[cardguy]

1. Never use a metaphor, simile, or other figure of speech which you are used to seeing in print.

2. Never use a long word where a short one will do.

3. If it is possible to cut a word out, always cut it out.

4. Never use the passive where you can use the active.

5. Never use a foreign phrase, a scientific word, or a jargon word if you can think of an everyday English equivalent.

6. Break any of these rules sooner than say anything outright barbarous.

[Tuthmosis]

Sounds more like Strunk and White.

   

[Samseau]

It was probably Strunk and White that copied Orwell, because those are indeed his 6 rules.

[iknowexactly]

Avoid cliches like the plague.

My favorite is from Strunk I think.

Eliminate unnecessary words. Eliminate unnecessary words. Eliminate unnecessary words.

[Tuthmosis]

(07-09-2013 05:05 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

It was probably Strunk and White that copied Orwell, because those are indeed his 6 rules.

Considering he was only 15 when the first edition came out, I'd venture to say it's the opposite.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell

[cardguy]

Yeah - Elements of Style is a great (and short) book.

The main thing I took away was to continually remove unnecessary words.

Just that one rule alone will tighten up your writing.

Sorry... that should be:

That one rule alone will tighten up your writing.

[Menace]

Write tight(ly).

[Tuthmosis]

(07-09-2013 05:15 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

Yeah - Elements of Style is a great (and short) book.

The main thing I took away was to continually remove unnecessary words. Just that one rule alone will tighten up your writing.

Fixed it for you.

[Tuthmosis]

(07-09-2013 05:19 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  

Fixed it for you.

Further fixed.

[cardguy]

I think there is another layer to great writing. Something I have only started to think about recently.

I wonder if great writing has a rhythm - and if you should rewrite your work so that the rhythm and flow of the words and sentences feels good? And if so - I wonder how you would learn to do this?

I think there is something in this - but I am not sure. Maybe I am overthinking this? Particularly since I am thinking of in terms of non-fiction (since I don't read fiction).

[AnonymousBosch]

(07-09-2013 05:28 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

I wonder if great writing has a rhythm - and if you should rewrite your work so that the rhythm and flow of the words and sentences feels good? And if so - I wonder how you would learn to do this?

You're thinking-critically. Great writers regularly break all the rules listed above. Only novices believe they are ironclad, which means they end up misinterpreting statements like 'Avoid Unnecessary Words'. Misapplied by novices, it becomes 'Always make declamatory statements'. The result? The reader is being barked at.

Follow your instincts. Study classic - not postmodern - poetry. Alliteration improves rhythm. 'The soaked wolf was tired' doesn't flow as easily as 'The wet wolf was weak'. Obviously, an extreme example.

As for The Elements Of Style, fuck that book. It's nothing more than an archaic list personalised list of Pet Peeves favouring their personal belief that brevity was a positive quality in expression - obviously a big issue for White in that he was socially-awkward and shy to the degree that he would climb out of his office window to avoid speaking to people.

What cultural mark did EB White leave with his writing beyond this? Broader society barely remembers him as an Essayist or Poet, but they do know he wrote 'Charlotte's Web' and 'Stuart Little': two books pitched at a primary school reading level. Is that the legacy you want to leave as a man? Why take his advice seriously?

Here's a decent takedown on TEOS, if anyone is curious.

http://chronicle.com/article/50-Years-of...mmar/25497

[anamericaninbangkok]

Orwell is excellent. I also like Hemingway's rules:

1. Use short sentences.
2. Use short first paragraphs.
3. Use vigorous English.
4. Be positive, not negative.
5. Never have only 4 rules.

The Elements Of Style is good when you need a guide but if you're writing for a paper or magazine many have their own style guides.

[2Wycked]

@cardguy:

Rhythm is crucial.

For me, your original idea or thesis has to be rock solid. Usually, I just start writing and a theme comes to me naturally. If a theme doesn't roll off my the top of my head, then I scrap it and maybe come back to it if an idea comes to me.

Consider this post

The overall rhythm wasn't bad, but clunky uses "Lets" & "Circling Back" hold the piece down. That is the importance of rewriting.

I generally don't do rewrites for the forum, just reviews for errors. I save my rewrites for RoK so I get a better flow. The more time you put in will result in a better piece. The best rewriting is a long process - short posts could a couple hours (less than 1000 words) longer pieces could be over 6-8 hours if you REALLY want your writing to shine.

Tips:

1. Write everyday. On everything. You have a vivid dream? Write it down. Hooked up with a woman? Detail the encounter.

Start with what happened, then inject your thoughts/feelings & then stylize the other person. Always have your end point in mind once you are done with the bare details.

2. Write on everything. Do fiction even you don't like it. Write on sports, culture, history, etc.

3. I second reading classics. Read DH Lawrence. Go way back and read "The Art Of War."

4. Understand your target audience. In a run-up to writing my fiction book, I always am planning reading "Lady Chatterly's Lover" again, reading "Dangerous Liasions" and then transitioning in modern female fare in "50 Shades of Grey" and other very popular female romance stuff. Wrap your mind around who will be reading your book. Play right into their psychology if you wish to get their positive attention. Play off their psychology if you want to piss them off.

Honestly, if I detailed my approach any more, it wouldn't make sense. I have a very weird approach to writing, reading and all that. I really am not somebody who can give good advice on writing - I can only teach through what I do.

For me, tightening up my writing is a key goal this month. Writing for the forum has softened my writing a bit. Gotta step my game back up.

[Mersault]

Those 6 rules are lame. There are no absolute rules regarding writing and there is no standard aesthetic boundary into which good writing can fit or, as is usually the case, not. Writing and rules? Pff.

You can write like Nabokov and be as boring as a Coldplay album or write like Nabokov and be as interesting as a Coldplay album. Rules? Pff. If you think rules make a great writer then you will never be a great writer. Then again, that isn't a rule either.

And as for Orwell. Eh. Really? Good books, but to listen to his recommendations on style? Really?

[MrXY]

Orwell has always been one of my favorite stylists. His style seems so simple and plain but it's not.He's famous for his novels, but his essays are brilliant.

[Beyond Borders]

(07-09-2013 05:28 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

I think there is another layer to great writing. Something I have only started to think about recently.

I wonder if great writing has a rhythm - and if you should rewrite your work so that the rhythm and flow of the words and sentences feels good? And if so - I wonder how you would learn to do this?

I think there is something in this - but I am not sure. Maybe I am overthinking this? Particularly since I am thinking of in terms of non-fiction (since I don't read fiction).

While the rules do make sense, I'm strongly of the belief that you can learn a lot more about writing by reading what others are actually doing. Most often you'll find they do indeed break all the rules, often religiously - especially fiction writers.

Good point on rhythm. I definitely write with a rhythm, especially when writing fiction. Getting too literary is a risk but I personally make sentences longer than they need to be all the time in the interest of making them sound "beautiful" in my head.

It really seems to carry the reader along. I often read my work outloud to make sure the rhythm doesn't break.

[Thomas the Rhymer]

My personal 6 rules for improving at writing:

1) Write stuff
2) Write more stuff
3) Write even more stuff
4) Now write some more
5) Keep writing
6) Don't stop writing

I think one kind of develops his own rules once he's put enough hours in. Different styles of writing work for different people. No matter what style you adopt you won't get good at writing unless you put the hours in.

[anamericaninbangkok]

How many of you are actually professional writers?

[iknowexactly]

(07-10-2013 01:07 AM)anamericaninbangkok Wrote:  

How many of you are actually professional writers?

I actually get paid to write reports on patients based on reports someone else has written. So technically, I am a writer, but it is very circumscribed and formulaic writing.
But i've also written several unsold feature film screenplays, and many songs.

Another element that's real important is content, or passion.

I read some biographical information about Orwell and although he had made it to a level of fame where he could have hung out in London and been a cool famous guy, instead he almost literally committed suicide, went to live on a cold, barren island in a poorly heated house to write his landmark novel 1984. He died within a few years after that I believe.

He sacrificed everything to realize his vision and achieved immortality.
I guess it's obvious you can't come anywhere close to that by following rules.

One of my favorite quotes, acted by Humphrey Bogart in the movie IN A LONELY PLACE; "There's no sacrifice too great for a chance at immortality."

A great sentence to analyze, because the word order is critical: If "immortality" was anywhere else in the sentence, its impact would be greatly diminished due to defusing the dramatic buildup. "For a chance at immortality there's no sacrifice too great." is a far, far weaker sentence although it has the same words.

[Beyond Borders]

(07-10-2013 01:07 AM)anamericaninbangkok Wrote:  

How many of you are actually professional writers?

I'll give an aye. Not a professional novelist but a professional freelancer.

That said, I really don't think there's been anything stated in this thread that's groundbreaking enough to require professional endorsements. Aside from a couple posters, most is only people repeating experts sources and/or personal opinions.

Point taken though. A good place to share resources but perhaps not the best place to take writing advice.

[adrian_D]

(07-09-2013 05:11 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  

(07-09-2013 05:05 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

It was probably Strunk and White that copied Orwell, because those are indeed his 6 rules.

Considering he was only 15 when the first edition came out, I'd venture to say it's the opposite.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell

I suggest that if you look carefully at the original 1918 publication (not the updated 1959 edition),you'll find there is very little that directly correlates with Orwell's six rules of writing. Having said that, it does appear to be an excellent guide.

http://www.bartleby.com/141/

[Thomas the Rhymer]

(07-10-2013 01:07 AM)anamericaninbangkok Wrote:  

How many of you are actually professional writers?

How is that question relevant? This isn't a thread about how to make money off writing, it's about writing style.

[The Fantasist]

(07-10-2013 01:07 AM)anamericaninbangkok Wrote:  

How many of you are actually professional writers?

I've had articles and photo essays printed in magazines but that in no way makes me better qualified to speak about writing style than anyone else here.

If you write you are a writer. Simple. Making money or being published is irrelevant and in no way indicates talent.

[anamericaninbangkok]

(07-10-2013 03:37 AM)Thomas the Rhymer Wrote:  

(07-10-2013 01:07 AM)anamericaninbangkok Wrote:  

How many of you are actually professional writers?

How is that question relevant? This isn't a thread about how to make money off writing, it's about writing style.

It's simply a question. The thread is about George Orwell's rules of writing, not necessarily style per se.

Vorkuta, People all over the world write. This technically makes them a person capable of writing. It does not however, make them a literary or editorial writer. Chimpanzees and elephants have the ability to write — this does not make them writers.

Those who are paid to write are generally paid because they have enough talent to have someone exchange money for their work. Those who do not get paid either don't care about being paid, are without talent, have yet to be published, or they have yet to find a medium willing to pay them.

[Sp5]

The Complete Plain Words by Sir Ernest Gowers is a great style guide.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Complete-Plain-W...0140511997