[jimukr104]

"Also, I thought you were an approach/dating machine like Greek Kamaki"

I got the impression he approached normal chicks for normal relations and little financial investment. Spaniard how old are you btw?

[Greek kamaki]

I usually exercise speed in mass when abroad because I simply have no time.For me to stay more than 3 days in Kiev without getting laid is a failure.Even in CR you can get these results and this is nearby if you have to pay for plane ticket and overpriced apartments and clubs as well you expect sth more.

[Thespaniard]

Hey guys, to makes things clear. When I wrote that post I was with no sleep and very emotional beacause the situation had happened recently. Finally the girl could solve the situation. She made up a very good story and her husband finally bought it.. But even though Its been a lesson. Its not worth it get to involved in something like this bacause the risk is too high. First you can dammage someones life seriously and secondly, you are in great danger. Imagine what a furious husband is capable of doing... Its really seriuos..I cant imagine what that Ukranian dude would have done if he found out, and btw he is in martial arts and quite big...But agree with you guys, it was her choice and she has a big responsability in this, id say 80% considering she is the married one. But I see my part. I also participated in this, escalating in someone who is married. I dont consier myself "innocent" ..If i was married, I wouldnt like that they´d do it to me.. Would you like that guys hitted constantly on yuor wive sor Gfs ??

Anyway, Im already back to Madrid. I was gonna extend my stay in Kiev, paying a 200$ penalty for the flight change and having to pay another week apartment so Id dediced to save the cash, take the original flight today and take a break til the end of the month which Im going to another daygame adventure with a spanish friend to Vilnius.

(08-11-2013 06:43 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

I focus on Ukrainian girls 25 and under, no divorces, no boyfriends/fiances, no kids. You experience almost no problems this way, besides the occasional call from Mama asking when she will be home.

I also, I normally go for pretty young girls. When I approached the arried one she looked 23-24. She has a cute baby face and is working out out 2 hours a day on the gym daily so she had an excellent figure. She looked terribly hot.

(08-11-2013 12:15 PM)BCZalgyris Wrote:  

Pardon my expression but half of the guys on this forum would give their right nut to be in Kiev right now in the middle of the summer among the beautiful девочки on Хрещатик and to be able to game for 20 days like yourself!

Yeah, I agree. I Kiev is fucking paradise, that why I was going to extend my stay. But considering that I had to pay 200$(almost like another flight) penalty for fligh change and another week apartment I decided to take my original flight today and take a break. I dont feel safe in Kiev, high chance that I bump into her in the streets, temtation of calling her again for amazing sx, danger of husbband.. why pay so much when i can use the cash for other trip or just og back after a few weeks when things have calm down..

"""Don't you think you should have found that out on the 2nd date?"""

Had an instante date for 20 mins and found out at the end that she was married. I never had an adventure with a married woman and considering she told me she is bored and unhappy I thugohg that Id bring soy fun to her life..and considering her hotness i went for it.. Had a 2nd dinner date and next morning sh comes to my place.. everthing happended fast..I also agree that is best to focus on girls that have no bagagge than can cause trouble.

[Thespaniard]

(08-11-2013 01:08 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

"Also, I thought you were an approach/dating machine like Greek Kamaki"

I got the impression he approached normal chicks for normal relations and little financial investment. Spaniard how old are you btw?

Well, I dont know what you consider for "normal chics" but I tend to apprach girls that are young and quite hot. Normally I prefer blondes with nice faces and skynny figure. But im flexible if they are hot.. Sice I do daygame my economical investment is much lower: number, 1st coffee date and 2rd beer+park+film date or dinner date if I feel lke spending a little more and 3rd date my place for "pizza and film" Im 30 years old and look a little younger so i have acces to very young chics. also being in FSU the age difference is not a problem.. In spain girls under 21 are much harder to acces for me..

[rishboy77]

Spaniard

Did help you to have a wingman in Kiev ? This will be first trip with a wingman so looking forward to different experience then going solo. Since I'm older (42) and only about a 6 in looks I usually target mid - late 20's normal looking girls, about a 7 on average in looks. Getting a 21 year old hottie for me is unlikely unless I pay for it.

[Thespaniard]

Hi rishboy77,

"Did help you to have a wingman in Kiev ?"

Well in my situation not at all. It does help very much at night game, actually the only night we went out we interacted with some girls and had good fun, even thiguh my buddie didnt speak english which made it almost impossible to pick up a girl just by dancing. He did get a makeout in the with a chic that was dancing along wth him but coudnt take it any further becasuse of the langage barrier.. I had a good interaction with one but finally didnt go anywhere. I think that going out solo in Kiev makes it much more difficult and give syou a sex tourist vibe.

On the other hand. You dont need any wing man for daygame, actually I like better going solo. I can concentrate more, go on instant dates, etc.. My friend is not much of a daygamer so went doing tourism and I went daygaming by my self and so we met on the evenings to banter and relax. Its can be fun to approach two sets with your wing man but actually I get better results on my own, maybe its just because im used to going solo. Anyway, it is cool to have a friend to exchange experiences and to go around with after the pick up sessions but many times I have no friends to join me on my trips and travel solo having good experiences and meeting plenty of girls.


"Since I'm older (42) and only about a 6 in looks I usually target mid-late 20's normal looking girls, about a 7 on average in looks."

On the FSU a 42 year old guy can tottally go for early twenties girls. Where you and me come from that would be very difficult but over there culturally its normal and Ive seen on the streets many times gorgeous young gilrs going along with 45yr or more guys... If you have good conversation some fashion sense and a bit of charm u will taste young girls over there.

Hope this helps!

[Ramacher]

So everyone on this thread has talked about the 6s and 8s at the night club being approachable and bangable. Are there not 9s and 10s there walking around that you can't have a conversation with? Or are they already taken. I am not saying I am the most attractive guy on the block but I would at least give myself the opportunity to go and chat with the 9s and 10s and spit some game.

[slubu]

^^ Not the most receptive chicks in the bar. But as always give it a shot.

[Thespaniard]

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets. U catch them ungarded, with their defenses and bitchshireld off. If you do a direct approach youd already have value on their eyes for your confidence and decosiveness. Ive closed girls on the street that literally told me that they would have blown me away at a bar for sure..

[Prosal]

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets.

9's and 10's don't walk in FSU (and even if they sometimes walk, they certainly don't give a flying shit about sex-hungry cheap tourists on a two weeks sex vacations). They ride in style in the Porsche Cayenne, the Audi Q7 or the Bentley Continental GTs of their local sponsors.

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

U catch them ungarded,

It's not constructive to overhype a destination. In Ukraine, sex-weaned tourists don't score 9s or 10s, period. And only the top 10% of foreigners in terms of appearance, refinement, cultural awareness and game can pick up 8's and 8.5's.

And if you have a budget of 50$/day, no way you gonna score 8's + in Kiev.

(08-10-2013 02:47 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 20 days apartment. 1000$+400$ direct flight from madrid+ food/taxis/dates/ expenses id say another 1000$ aprox.

[jimukr104]

(08-15-2013 11:47 AM)Prosal Wrote:  

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets.

9's and 10's don't walk in FSU (and even if they sometimes walk, they certainly don't give a flying shit about sex-hungry cheap tourists on a two weeks sex vacations). They ride in style in the Porsche Cayenne, the Audi Q7 or the Bentley Continental GTs of their local sponsors.

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

U catch them ungarded,

It's not constructive to overhype a destination. In Ukraine, sex-weaned tourists don't score 9s or 10s, period. Especially the tourists who have a budget of 50$/day.

(08-10-2013 02:47 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 20 days apartment. 1000$+400$ direct flight from madrid+ food/taxis/dates/ expenses id say another 1000$ aprox.

Never? Are was it different 10 years ago?(married to a 9)
The sponsored girls who are 9's and 10's(if sponsored) don't even go the the same places that foreigners go to. They live far from the center and are driven/drive to restaurant/clubs that the mainstream doesn't know about.In Kiev these places are on the outskirts of the city further than the last metro stops because the real rich live in big homes!(their center flats are used for cheating)

If I was ever single I WOULD buy /rent a Euro renovated flat in a decent sized city and buy a BMW/Mercedes. Doesn't have to be new. i would play the mini Oligarch game.(think Akula mentioned its common in Moscow). I would even stop and pick up chicks who are hitching a ride.

[Greek kamaki]

You can in my opinion bang 9's in Ukraine if you push the appropriate cash.For sure many girls in D'Lux etc are available. The problem is the country does not have many '9s per se.
If you are on budget fucking such high caliber women is mission impossible.You feel instantly in Kiev every time you date 9's that the requirements are high.

[Akula]

(08-15-2013 12:21 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

(08-15-2013 11:47 AM)Prosal Wrote:  

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets.

9's and 10's don't walk in FSU (and even if they sometimes walk, they certainly don't give a flying shit about sex-hungry cheap tourists on a two weeks sex vacations). They ride in style in the Porsche Cayenne, the Audi Q7 or the Bentley Continental GTs of their local sponsors.

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

U catch them ungarded,

It's not constructive to overhype a destination. In Ukraine, sex-weaned tourists don't score 9s or 10s, period. Especially the tourists who have a budget of 50$/day.

(08-10-2013 02:47 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 20 days apartment. 1000$+400$ direct flight from madrid+ food/taxis/dates/ expenses id say another 1000$ aprox.

Never? Are was it different 10 years ago?(married to a 9)
The sponsored girls who are 9's and 10's(if sponsored) don't even go the the same places that foreigners go to. They live far from the center and are driven/drive to restaurant/clubs that the mainstream doesn't know about.In Kiev these places are on the outskirts of the city further than the last metro stops because the real rich live in big homes!(their center flats are used for cheating)

If I was ever single I WOULD buy /rent a Euro renovated flat in a decent sized city and buy a BMW/Mercedes. Doesn't have to be new. i would play the mini Oligarch game.(think Akula mentioned its common in Moscow). I would even stop and pick up chicks who are hitching a ride.

RE BMW/Mercedes 'minigarch' game yeah that works but u can also just get a driver and have him do the trolling for you! My friend's old driver did that. Think you can get a driver with a decently nice car here in Moscow for like $1500-2500 a month depending on how much you use him. I know that's not cheap but if you're working here it can be worth it - u can share too. I would assume in a smaller town there won't be as many drivers out there though so probably would need to buy the car. Driving is insane in Moscow and I wouldn't really want to do too much of it hence the driver option.

RE the 'sponsored' 9s and 10s yeah good luck gaming/banging those girls unless you've got serious cash to throw around (and some ok game too). They have perfected how to find dudes who are rich and can sniff out posers pretty quickly. Expectations are huge and there are enough rich guys around to keep these girls shooting for the stars. Just not even worth it IMO for the average guy with game. Had a conversation with Slubu's buddy tonight where we were discussing this topic and we basically both agreed those girls are either unworkable or just too much effort/expense at this point given the dynamics in Moscow.

[worldwidetraveler]

(08-15-2013 12:21 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

If I was ever single I WOULD buy /rent a Euro renovated flat in a decent sized city and buy a BMW/Mercedes. Doesn't have to be new. i would play the mini Oligarch game.(think Akula mentioned its common in Moscow). I would even stop and pick up chicks who are hitching a ride.

What city would you set up shop? Oilgarch and photography game would be killer combination. All Russian women can't get enough of cameras. hah

[BCZalgyris]

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets. U catch them ungarded, with their defenses and bitchshireld off. If you do a direct approach youd already have value on their eyes for your confidence and decosiveness. Ive closed girls on the street that literally told me that they would have blown me away at a bar for sure..

Above is a beta statement. There are no 10s in this world, all women have their imperfections. (although I did meet a 9.5 Asian once in Warsaw, PL and took her out on a date).

So, let's concentrate on the 9s and 9.5s in Kiev, UA. I was there both in March and July of this year. 80% of my game was night game and I was approaching more at every club than just about any guy there (both foreign & local). Never did I get more than a dance from a 9. Actually, at Arena night club I approached a young Claudia Schiffer look a like doing a cocky-funny routine and was still "blown out" as she pretended to not understand me even though I speak advanced Russian and my wingman confirmed that my jokes were "top notch" and I was exhibiting positive vibe. I even had the attention of a couple other girls within ear-shot. Other times I approached 9s at clubs they showed little interest other than giving me direct "yes/no" answers and body language was whack.

I think it is very difficult, more so in Kiev than just about any large US city to pull a 9. First of all many of them as Akula mentioned have sponsors, or have been cheated/pushed around/flaked on by foreign guys and are very suspicious. I think meeting them is really only possible through pure luck or via social circle game or if you're "in the industry", i.e., work/have connection(s) at the club. On top of that multiple dates are a must and "money game" will have to be played...forget about the walk around дружвa арка and an ice-cream date...these girls will have to be wined and dined and even then it won't be enough as they've seen it all, so you better have some original/unique places selected for your date to make a lasting impression. Also, as other posters have mentioned on here "sex-tourist" vibe works against every foreigner now in UA so you better be there for 3 weeks or so. I have failed several times in the past as both my trips were only for 1-2 weeks at a time

"You can in my opinion bang 9's in Ukraine if you push the appropriate cash.For sure many girls in D'Lux etc are available. The problem is the country does not have many '9s per se."

@GreekKamaki I totally disagree with that line. Next to Vegas I saw the highest number of 9s in my life in Kiev clubs. Perhaps you went to Kiev during a snowstorm or were wearing very dark sunglasses if you are saying that...LoL

[jimukr104]

^^^
@worldwidetraveler
I would pick a city between 400k -1 million , with lots of ladas. Either get an old BMW(maybe 10k?) or another modern non FSU car. Yes I would have camera equip.
Any time I saw a hot chick trying to pull a car or standing at a bus stop I would stop and ask gdye?
Charge her the normal amount(she gets ride in better car) and chat her up. Girls there all want BF'S who have cars. Less than 5% have cars in provinces and rarely young guys.
But if we were a group we can rent /lease a car.
Showing a women you have a car eliminates the sex tourist vibe. Another thing you can do is have a little dog or CAT (yes they like this)and walk em on a leash. Girls will stop and you can chat them up , they will know you live there. You an technically rent/buy exotic animal(monkey) and use that game.
I new a guy who had a small dog but he said the chicks liked the dog and not him, but he spoke no Russian, no game and had no money.
maybe you guys could tell me the idea game that eliminates the sex tourist thing. i thought i would just show them my permanent residency papers?
Going around saying skolka ?skolka? never fails lol.
That being said I think when among English speaking Russians it might be better to not speak Russian. I think Nomad was right, often the ones who want foreigners want a FOREIGNER not a guy with Russian roots. I think looking back that hurt me sometimes. I passed the shit test though'why you here?' My russkaya dusha seeks it counterpart!

[BCZalgyris]

(08-15-2013 08:22 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

^^^
@worldwidetraveler
I would pick a city between 400k -1 million , with lots of ladas. Either get an old BMW(maybe 10k?) or another modern non FSU car. Yes I would have camera equip.
Any time I saw a hot chick trying to pull a car or standing at a bus stop I would stop and ask gdye?
Charge her the normal amount(she gets ride in better car) and chat her up. Girls there all want BF'S who have cars. Less than 5% have cars in provinces and rarely young guys.
But if we were a group we can rent /lease a car.
Showing a women you have a car eliminates the sex tourist vibe. Another thing you can do is have a little dog or CAT (yes they like this)and walk em on a leash. Girls will stop and you can chat them up , they will know you live there. You an technically rent/buy exotic animal(monkey) and use that game.
I new a guy who had a small dog but he said the chicks liked the dog and not him, but he spoke no Russian, no game and had no money.
maybe you guys could tell me the idea game that eliminates the sex tourist thing. i thought i would just show them my permanent residency papers?
Going around saying skolka ?skolka? never fails lol.
That being said I think when among English speaking Russians it might be better to not speak Russian. I think Nomad was right, often the ones who want foreigners want a FOREIGNER not a guy with Russian roots. I think looking back that hurt me sometimes. I passed the shit test though'why you here?' My russkaya dusha seeks it counterpart!

Good point Jim, that is exactly what is happening to me when I visit FSU. I actually feel like I need to start speaking more English and less Russian, perhaps then I will be viewed as being more exotic. A couple times I mentioned being born in FSU and instead of creating interest it was the opposite, I could actually feel a "cold breeze". Now, whenever a local girl asks about my background I just lie and say I am from NYC and studied Russian for 4 years in college. Funnily enough when I was in several minor confrontations in Kiev bars mentioning that I was from an FSU country deflated the tention's whereas if I was passing myself as an American tended to escalate them...go figure, perhaps the local gopnicks were jealous of my game...LoL

[ChrisGambi]

Pro is 100% correct, 7.5 you need table at top club, russian, locals to give you cred, be somewhat caucasian, wellkept, age irrelevant within reason, go there without snl mindset

[paninaro]

(08-10-2013 02:47 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

i find daygame much more profitable in terms of results. I did go out one night with a friend and the language was a problem. Id say that 50/60% of the girls dont speak english.

Great post about Kiev and sounds like you had fun (and a bit of drama). You sound like a real master of day game. Approximately how many approaches did you do per day? I admire your persistence!

[Thespaniard]

Prosal: "9's and 10's don't walk in FSU (and even if they sometimes walk, they certainly don't give a flying shit about sex-hungry cheap tourists on a two weeks sex vacations). They ride in style in the Porsche Cayenne, the Audi Q7 or the Bentley Continental GTs of their local sponsors.

It's not constructive to overhype a destination. In Ukraine, sex-weaned tourists don't score 9s or 10s, period. Especially the tourists who have a budget of 50$/day.""

Obvioulsy we all know the level of difficulty of 9s10s, In Kiev and in any city you can think of. I was speaking generally, actually this trip to Kiev in only interacted with one girl of this quality and didn´t even number close her. In my experience it gets much harder to game those girls in clubs. They know they are the prize, the center of atention and normally tehy wont even give the chance to interact with them. Im not say that i´ve closed many 9s from daygame. Actually I´ve only got lucky once with a model from Lithuania. my game is definately not at that level yet, i´ve been doing daygame for a little more than a year. But I have interacted with many 9s on the streets, a few numbers and dates and they are more accesible than in bars. They have their "normal" persona on, they value your confience for going direct and authenticity (they know they are hot..) and are normally quite sociable because they have high selfesteem and have some degree of worldlyness. Even though most of the times it doesnt go anywhre because almost always they are taken or have sponsors but getting their contanct and playing the long term game can lead to results.

About the 50$ budget, its just an approximate amount. If the quality of the grls demands more i´ll glad to spend it but normally with 7,7´5s i dont think you need more. With 8s I agree that you can invest a higher amount.

Paninaro:""Approximately how many approaches did you do per day?""

Thanks man. Id say along 10/15 approaches per day. I did malls and streets. But I definately dont consider myself a master, id say im at a good intermediate level. I love daygame and I´m willing to keep up the practice and continue developing my game.

BCZalgyris """ I actually feel like I need to start speaking more English and less Russian"""


As for the topic about speaking the language i´ve decided learning Rusky. I´ve lost many girls due to the language and after tasting the FSU wonders next sring/summer I wanna have a long trip there and fully enjoy all its has to offer. I found surprising that statement. I guess that its true with girls that speak english and might even wanna practice their skills and feel their having a more exotic experience but If you stumble upon a non english speaker it will definatley keep the ball rolling..

[JohnQPublic]

(08-16-2013 05:07 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Prosal: "9's and 10's don't walk in FSU (and even if they sometimes walk, they certainly don't give a flying shit about sex-hungry cheap tourists on a two weeks sex vacations). They ride in style in the Porsche Cayenne, the Audi Q7 or the Bentley Continental GTs of their local sponsors.

It's not constructive to overhype a destination. In Ukraine, sex-weaned tourists don't score 9s or 10s, period. Especially the tourists who have a budget of 50$/day.""

Obvioulsy we all know the level of difficulty of 9s10s, In Kiev and in any city you can think of. I was speaking generally, actually this trip to Kiev in only interacted with one girl of this quality and didn´t even number close her. In my experience it gets much harder to game those girls in clubs. They know they are the prize, the center of atention and normally tehy wont even give the chance to interact with them. Im not say that i´ve closed many 9s from daygame. Actually I´ve only got lucky once with a model from Lithuania. my game is definately not at that level yet, i´ve been doing daygame for a little more than a year. But I have interacted with many 9s on the streets, a few numbers and dates and they are more accesible than in bars. They have their "normal" persona on, they value your confience for going direct and authenticity (they know they are hot..) and are normally quite sociable because they have high selfesteem and have some degree of worldlyness. Even though most of the times it doesnt go anywhre because almost always they are taken or have sponsors but getting their contanct and playing the long term game can lead to results.

About the 50$ budget, its just an approximate amount. If the quality of the grls demands more i´ll glad to spend it but normally with 7,7´5s i dont think you need more. With 8s I agree that you can invest a higher amount.

It's harder to get 9+ because they think they know that every guy wants them. Every 9 or better I've got in Prague has told me some variation of "no guy has ever refused me" or "i walk down the street and I know every guy wants it". So the only way to have a chance in a club is for you to be her "type" and good at begging, or for her to not be sure you are interested. The hard thing is to become the subject of her attention without her thinking she is the subject of yours. Since most guys stare at them for awhile before doing anything, they are already toast. One good example was a girl I knew when I first got to Prague (her CV made her a 10 much more than sitting in $100k cars would). She used to hang out at my place a lot, and at the time, I had a roommate who she decided must be gay (because he was really shy and wouldn't look at her). So she was always talking about getting in his bed to see if he could do anything. She talked about this a *lot* . This is the mentality.

But I've done OK with this in Kiev. I only went out 3 nights there, but one Sunday night in Vodka Bar I met a girl home for a few weeks from working for Elite Models in Milan. I suspected she was just out for free drinks, but it was my first night and she was pretty interesting. At the end of the night I just had her phone number, but never got to meet her again.

The other best strategy, or probably the best, for meeting the top girls is just to have another one with you. I tried to get this going when I was at Buddha Bar in Kiev. After 2 or 3 girls propositioned me to go with them for $300 or more, I decided I needed to bounce immediately and I spent the rest of the time trying to convince one of the hotter ones to go to DeLuxe with me, because she would have more prospects there, but no dice. But the idea was to get her to walk around with me for long enough for the 9s, etc to notice us together.

In Buddha bar I did get the phone number off an 8 Russian lawyer. She initially wanted $350/hour and was telling me she was saving money to start a business, she didn't want to go to a club with me and I thought there was something different about her, so I told her if she was a good businesswoman she would give me her number and tell me to call when I needed her. She just looked at me and walked away, but came up and gave it to me when she saw me leaving. I didnt plan to use it, but after the police shook me down for money one night, I didn't want to go out anymore so I called her and she ended up coming over and staying all night for less than her hour price. Then her next offer was to meet in Prague for free if I paid the ticket, but I screwed that up ...

What is a sex-weaned tourist?

[Prosal]

(08-16-2013 05:07 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Prosal: About the 50$ budget, its just an approximate amount. If the quality of the grls demands more i´ll glad to spend it but normally with 7,7´5s i dont think you need more. With 8s I agree that you can invest a higher amount.

There are many types of female in Kiev in different social classes, and some require more lubrication than others. Lubrication isn't necessarily in the form of luxury or gifts or expensive restaurants, romance and personality go far...... and especially experience and intelligence. But when a girl, even if she is just a 7+ with no materialistic expectations, shows up at the date perfectly dressed with her most glam high-heels, her most sexy dress, with perfect hair and make-up, perfect manucures and not an eyelash out of place, don't you want to treat her ? .....personally, when a girl shows up well-groomed, I take it as sign of respect, and I also want to respect her, and pay tribute to her efforts and her feminity. I certainly won't take her eat vobla and drink beer from the bottle in the park. I want to take her to a nice and romantic cafe where we'll get drunk on good wine. Just to say that if I don't have at least 150 €/day to spend for dates, dinners, drinks in clubs, ect (and in Kiev 150 €/day don't take you far, that is about what I spend in Tashkent which is three times cheaper), I stay home. Being cheap takes you nowhere in FSU. If you don't respect women and see them only from a "what can I get from her (sex) for the lowest expenses" perspective, they'll show you no respect either.

[jimukr104]

Spaniard I will try to explain.
I don't speak only basic Russian. I also have a NYC Accent so when o attempted approaches in russian they know we aren't local. So let's think how she thinks.
Very rarely a westerner speaks Russian so what am I? I have dark features so they will think Georgian, Armenian, Bulgarian, Italian, and maybe a white Turk. They actually love the dark look of Armenians, and Italians but for reasons we know don't want Turks and Italians and spaniards are known sex tourists. So it can fuck me up.
Before I open my mouth they think I am Russian/ukrainain. Nordic and mediteraneans actually classically are very similar. Deep set eyes , oval faces. A Slav is a mix of that. So for me how I sound when I open my mouth determines alot.
Then there is the added problem when they find out how I learned russain. Having a ,as prosal says, russkaya dushka can put me on the slow track. Seriously. They see me as breeding material and will even bring me home to meet mom. I was invited to family dachas, after meeting invited home for mom to cook for me,etc. I even had a parent a few times try set me up. I could have maybe avoided that by saying ' my name is Kevin kevin from la and I am a visiting tourist'.
When they think you have a Russian soul or BLOOD you often become boring to the Anglo lovers and if they like you it's because they want you to be BF who is LTR material and want to be won over.
Interestingly, partizan and prosal are correct knowing a bit of culture goes a long way......as long as they don't see you as someone who is of the culture. Another thing I experienced were chicks who thought I was bad to date because I was living there. They actually thought I would , because of BLOOD become like another local guy. Tragedy is part of the culture.
My own wife always says everyone thinks I am russian until I open my mouth. She also was warned by family that I might be a playboy due to my young age and good looks. That's another point I once mentioned. Maybe it's different with the new generation who grew up with Hollywood buy Fsu girls are actually against and scared of really good-looking guys. Makes sense in a culture where women believe they are the ones who must be the beauty in the couple(beauty for a fsu girl is a manly guy, big features, not brad Pitt pretty boys).
This is one of the reasons the forum members who have fsu ancestry like wolverine and oldnemisis knew DEB was making crap up. If he really looked like a model he would actually be doing worst than the non models. His height would be his only asset(tall is good).
I know a young guy in NYC who actually is a model and he has trouble meeting fsu girls in Brooklyn who want that. I told him he would better of lying and mentioning a more manly livelihood.
But I admit I really can't say how 16-21 year olds behave now. The ones I dated have aged and every generation has it's own idols to worship. Even my wife says the young ones today act flaky. I once Mentioned Here I find 15-17 year old fsu chicks to be more mature than thec18-22 year old ones. University chicks every where are at an age where they live in a fantasy world. I don't find them any different NYC or Kiev.

My advice open In English then go to Russian if needed. It also makes it easier for her to ask 'where are u from?'. This is better than her thinking in her mind trying to guess. She will end up guessing based on her experience. Means polish,Turkish and more less desirable countries.

[Greek kamaki]

(08-15-2013 08:20 PM)BCZalgyris Wrote:  

(08-15-2013 10:37 AM)Thespaniard Wrote:  

Well, 9s and 10s are much more approachable and fríendly on the streets. U catch them ungarded, with their defenses and bitchshireld off. If you do a direct approach youd already have value on their eyes for your confidence and decosiveness. Ive closed girls on the street that literally told me that they would have blown me away at a bar for sure..

Above is a beta statement. There are no 10s in this world, all women have their imperfections. (although I did meet a 9.5 Asian once in Warsaw, PL and took her out on a date).

So, let's concentrate on the 9s and 9.5s in Kiev, UA. I was there both in March and July of this year. 80% of my game was night game and I was approaching more at every club than just about any guy there (both foreign & local). Never did I get more than a dance from a 9. Actually, at Arena night club I approached a young Claudia Schiffer look a like doing a cocky-funny routine and was still "blown out" as she pretended to not understand me even though I speak advanced Russian and my wingman confirmed that my jokes were "top notch" and I was exhibiting positive vibe. I even had the attention of a couple other girls within ear-shot. Other times I approached 9s at clubs they showed little interest other than giving me direct "yes/no" answers and body language was whack.

I think it is very difficult, more so in Kiev than just about any large US city to pull a 9. First of all many of them as Akula mentioned have sponsors, or have been cheated/pushed around/flaked on by foreign guys and are very suspicious. I think meeting them is really only possible through pure luck or via social circle game or if you're "in the industry", i.e., work/have connection(s) at the club. On top of that multiple dates are a must and "money game" will have to be played...forget about the walk around дружвa арка and an ice-cream date...these girls will have to be wined and dined and even then it won't be enough as they've seen it all, so you better have some original/unique places selected for your date to make a lasting impression. Also, as other posters have mentioned on here "sex-tourist" vibe works against every foreigner now in UA so you better be there for 3 weeks or so. I have failed several times in the past as both my trips were only for 1-2 weeks at a time

"You can in my opinion bang 9's in Ukraine if you push the appropriate cash.For sure many girls in D'Lux etc are available. The problem is the country does not have many '9s per se."

@GreekKamaki I totally disagree with that line. Next to Vegas I saw the highest number of 9s in my life in Kiev clubs. Perhaps you went to Kiev during a snowstorm or were wearing very dark sunglasses if you are saying that...LoL

I was talking about Ukraine as a whole.D"Lux has a high concentration of 9s due to face control for femakes but this is not representative of the country.Ukraine has a low proportion of 9"s.

[Prosal]

(08-16-2013 11:07 AM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

a bit of culture goes a long way

+1. Many guys don't understand how a bit of cultural knowledge is important when dealing with russian/ukrainian girls. They think they gonna just show up, flash their US or EU passport, and have access to the hottest girls.

Vorkuta said it better that i could ever do:

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-25383-...#pid483122