[Roosh]

No more using this number to judge others. While the system was a good indicator of a member's contributions, it has recently become a popularity contest that is creating a lot of tension in the forum. Everyone's worth here is being reduced to a silly digit.

Your prior reps have not been deleted. In the case the system is brought back, you will have your prior points.

[worldwidetraveler]

Oh no, I worked hard for those 2 rep points. haha

Even though I did enjoy some of the rep power trips being displayed, probably a good idea. I noticed when stuff like that is relied on too heavily it ends up being abused.

Either way, this is the best forum out there. Thanks for all the hard work Roosh. I know running a successful forum can be a bitch.

[MiXX]

(03-06-2012 09:59 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

No more using this number to judge others.

Seriously?

I don't see how this is the case. If its a popularity contest, so what? This is suppose to be fun, and real life game is all about how popular you are anyway. So, a few bruised egos from members with lower rep points make you go and cut the whole thing out? Psssh

Roosh, those of us that have the highest counts are the ones who make the most valuable contributions, and it's the only "recognition/reward" we get here for our time and incredible knowledge we share, and now you take that away? Why do I suddenly feel like I am being slapped in the face for being the highest rep'd member instead of rewarded?

With all due respect, this is your forum, and you'll run it as you please, I know that all too well, but by taking the rep point system away, then there is really no more need for me to continue contributing and just remain a lurker and data mine the forum for my own selfish needs like lurkers with 0 rep points do.


yeah, maybe I'll get banned for posting this, but hey, I stand-up for what I believe in to be truly unjust and unfair no matter what the consequences are.


Until the rep system is reinstated, Mixx will not make anymore contributions or answer any questions related to game/advice. I will eventually lose my membership on this forum as a result likely, so be it.

Mixx

[Roosh]

I find it hard to believe that you need a number to feel worthy or recognized instead of the many replies and praise you get for your contributions.

If the only reason any member is contributing is to get a "rep point" instead of learning, sharing, and connecting with others, then maybe they should re-evaluate their reasons for being here. This isn't high school.

[Screwston]

[MiXX]

(03-06-2012 10:23 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

If the only reason any member is contributing is to get a "rep point" instead of learning, sharing, and connecting with others, then maybe they should re-evaluate their reasons for being here. This isn't high school.

Oh c'mon man...you're right, this is not HIgh School. This is RVF, where knowledge is power, but there is not a soul on earth who does not like to be recognized for their efforts. You are getting more than recognition for your efforts on this forum and books, you are getting $$$.

I have been one to coach guys here for free!!! So, saying that I post to get rep points for self-worth is absurd!

I'm out....

Mixx

[Moma]

(03-06-2012 10:30 AM)MiXX Wrote:  

(03-06-2012 10:23 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

If the only reason any member is contributing is to get a "rep point" instead of learning, sharing, and connecting with others, then maybe they should re-evaluate their reasons for being here. This isn't high school.

Oh c'mon man...you're right, this is not HIgh School. This is RVF, where knowledge is power, but there is not a soul on earth who does not like to be recognized for their efforts. I have been one to coach guys here for free!!! So, saying that I post to get rep points is absurd!

I'm out....

Mixx

Come on Mixx, you know we luv you, bro, I wasn't doing too bad on points myself and I got shanked like the rest!

Before you leave, send me your email or MSN or something because I will be in the Florida region and I wouldn't mind flexing wit you from time to time.
Peace.

[Roosh]

Mixx: With all due respect, this forum is not about any one man. My name is on the thing but it easily can go on without me.

I do what's in the best interest of the forum, not specific members, including myself.

I know you're upset right now, but in time I'm sure you'll see this as the right decision for an open, active community.

[Mr.GM]

(03-06-2012 10:30 AM)MiXX Wrote:  

(03-06-2012 10:23 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

If the only reason any member is contributing is to get a "rep point" instead of learning, sharing, and connecting with others, then maybe they should re-evaluate their reasons for being here. This isn't high school.

Oh c'mon man...you're right, this is not HIgh School. This is RVF, where knowledge is power, but there is not a soul on earth who does not like to be recognized for their efforts. You are getting more than recognition for your efforts on this forum and books, you are getting $$$.

I have been one to coach guys here for free!!! So, saying that I post to get rep points for self-worth is absurd!

I'm out....

Mixx

Roosh , I understand why you did this and you have a point , but I gotta go with Mixx on that one. I mean , I think the rep system was a good indication to know how you are seen by the forum and your history of contributions. If some guys can't take it and are turning this into a senseless contest , I say f* them . Most veterans here were worthy of their points and some new guys here were making solid contributions in a regular basis (think Hencredible Casanova) so the rep system was a good indication of dedication to the community.
anyway , It would be great if you reconsidered this , but either way I trust your decisions and this is a great forum.

[Excelsior]

I'm with MiXX and Mr. GM on this one.

[Roosh]

Mr. Gm: Do you need the rep system to know Hencredible is a great contributor? Or G Manifesto? Or Tuthmosis?

Like any previous change I've made to the forum, I'll evaluate it in time if it was a positive or negative change and then act accordingly.

[SimonRierdon]

Personally, I agree with Roosh on this subject. There's guys who contribute regularly and with valid points that weren't getting their props. Guys like Bronan and I can think of a couple of others. I think that you guys should get your props by how many members comment on your threads or how many post in response to something you've written. Rep points are waaay overrated.

[Hencredible Casanova]

I think the point of the forum is to share experiences and insights so that we can all learn from each other in a reciprocal environment. The rep points aren't why any of us joined and they aren't redeemable for cash. Many longtime members who brought lots of value were "underrepped." That's because the process is completely arbitrary and doesn't require one member to rep another, even if he benefits from that person's contributions. Then, just as now, we all know who the real valuable members are. I think the rep system does more harm than good (in that it maintains egos), and I agree with the decision to have it removed.

[Vicious]

How about replacing the rep system with custom titles?

Some kind of contributor recognition would be useful for weighing people's worth when reading their posts. I agree however that rep points have outlived their usefulness.

[Excelsior]

(03-06-2012 10:44 AM)SimonRierdon Wrote:  

Personally, I agree with Roosh on this subject. There's guys who contribute regularly and with valid points that weren't getting their props. Guys like Bronan and I can think of a couple of others. I think that you guys should get your props by how many members comment on your threads or how many post in response to something you've written. Rep points are waaay overrated.

The thing with the rep system is that it made it very easy to track the most respected posters and the most valuable individual contributions with a click of a button. All I needed to do was click the green number and they were laid out for me. It was as though each member had their own "best of" reference sheet built into their profile.

The addition of the rep tied to specific posts (introduced a few months ago) made this even easier-the most valuable posts were thus easy to access with a couple of clicks, even if they were made a while ago and the thread they were in got buried.

Say what you will, but these things are going to be much harder to track now. Sure, you'll still know whats good to some extent based on responses, but the bests posts/threads are simply not going to be as easy to track as they were before (especially as they get older), nor are the best posters (ex: MiXX) going to be as distinguishable and easy to find for those who'd like to learn from them.

[Mr.GM]

(03-06-2012 10:44 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Mr. Gm: Do you need the rep system to know Hencredible is a great contributor? Or G Manifesto? Or Tuthmosis?

Like any previous change I've made to the forum, I'll evaluate it in time if it was a positive or negative change and then act accordingly.

No , I don't need it. But I can understand that some guys may have less "incentive" to share info since there is no rewarding in doing it. I know, this is somewhat silly , but I think some guys like to earn a "medal" every now and then just as a recognition for their services , even if it doesn't have any "real" value in it. It is not my case , but i guess it is a psychological thing for some , and it would be bad to see valuable players leaving the forum or posting less because of this.
Anyway, like I said I trust your decisions and I know that you are working for the best of the forum.

[Roosh]

Quote:

the most valuable posts were thus easy to access with a couple of clicks

Would creating a "Best Of" forum help counter that... a place where people link individual posts or threads by others that they got a lot of value from.

[Hencredible Casanova]

I agree with Athlone and Mr. GM about having a way to recognize and identify valuable posters. However, I don't think the rep system did a good job at that. A guy could drop one data sheet and receive dozens of rep points while having no other contribution whatsoever, whereas another member could aggregate the same number of rep points by contributing info about many different things over a longer period of time.

I understand the desire some have to be recognized for their contributions, but perhaps we can come up with some other way aside from rep points (i.e. a periodic poll or contest of some sort, or a bestowing of titles as Vicious mentioned).

I think we can all agree that the rep point system was fundamentally flawed.

[stoney]

roosh i support your decision. the dick measuring that was going on about internet points was laughable, and now you get backlash and threats...no "incentive" to share bc you don't get your precious internet point? wtf is that?

"I cried when Roosh took away my internet points. Was this Beta?"

[Excelsior]

(03-06-2012 10:54 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:

the most valuable posts were thus easy to access with a couple of clicks

Would creating a "Best Of" forum help counter that... a place where people link individual posts or threads by others that they got a lot of value from.

Perhaps so.
I'm just saying that one of this forum's most crucial features was the ability for any newb to track and learn from other great posters. Rep points made this happen, while also providing a strong incentive to contribute among the newbs themselves (make a great datasheet right off the bat = more rep).

I understand that system had some flaws, but by getting rid of it we've also eliminated these very large benefits too, benefits that one can contend have played a big role in making the forum as popular as it is. If there is another way to retain those benefits, then fine, but it is in the best interest of the forum to do so at all costs, even if that means bringing the rep system back at some point down the line (modified or otherwise).

[CJ]

(03-06-2012 10:54 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:

the most valuable posts were thus easy to access with a couple of clicks

Would creating a "Best Of" forum help counter that... a place where people link individual posts or threads by others that they got a lot of value from.

I could care less about the "E-recognition" itself, as I can sort the riff-raff from the solid contributors, but the rep points directly linked to the posts they were given for were quite useful.

I just hope Mixx doesn't call it quits here over something so trivial.

[Nonpareil]

I'll just mention that I have never fished for a rep point, nor have I ever given out a rep point; not because people here aren't worthy of it (fine group of guys here), but yeah, I can see how it was kind of devolving into simple score-keeping.

I always figured an option to 'like' posts, like Disqus has, would be a better indicator of user and post quality.

[Basil Ransom]

It's silly, it's stupid, it's irrational. But the reality is that even in the absence of no real reward, we value recognition from the peers we respect, and we will work to get it. The internet is full of ranking systems. Game developers put leaderboards in their games because they know it will motivate people to play more and best everyone else. Without recognition, we may feel that our contributions aren't appreciated, and we will withdraw. Worse, without one, people may feel inclined to make more posts of inferior quality, to boost their post count.

Personally, I was surprised at how well the system has worked on here. Take a look at a site like Bodybuilding.com, and you'll see people scheming endlessly to trade reps, and it becomes a stupid contest. On here, I saw little to none of that behavior.

The Talmud has a good saying on this, "Kinat sofrim tarbeh chochma" - "Jealousy among scholars increases wisdom." One of my friends was very fond of saying this in regards to pussy, as we were always competing on who was getting more

[Kickb]

What ever happened to not giving a fuck.

[Menace]

One of the issues was point inflation. Maybe a quota system of some sort would be better, where either a person could get at most X points in a given time period, or people have only X points to give away in a time period. On the one hand I agree with Roosh, but I also see MiXX's view as well. I'm not sure if an incentive system based purely on altruism is entirely compatible with the player/PUA/game guy mind set.