[Steve9]

I have been reading more of Cal Newport's blog where he recommends :

"1. Master a skill that is rare and valuable.
2. Cash in the career capital this generates for the right rewards.

The world doesn’t owe you happiness. Your boss has no reason to let you choose your own projects, or spend one week out of every four writing a novel at your beach house. These rewards are valuable. To earn them, you must accumulate your own career capital by mastering a skill that’s equally rare and valuable."

What IT skills are, or will be, rare and valuable?

[Brisey]

Not sure how relevant this is for Australia but these are the rates for the UK.
http://www.contractoruk.com/jobs/top_ten_rates.html

What area of IT are you in at the moment?

[Steve9]

(10-21-2013 01:51 AM)Brisey Wrote:  

What area of IT are you in at the moment?

SAP...skill in any of its modules was valuable in the past, and I was fortunate enough to do quite well out of it.

Guess I looking for what is the "next SAP"?

[Brisey]

SAP is still in demand isn't it? It has 2 of the 10 entries in the DB&BI table from the link.
As for what is the next SAP, most big companies are already in too deep with it. I'd say there's a fair bit of life in it yet.

[Parlay44]

I hate SAP

Search http://www.indeed.com for different jobs and keywords and you'll start to see trends in what is in demand. You can also sort by salary range which is useful.

Certain careers like Engineering are location specific. You may have to relocate or commute to take advantage of the higher salary.

[UrbanNerd]

Big Data

[Hencredible Casanova]

(10-21-2013 05:12 PM)UrbanNerd Wrote:  

Big Data

Yes. Especially BD in the enterprise space.

Btw, WSJ released an interesting article about the profile of an IT worker.

Quote:

Who are these employees who install new computers, keep the corporate network running and help other workers reset their passwords? Cultural stereotypes about nerds with pocket protectors aside, what do we know about the people who keep the bits flowing and the digital lights on?

For instance, the IT guy—and they're about three times more likely to be men than women—doesn't necessarily have a computer-science degree. About a third come to IT with degrees in business, social sciences or other nontechnical fields. More than 40% of computer support specialists and a third of computer systems administrators don't have a college degree at all.

For this profile, we mainly focused on two job categories as defined by the federal Bureau of Labor Statistics: network and computer systems administrator, and computer support specialist. One way to think about these two groups is that systems administrators are charged with the upkeep of a company's back-office computer systems—servers, routers and the software to keep them working—and the support specialists are the face (or, increasingly, just the voice) of IT, who make sure other employees have the technology they need.

Demand for both administrators and support staff is expected to grow over the next decade. Jobs for systems administrators, for instance, are expected to grow 28% between now and 2020, twice the expected average growth rate for all occupations, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. "That's an indicator that the position is still pretty relevant in the business world," says Tim Herbert, vice president for research and market intelligence at CompTIA, a technology industry trade group.

[roid]

BSCS billing system. One contractor here makes 15k a month.

[RichieP]

Rare and Valuable is a good framework.

It also massively depends on your strengths and passions btw. There's no point going into programming, for example, if you don't love problem-solving, logic and solitary "craftsman"-type engagement with your work. Never mind how much AngularJS developers are earning this year, or whatever tool is currently hot.

A great book and online test to take is "StrengthsFinder 2.0". The results will give you a good sense of your major strengths, and suggestions for the sorts of roles you could use them in.

I agree with Cal to an extent - passion develops as you build skill and competence, and "do what you love" can be misleading for graduates who've never contacted the realities of work.

Still, I think you've got to pick work your are inherently drawn to.

Nobody has a stellar career by doing something that was in demand but didn't play to their strengths or inherent traits. There's got to be a part of you that goes "yeah... this is for me". We do our best work when we're drawn to it, when we're using parts of our brain that we'd naturally be using on something anyway. I think this is at least as and if not more important than being smart about what's lucrative or in-demand.

[BlurredSevens]

If you code Rails you can pull $150k starting salary for a hot startup in SF/NYC/Boulder/Boston/Austin. Java guys can pull $100k+ no problem.

Mobile developers are in hot demand right now, and they will become red-hot in a couple years once iOS and Android native apps bite the shark and everyone goes mobile web. $150k+ starting salary easy.

Fuck, google/facebook are recruiting kids out of college with 6 figure deals. Very hard to hire any nature of good developers in 2013/2014, even in old strong holds like EE/India/China the talent is getting scooped up at an unbelievable rate.

I know a lot of guys on here talk about oil sands as a way to make bank in your 20's...but if you've got the math/engineering brainpower, then the aforementioned skill sets will net you similar if not substantially higher riches.

[RichieP]

(10-21-2013 07:49 PM)BlurredSevens Wrote:  

If you code Rails you can pull $150k starting salary for a hot startup. Java guys can pull $100k+ no problem.

Mobile developers are in hot demand right now, and they will become red-hot in a couple years once iOS and Android native apps bite the shark and everyone goes mobile web. $150k+ starting salary easy.

Fuck, google/facebook are recruiting kids out of college with 6 figure deals.

I know a lot of guys on here talk about oil sands as a way to make bank in your 20's...but if you've got the math/engineer brainpower, then the aforementioned skill-sets will net you similar if not higher riches.

The thing is though it's not whether you can code rails, or java. It's if you are an excellent developer who uses those tools.

Those kinds of starting salaries you mentioned are only for the very best developers, or top 1% of CS graduates.

It's definitely lucrative, and good devs are in massive demand, but "$150k easy starting salary" isnt the norm at all.

[one-two]

Actuarial science

[Joga Bonito]

Two big ones are cloud computing skills and virtualization skills.

Cloud computing is exploding because it reduces the headache of managing hardware and software, and instead puts the management burden on the prospective cloud service provider. This is especially useful if a company doesn't want to spend money on new technology infrastructure or training employees. The actual skillset demanded varies greatly by employer and since cloud is changing so quickly the core competencies are sort of being made up and companies try and fail with their deployments. However, there are some good resources.
A leading cloud company called RackSpace, created a course on the internet that will give you the skills to get started in this field. Check out the link here: http://www.rackspace.com/knowledge_cente...urriculum.
The next link is a list of certification that you can get also. Having these on your resume with some good experience makes you practically indispensable. http://www.cio.com/slideshow/detail/80437#slide4

Virtualization will be very important as companies seek to better utilize their current phyiscal infrastructure. Alot of companies are also collapsing datacenters and other trying to reduce their dependence on physical infrastructure which breaks down and gets obsolete over time. You might consider getting a certification like VCP – VMware Certified Professional which says that you can deploy, manage, and install VMware vSphere in a variety of environments. Some other technologies to get certifications in would be Hyper V v3 and SystemCenter.

[Player_1337]

(10-21-2013 07:59 PM)RichieP Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 07:49 PM)BlurredSevens Wrote:  

If you code Rails you can pull $150k starting salary for a hot startup. Java guys can pull $100k+ no problem.

Mobile developers are in hot demand right now, and they will become red-hot in a couple years once iOS and Android native apps bite the shark and everyone goes mobile web. $150k+ starting salary easy.

Fuck, google/facebook are recruiting kids out of college with 6 figure deals.

I know a lot of guys on here talk about oil sands as a way to make bank in your 20's...but if you've got the math/engineer brainpower, then the aforementioned skill-sets will net you similar if not higher riches.

The thing is though it's not whether you can code rails, or java. It's if you are an excellent developer who uses those tools.

Those kinds of starting salaries you mentioned are only for the very best developers, or top 1% of CS graduates.

It's definitely lucrative, and good devs are in massive demand, but "$150k easy starting salary" isnt the norm at all.

Although they often start you in the six-figure ballpark, nailing an entry-level position at the top tech companies (Microsoft, Google, Amazon, etc.) is very difficult. The interview process is brutal and the expectations are tremendous.

[Hencredible Casanova]

(10-21-2013 10:51 PM)Player_1337 Wrote:  

Although they often start you in the six-figure ballpark, nailing an entry-level position at the top tech companies (Microsoft, Google, Amazon, etc.) is very difficult. The interview process is brutal and the expectations are tremendous.

Yeah. They ask questions like "How many golf balls can fit in a school bus?"

[iknowexactly]

(10-21-2013 08:02 PM)one-two Wrote:  

Actuarial science

This. Technology agnostic and doesn't go obsolete. PLUS I think there are certifications so there is a barrier to entry for your competitors after you take and pass the tests.

Insurance companies and people who need to KNOW what statistics actually predict NEED these people, and no one gives you money because they LIKE you , only because they NEED you.

Problem with computer languages is they keep changing, and as you get older it gets harder and harder to learn new languages. As well as the age bias against you when they company president is 26 and you are 38.


However, if you nail a language that is on the ascendent-- such as say Ruby now, and you work like crazy for the next 10-15 years making good money before the next language rises, you can make enough money to be set.

[Steve9]

(10-21-2013 07:59 PM)RichieP Wrote:  

Those kinds of starting salaries you mentioned are only for the very best developers, or top 1% of CS graduates.

It's definitely lucrative, and good devs are in massive demand, but "$150k easy starting salary" isnt the norm at all.

Thanks for all the ideas.

In the late 90s ANYONE with 1 year SAP R/3 implementation experience could earn 200K plus expenses on contract. This was because the product was quite new, and there was a shortage of anyone with SAP experience.

You did not have to be a "guru" or a CS grad. The SAP gurus (3-4 years experience) back then were pulling 300K - 400K+

There was a steady supply of "cowboys" around, since a typical SAP project has over 50 contractors involved, it was possible to bluff your way in and bludge off the team.

It seems there is no equivalent "gravy train" these days?

Now the SAP world is much more competitive. Up to 80% of your fellow consultants will be Indians who are brought in by IT companies on special visa's and they generally will accept much lower rates.
Huge amounts of SAP programming (ABAP) and technical support (BASIS) is now outsourced to low cost centers like Bangalore.

[Cattle Rustler]

(10-21-2013 11:32 PM)Steve9 Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 07:59 PM)RichieP Wrote:  

Those kinds of starting salaries you mentioned are only for the very best developers, or top 1% of CS graduates.

It's definitely lucrative, and good devs are in massive demand, but "$150k easy starting salary" isnt the norm at all.

Thanks for all the ideas.

In the late 90s ANYONE with 1 year SAP R/3 implementation experience could earn 200K plus expenses on contract.

You did not have to be a "guru" or a CS grad. The SAP gurus back then were pulling 300K - 400K+

There was a steady supply of "cowboys" around, since a typical SAP project has over 50 contractors involved, it was possible to bluff your way in and bludge off the team.

It seems there is no equivalent "gravy train" these days?

Questions:

What is SAP?
What is it used for?
What does a SAP person do?

I see a bunch of people doing SAP or jobs asking for SAP but all I know it's some program that kind of does business intelligence.

[paninaro]

(10-21-2013 10:57 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

Problem with computer languages is they keep changing, and as you get older it gets harder and harder to learn new languages. As well as the age bias against you when they company president is 26 and you are 38.

Sort of. Any decent programmer who knows at least one object oriented, functional, and procedural programming language can easily pick up a new language. It's just a matter of figuring out the syntax and any quirks -- the concepts are the same. Every programming language used today falls into one of those 3 types.

Kind of like learning one romance language if you already know another. The general structure and grammar is the same, so you just need to pick up the vocab and any quirks (typically with irregular verbs).

I do agree about age bias, though most people 30+ in the software industry have been promoted to managers of the department by that point.

[iknowexactly]

(10-21-2013 11:50 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 10:57 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

Problem with computer languages is they keep changing, and as you get older it gets harder and harder to learn new languages. As well as the age bias against you when they company president is 26 and you are 38.

Sort of. Any decent programmer who knows at least one object oriented, functional, and procedural programming language can easily pick up a new language.

You're logically right, but my experience is NO ONE except a current employer that likes you and wants to keep you is willing to cross train.

People CAN learn similar languages" BUT not 1/10,000 ads says something like "Looking for Ruby programmer, can cross-train python programmer."

To the contrary, they not only specify a specific language, they also often specify specific environments related to that language-- LIke "Ruby on Rails" etc.

[RichieP]

(10-22-2013 12:05 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 11:50 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 10:57 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

Problem with computer languages is they keep changing, and as you get older it gets harder and harder to learn new languages. As well as the age bias against you when they company president is 26 and you are 38.

Sort of. Any decent programmer who knows at least one object oriented, functional, and procedural programming language can easily pick up a new language.

You're logically right, but my experience is NO ONE except a current employer that likes you and wants to keep you is willing to cross train.

People CAN learn similar languages" BUT not 1/10,000 ads says something like "Looking for Ruby programmer, can cross-train python programmer."

To the contrary, they not only specify a specific language, they also often specify specific environments related to that language-- LIke "Ruby on Rails" etc.

Many employers specify languages because that's what their stuff is built in. Of course they're not going to pay you to learn something that they don't use.

The thing is, the top employers are more concerned with how good you are in general, not just your experience in a language.

If you want a job at Google for example, you'll be expected to know one language really well, but it's more important that you're shit-hot at computer science and problem-solving:
http://steve-yegge.blogspot.co.uk/2008/0...oogle.html


And I've seen plenty of jobs in startups, big tech companies and finance that ask for something like "strong object-oriented experience" or "strong functional programming experience", because they know programming skill is language-independent, and what they really want is the great thinkers and problems solvers. They know you can get up to speed on whatever specifics they're using fairly quickly.

The point is there's no one "hot" language that's a gravy train. Being a great programmer is the gravy train.

[le prince perdu]

This thread is amazing

[evilhei]

(10-21-2013 11:32 PM)Steve9 Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 07:59 PM)RichieP Wrote:  

Those kinds of starting salaries you mentioned are only for the very best developers, or top 1% of CS graduates.

It's definitely lucrative, and good devs are in massive demand, but "$150k easy starting salary" isnt the norm at all.

Thanks for all the ideas.

In the late 90s ANYONE with 1 year SAP R/3 implementation experience could earn 200K plus expenses on contract. This was because the product was quite new, and there was a shortage of anyone with SAP experience.

You did not have to be a "guru" or a CS grad. The SAP gurus (3-4 years experience) back then were pulling 300K - 400K+

There was a steady supply of "cowboys" around, since a typical SAP project has over 50 contractors involved, it was possible to bluff your way in and bludge off the team.

It seems there is no equivalent "gravy train" these days?

Now the SAP world is much more competitive. Up to 80% of your fellow consultants will be Indians who are brought in by IT companies on special visa's and they generally will accept much lower rates.
Huge amounts of SAP programming (ABAP) and technical support (BASIS) is now outsourced to low cost centers like Bangalore.

Being involved in the SAP consulting business myself I can say that atleast in EE the SAP market is not very good. There are not that many job offers, maybe only few a year in some countries. But on the other hand even the governments runs on SAP and that means its deeply integrated with everything and SAP getting replaced by something else doesnt seems very likely.

Also getting started and getting good experience in SAP is quite hard, its not like you can really learn it on your own, you wont be running SAP environment in your home.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-21-2013 11:50 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(10-21-2013 10:57 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

Problem with computer languages is they keep changing, and as you get older it gets harder and harder to learn new languages. As well as the age bias against you when they company president is 26 and you are 38.

Sort of. Any decent programmer who knows at least one object oriented, functional, and procedural programming language can easily pick up a new language. It's just a matter of figuring out the syntax and any quirks -- the concepts are the same. Every programming language used today falls into one of those 3 types.

Kind of like learning one romance language if you already know another. The general structure and grammar is the same, so you just need to pick up the vocab and any quirks (typically with irregular verbs).

I do agree about age bias, though most people 30+ in the software industry have been promoted to managers of the department by that point.

I keep trying to tell people this when they talk about learning php.

Understanding concepts like object oriented programming is more important. After that, you just learn language syntax and whatever framework they are using.

[Blaster]

Rare and valuable in IT?

1. People who understand application stacks from top to bottom. Guys with deep understanding of hardware and software platforms (filesystems, operating systems, language runtimes (eg JVM), distributed computing), who can readily apply that knowledge to solve problems quickly and efficiently.

2. Excellent designers. For programming, there is substantial overlap with the first category. To be a good code designer you usually need deep understanding of the platforms. However there are other skills, too, like discipline, consistency, creativity, and efficiency. Often the term "architect" is used instead of "designer" in IT. UI/UX designers tend to be less IT and more towards the creative/marketing side; but still may be programmers using Javascript, JQuery and such.

3. People with domain knowledge and ability to recognize how technology can help solve important problems in specific fields.

4. People with effective IT leadership skills.

5. Extreme domain experts/gurus (eg "Language Lawyer")

6. People willing to work cheap...


The first step, if you are starting from scratch and want to start down the path of #1, are to identify and learn the primary tools you will use to explore and learn about how the platforms work. For example:

An open source linux development platform (eg CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu, Debian.)
A text editor (vi or emacs)
A scripting language (Bash and Python for linux)
A systems language and compiler (C)
A UI platform (eg web browser + javascript, or Java/Objective-C for mobile devices)

The next step, and the hard part, is to dig in and start solving problems and learning how to use the various specialized tools, libraries, and advanced features available. None of those skills I list are rare or valuable on their own.

Not strictly necessary for exploration, but are more or less essential to get any real work done:

A source control management tool (git, mercurial, subversion)
A database system (MySQL, Postgresql, or one of various NoSQL engines)
A serious hardware platform (even if it's linode or amazon web services)