[Keyser Söze]

So, I saw this on wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Ferriss#Career

"Prior to his writing career, Ferriss claimed that he became the national champion in the 1999 USAWKF Sanshou (Chinese kickboxing) championship through a process of shoving opponents out of the ring and by starving himself before weign in to compete several classes below his actual weight, although this has never been verified and no public record of this event exists.[13]In fact, the news and results section of the 1999 USAWKK webpage reveals no mention at all of Tim Ferriss competing in any of their tournaments.[14] Likewise, an extensive archive of results in a variety of Chinese kickboxing disciplines, dating from 1999 to present, reveals no mention of Tim Ferriss.[15]"

What gives? I did some googling and couldn't find anything about him and kickboxing that wasn't written by him or citing him or someone who had cited him as their source.

I then looked up that company Brain Quicken he had I read about in the 4 hr work week and saw this :


Since Ferriss says in his book that he set up the company in less than 2 weeks with $5k of credit card debt, I am guessing the numbers in that ad are completely made up. Also, which world champions? Lol. On the four hour body he also says that he personally trains champion athletes (which?) and gained 28 pounds of muscle in 30 days with 4 hrs of gym time and no steroids, which is of course not possible.

I'm not hating though. In fact, I am seeking to apply some of the lessons his own success demonstrates as I do a major redesign of my ecommerce website this week.

[speakeasy]

I have the feeling there is a lot of B.S. he pushes. Not to say that some of the general principals he preaches aren't sound, but you can bet there's a lot of embellishment in his books too, if not outright lies. 28lbs of muscle in a month with no roids? Yeah fucking right....

[NuMbEr7]

People want quick fixes and therefore buy his products because he offers things such as gaining 28 pounds of muscle in one month

[Keyser Söze]

(05-30-2012 02:05 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

I have the feeling there is a lot of B.S. he pushes. Not to say that some of the general principals he preaches aren't sound, but you can bet there's a lot of embellishment in his books too, if not outright lies. 28lbs of muscle in a month with no roids? Yeah fucking right....

Exactly. I have experience with exercise, bodybuilding, and steroids, but no longer because of a back injury.

First off, when you go for mass there will always be a lot of fat and water gain. That is why you will hear lifters/steroid users talking about mass/bulk cycles, alternated with cutting cycles before competition.

Even for an obese glutton, to put on 34lbs of weight of any kind in a month is difficult.

Now, I highly doubt this could happen, but I suppose it could be possible for a top level professional athlete, depending on where he started from, to gain 34 lbs of lean mass in month. But this would assume that he was training all out Ivan Drago style with a team of nutritionists and a personal endocrinologist to inject him with the finest pharmaceutical grade steroids, the kind of stuff Lance Armstrong gets.

As far as pure muscle mass (which you cannot exactly measure anyway), there is not a single human being in the world who could gain 34 lbs in a month under any conditions. Even 10 would be truly extraordinary.

And yet Tim Ferriss, whose athletic claim to fame is winning an imaginary martial arts tournament somehow pulls this off?

And only working out for a TOTAL of 4 hours???

Here is his response - http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/200...n-4-weeks/

If you look at the pictures it looks like he gained about 4 or 5 lbs of muscle and about 29 lbs of water and fat.

He also manipulates the appearance of the pictures by tanning and I would suspect image editing.

Reading the comments is interesting. Of course there are some people who realize it is a total farce. Of course there are some comments that are positive and likely written by TF or one of his virtual assistants, but there are LOTS that defend him and say it works and I don't think they are all fakes as the writing style differs.

This is really interesting. I am trying to better understand how stupid people think.

[Moma]

I've been working out for years (natural) and I have good genes. It's because of this, I can't bear to pick up any of Tim Ferris stuff. I can't afford to put any more junk in my brain sometimes I weep personally at all the useless trivia floating inside there.

[Blackhawk]

I'd put Ferris more at the "excited dilettante" level. He rushes in, does a bunch of research, tries a bunch of shit, spews it all out into another chapter for his next book, and once it's in the can, rushes off to the next distraction.

If an out of shape male age 18-35 follows the Starting Strength routine while on the GOMAD diet gaining 24lbs of muscle in 31 days seems reasonable. Painful. But reasonable. And no, they still won't be able to deadlift twice their weight at the end.

Ferris' understanding of Crossfit training though is frankly confused. It's a lot more than just kettle bells. For most people crossfit is 3 hours a week, and it still kicks your ass.

Mankind has evolved to lose muscle mass during times of inactivity (ie Winter and famines) to reduce their daily metabolic calorie requirements, allowing them to survive through food shortages. Look at the guys who survive famines: They do so by sitting around doing nothing but breathing and beating their heart, while all muscle bulk is shed as unnecessary daily calorie expenses.

But mankind also quickly gains muscle mass back with exercise and protean availability, preparing us for the field and the forest once Spring returns to better exploit increased food supply.

[WanderingSoul]

I'm a big 4HWW fan, but I take everything Tim Ferriss says with a grain of salt. For me the 4HWW has some great concepts and got me to think about making money in a different way. However, I don't believe everything he wrote in the book and I don't take it 100% to heart.

[AntiTrace]

Ferriss is garbage, Ill say it again:

Cats like this sell dreams, nothing more

[Roosh]

He knows how to market his content. Many people have been positively affected by it. He's not cheating people out of thousands of dollars for a fake service. If you buy his book and don't like it, get a refund.

It's like people asking "Is G Manifesto real?" There is a point where it becomes irrelevant as long as people are being entertained/educated.

[Spike]

Regardless of the things he's telling are true or not or have to be taken with a grain of salt (which i think), the guy inspired me to go on my round the world trip and i will be always be thankful for that.

[Rah]

You have to remember back when the 4HWW first hit 5 years ago the lifestyles he was talking about were not very main stream. The idea that someone could make a living being a "professional blogger" was still something that was making headlines, for example. Ferris brought the location independent lifestyles made possible by the digital age to light for the masses.

Today, a lot of what he talks about seems obvious to anyone that spends much time online. There's still some core concepts that will always be relevant though, such as always finding ways to maximize your per-hour output through automation, outsourcing, and eliminating the non-essential.

[MikeCF]

I'm reminded of the basketball player video. After a great performance, the media was harassing him about missing practice.

"Practice? We're talking about practice?"

Whatever exaggerations Ferris may have made about his past, there is no doubt that he now has a substantial body of (credible) work.

So what's it make the most sense to talk about?

[thegmanifesto]

(05-31-2012 07:14 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

I'm reminded of the basketball player video. After a great performance, the media was harassing him about missing practice.

"Practice? We're talking about practice?"

Whatever exaggerations Ferris may have made about his past, there is no doubt that he now has a substantial body of (credible) work.

So what's it make the most sense to talk about?

Agreed.

The guy is obviously making it happen for himself.

The internet is full of amateur commenters calling people frauds and doubting everything.

However, have you ever noticed that those guys doubting everything have nothing cooking for themselves?

The guys making it happen are to busy making it happen to worry about and doubt other people.

[Keyser Söze]

(05-31-2012 07:14 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

I'm reminded of the basketball player video. After a great performance, the media was harassing him about missing practice.

"Practice? We're talking about practice?"

Whatever exaggerations Ferris may have made about his past, there is no doubt that he now has a substantial body of (credible) work.

So what's it make the most sense to talk about?

1. At this point, most of the stuff in 4HWW is horribly outdated, even though it may be useful as a general primer on business/life to some. Few of the examples he lists of others "muses" are still viable. Trying to use his advice on throwing up a 2 page crapola website for A/B testing just will not work based on current Google adwords and ranking practices.

2. The advice in 4HR Body ranges from a rehash of paleo diet principals, to the recommendation of a vast range of completely unproven supplements that Ferriss has a financial interest in hyping, to absurd and false claims like gaining 34lbs of muscle in a month, some of the worst sex advice I can imagine, etc for over 500 pages.

3. His blog does have some interesting posts, at least when he gets guest posters to write something good.

here is a nice and very funny thread about him on bodybuilding.com, where he gets slammed for what athletes/lifters like to call "bro-science":
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread...101&page=1

[heavy]

I thought about starting a thread "Authors who pay for Amazon reviews?"...but I'd just be starting it by questioning Tim Ferriss, so I tacked it on to this thread.

My question wouldn't be specifically about Tim Ferriss. My question is...Do you guys know of any authors who've paid for Amazon reviews?

I've heard but don't know for sure Ferriss does this. As Roosh states above "He knows how to market his content. Many people have been positively affected by it." The first statement is definitely true, but if he pays for Amazon reviews (more than just giving the book to a few friends/acquaintances free to review), the second statement is, to me, unverified.

[runsonmagic]

All I know is I lost 20 pounds a month when I did the diet from the 4 Hour-Body.

Plus, the recipes in the 4-Hour Chef are delicious. I make at least one meal a week from that book.

I've gotten tons of value from his books.

I think the reason he gets hate is that he is incredibly transparent in the shortcuts he takes. For example, he publicly and proudly states his kickboxing knockouts were achieved by dehydrating himself before weigh-in so he had +15 pounds on all his competitors, and then just shoved them out of the ring. Won every match on a technical KO.

His philosophy is all about hacks and taking shortcuts whenever possible, so for those with a Puritan work ethic who believe you have to always do things the hard way, or who've spent years struggling with a particular topic, I could see it being incredibly infuriating.

But don't knock all his advice till you've tried it. Worked great for me.

[VincentVinturi]

If it weren't for The 4 Hour Workweek, I'd be serving as a grunt somewhere in the US Army right now instead of living in Thailand, working online, and fornicating with more beautiful women than I ever dreamed.

That's because I actually joined the army, then read the book, then immediately started my online business while on a 'last hurrah' trip to Nicaragua and then unjoined right before I was supposed to ship to basic (which is when your ass officially and irrevocably belongs to uncle Sam).

Tim's a brilliant marketer and inspired a lot of people to take their balls in their hands and carve out the kind of life they envision.

The only annoying thing about his approach is the gross oversimplifications and poor expectation management. Hack this, hack that. Outsource everything. Learn Mandarin in a week in between blowjobs from your virtual assistant. Launch an online business selling yoga DVDs in 7 days -- no, 7 hours! -- and go to Bali for a month while you rake in 10k in sales auto-magically...



I've only met a small handful of financially successful people who actually work anywhere *close* to that little, and it's more like 20 hours a week. Which probably sounds pretty damn leisurely to most of the guys on this forum.

But ALL of them spent YEARS busting their asses, growing their business and making connections before they got their big payday. OR they grew their business to a point where it was semi-automated and profitable enough to leave it alone some of the time.

[Maciano]

I dig Tim Ferriss' approach to life. He's over-selling a lot of self-help stuff, but who cares?

Take this short essay for a second, that's just great stuff for any guy thinking of some side income.
http://fourhourworkweek.com/2011/09/24/h...hihuahuas/

Anyway, even if I use 10% of his insights I benefit, that's more than I can say from most intellectuals. I also think Ferriss is highly skilled as a marketer. Just watching him promote and talk is a lesson in itself. His Joe Rogan interviews are worth listening to, btw, very talkative, experienced guy.

[Quintus Curtius]

(04-30-2014 03:01 PM)Maciano Wrote:  

I dig Tim Ferriss' approach to life. He's over-selling a lot of self-help stuff, but who cares?

Take this short essay for a second, that's just great stuff for any guy thinking of some side income.
http://fourhourworkweek.com/2011/09/24/h...hihuahuas/

Anyway, even if I use 10% of his insights I benefit, that's more than I can say from most intellectuals. I also think Ferriss is highly skilled as a marketer. Just watching him promote and talk is a lesson in itself. His Joe Rogan interviews are worth listening to, btw, very talkative, experienced guy.

_______________

I mostly disagree with you, Maciano.

Yes, he does have some good "big picture" philosophy about enjoying your time and life now, and not waiting for "retirement". And maybe for this alone it's worth listening to his pep talks.

But there's just so much filler in his books that you have to ask whether they're worth it.

Matt Forney did a great takedown of Ferris last year on ROK. Read it here if you have not yet:

http://www.returnofkings.com/7844/are-yo...riss-wheel

[Maciano]

(04-30-2014 03:07 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

(04-30-2014 03:01 PM)Maciano Wrote:  

I dig Tim Ferriss' approach to life. He's over-selling a lot of self-help stuff, but who cares?

Take this short essay for a second, that's just great stuff for any guy thinking of some side income.
http://fourhourworkweek.com/2011/09/24/h...hihuahuas/

Anyway, even if I use 10% of his insights I benefit, that's more than I can say from most intellectuals. I also think Ferriss is highly skilled as a marketer. Just watching him promote and talk is a lesson in itself. His Joe Rogan interviews are worth listening to, btw, very talkative, experienced guy.

_______________

I mostly disagree with you, Maciano.

Yes, he does have some good "big picture" philosophy about enjoying your time and life now, and not waiting for "retirement". And maybe for this alone it's worth listening to his pep talks.

But there's just so much filler in his books that you have to ask whether they're worth it.

Matt Forney did a great takedown of Ferris last year on ROK. Read it here if you have not yet:

http://www.returnofkings.com/7844/are-yo...riss-wheel

There's nothing in Forney's critique I disagree with. The 4H-so&so is just marketing. I skip his stuff on tangos or 2 weeks to learn Italian. And I don't believe Ferriss ever worked less than four hours per week his entire life, either.

But Ferriss does teach how to learn through practice. You can take what you can use or skip the dude.

[RexImperator]

To me, it sounds rather like circular reasoning, kind of like this:

"Here is a location-independent business idea: create a website and sell e-books to people on how they can set up a location-independent business."

[RockHard]

(04-30-2014 03:28 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

To me, it sounds rather like circular reasoning, kind of like this:

"Here is a location-independent business idea: create a website and sell e-books to people on how they can set up a location-independent business."

From what I've seen, there's more money in selling people a kit telling them how to be a millionaire than in following the advice in the kit.

But passive income is real. Like VincentVinturi said, it just takes a lot of hard work to get to where you can afford to work a 4 hour work week. You aren't likely to get it by buying a book and throwing together a website. You'll have 5 or 6 tries and spend a few years before you figure out how to do it.

[Joga Bonito]

(04-30-2014 02:19 PM)heavy Wrote:  

I thought about starting a thread "Authors who pay for Amazon reviews?"...but I'd just be starting it by questioning Tim Ferriss, so I tacked it on to this thread.

My question wouldn't be specifically about Tim Ferriss. My question is...Do you guys know of any authors who've paid for Amazon reviews?

I've heard but don't know for sure Ferriss does this. As Roosh states above "He knows how to market his content. Many people have been positively affected by it." The first statement is definitely true, but if he pays for Amazon reviews (more than just giving the book to a few friends/acquaintances free to review), the second statement is, to me, unverified.

I don't know for sure if they bought reviews, but I've seen authors that have ton of positive reviews from people that didn't make verified purchases, much less have verified names, and usually had a limited review history that only included products from that respective author. This would definitely suggest some foul play. With this in mind, a good practice is to read the negative reviews and make up your mind how valid the criticisms are. A lot of people are definitely selling snake oil.

[Suits]

(04-30-2014 02:49 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

If it weren't for The 4 Hour Workweek, I'd be serving as a grunt somewhere in the US Army right now instead of living in Thailand, working online, and fornicating with more beautiful women than I ever dreamed.

That's because I actually joined the army, then read the book, then immediately started my online business while on a 'last hurrah' trip to Nicaragua and then unjoined right before I was supposed to ship to basic (which is when your ass officially and irrevocably belongs to uncle Sam).

Tim's a brilliant marketer and inspired a lot of people to take their balls in their hands and carve out the kind of life they envision.

The only annoying thing about his approach is the gross oversimplifications and poor expectation management. Hack this, hack that. Outsource everything. Learn Mandarin in a week in between blowjobs from your virtual assistant. Launch an online business selling yoga DVDs in 7 days -- no, 7 hours! -- and go to Bali for a month while you rake in 10k in sales auto-magically...



I've only met a small handful of financially successful people who actually work anywhere *close* to that little, and it's more like 20 hours a week. Which probably sounds pretty damn leisurely to most of the guys on this forum.

But ALL of them spent YEARS busting their asses, growing their business and making connections before they got their big payday. OR they grew their business to a point where it was semi-automated and profitable enough to leave it alone some of the time.

[bojangles]

(04-30-2014 02:19 PM)heavy Wrote:  

I thought about starting a thread "Authors who pay for Amazon reviews?"...but I'd just be starting it by questioning Tim Ferriss, so I tacked it on to this thread.

My question wouldn't be specifically about Tim Ferriss. My question is...Do you guys know of any authors who've paid for Amazon reviews?

I've heard but don't know for sure Ferriss does this. As Roosh states above "He knows how to market his content. Many people have been positively affected by it." The first statement is definitely true, but if he pays for Amazon reviews (more than just giving the book to a few friends/acquaintances free to review), the second statement is, to me, unverified.

Yes, I've been paid by many to write reviews on Amazon. I can't reveal who though.