a bucket, it's new friends time!

[NikFromNYC]

(A) Welcome to social reality. Ditch those friends.

(B) Welcome to PUA hell. Also ditch the Community. Learn to actually enjoy socializing with...drum roll...women. If you feel so isolated, you simply haven't yet learned to enjoy yourself with women since you have become alienated from seeing women as people. Or, you are not yet surrounded by delightful women after all and just need to keep at it until you are. You have a high quality problem in the making.

[RIslander]

Check yourself to make sure you're not acting smug with your newly developed skills and image. I was a little guilty of this at first when I went through the steps to improve myself... and I made sure I took the attitude back to baseline when it came to dealing with friends and family.

[Dalaran1991]

That is strange though I definitely see how it's possible. As I became more alpha I noticed more respect from my guy friends, but no open hostility. If anything they become much more responsive to me.

If this is happening with just a few social circles I'd say ditch them and start your own crew. If it's happening on a large scale I would check to make sure you are not doing something wrong.

[samsamsam]

Special1, interesting choice of a name.

Let me ask you this question. Let's say a good friend (known you forever and helped you out in tough spots) says to you, "Special1 you have been hard to be around because you have become a douche lately. How do you respond?

1) You say, "thank for caring about me to enough to give me some feedback, I imagine that was pretty hard to do" and give him a bro hug
2) Do all of the above and ask for more specifics so you can really understand it
3) Think that he is just a hater and blow off his feedback?
4) Do number #3 and then unfriend him or whatever else you use for social media?

Just curious.

[Special1]

I guarantee you 1 and/or 2! For self improvement, I am happy about all kind of feedback. I would listen and not even judge, just digest and then observe myself over the next days/weeks how much of it is true and if I could change something.

Another thing: When I go back to my home town - there my friends are still my friends. It is deeper friendships that even if you change in some aspects, the roots of friendship are still there and they got used to the new me and I got used to their new identities as most people change over the years. It is the more "recent" friends from work and the city i live in now and I guess those friendships are more superficial and easier to abandon for both sides.

[jariel]

(02-07-2015 01:51 PM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  

Find new friends.

They weren't friends to begin with.

[Ice]

(02-08-2015 08:05 AM)Special1 Wrote:  

Another thing: When I go back to my home town - there my friends are still my friends. It is deeper friendships that even if you change in some aspects, the roots of friendship are still there and they got used to the new me and I got used to their new identities as most people change over the years. It is the more "recent" friends from work and the city i live in now and I guess those friendships are more superficial and easier to abandon for both sides.

Yeah, I've been noticing that too. I think "recent" friends are often very utilitarian, meaning that they just hang out with you as long they get some type of "benefit" out of it. If you're getting ahead of them it makes them look bad and consequently they don't want to associate with you anymore. I have experienced that myself. Most people are quite lazy, and when they see that you're working hard and making progress it reminds them of their mediocrity.

But not all people are like that, it's definitely possible to meet people that are on the same page.

[CodyB]

Could it be a cultural thing?

Your new found game not only affects how you interact with ladies but how you interact with men.

I see you're German. My experience differs with German people depending on which part of the country they are from, but generally they share a lot of the same Feminist hangups that Scandinavians (particularly the fucking Danes!!) have.

They see this guys talking shit, acting cocky and fucking bitches. The half life of the blue pill kicks in and the mandatory shock and horror ensues. These guys probably don't know how whipped they are, but they see you and hell yeah they envy you but that's not a reason to snub you, they think you're a bad person.

Just a hypothesis.

[CodyB]

double post

[8ball]

There have been many threads like this and for some reason this idea that you have to quit your current friends and find new ones is thrown around given thumbs up by everyone

I disagree with this, as you get older its harder to make friends so keeping those old relationships is beneficial long-term. There are many reasons for keeping those old relationships and almost none to quitting them. Why would you waste years of friendship and throw it all away?

Here is what you gotta do:

1. Don't talk about game or picking up women with guys that aren't into it! This is crucial, i know its part of your life but how would you like it if your friend talks about boats or something that he is passionate about but you yourself couldn't give a shit.

2. Do not, i repeat, DO NOT introduce your friends to the "RED PILL." Don't show them books, don't show them videos, don't show them any material. Even if it looks like they are ready, i would seriously advise against it. Even if they are coming of a bad break up, its a stupid thing to do. If he is really interested, all he has to do is good how to fuck women or something like that, and that will lead him to a place like this. In which case he might bring it up with you.

3. Don't talk about how your sex life has improved or about your "conquests." If these subjects come up, I prefer talking about my struggles. The stories that i tell are usually: bad online dates, failure to bring her back to my place and how i messed up by saying the wrong thing or texting the wrong girl. This way i can talk about my "hobbies" without rubbing it in their face. They enjoy these conversations and can't wait to hear more. When i bring up a success story, they really enjoy that too because finally 8ball succeeded! This also isn't far from the truth. I have many failures before i have any success.

4. Avoid mass approaching when you are out with them. If you are all sitting in table at a bar and there is a table of girls next to you, then definitely open. But don't get up, abandon your friends and start approaching every girl you see by the bar. That would be the equivalent your boat obsessed friend abandoning you to go look at some boat paintings.

With pick up moving more and more online, this isn't hard to do. Its a huge advantage having a social circle where you are just one of the guys but then having a whole other life that revolves around seduction.

There are many young guys still in college in this forum and while improving their game/style/looks is necessary they should know that the relationships that they have build over the years are important too.

[MMM]

^ 8ball, I think that's sound advice. I know its tempting to proselytize the red pill knowledge that has changed our very fucking lives and all, but the sad truth is most of the happily plugged in masses are not ready for it. Like you said, if they are ready, they’ll find it themselves.